mldave

On my 86 Toyota truck 4x4 5 speed w/ the 2.4.This morning while turning into a uphill driveway the truck just quit but lights and radio stay on.Starts right up on next attempt.Later in the day while coming out of a coffee shop,no crank,no click..but lights and radio work.A friend came by and I asked for a jump and it started first attempt.A month ago I had the same issue and a friend jumped the battery and it started right up and then he charged the battery for half an hour and I didn't have any more troubles till now.Also a month ago my radio fuse blew and i changed that and about six months ago my push button start that a shop installed for me quit working.I guess that's hooked directly to the starter,bad connections or the button switch died?Not mechanical and half crippled so have to ask friends to help as I'm short of cash...thanks for any replies.

SCLead

You say the truck just quit; did it stall, as in not enough RPM due to uphill and possibly AC given our heat wave this weekend? Or was it cruising comfortably and the engine simply shut off? I know I tend to bog mine down until I get used to the AC-robbed power again at the beginning of each summer.

My first inclination would be to check your starter. In my experience, when starters begin to die, it's very easy to associate totally unrelated issues with the starting problems. There's also usually an exceptionally annoying in-between stage where it works some of the time, but not all the time. One turn of the key might result in nothing, the next turn it fires up like there's no problem. The intermittency of the issue makes it frustrating to pin down and easy to make random associations. Probably pretty unlikely your radio fuse blowing had anything to do with your starting issues.

Did the push button start ever get fixed, or has it been dead for six months? I tend to question any work a shop does, especially if it's already shown issues. If that died once and was repaired, that would be the first place I'd look, chances are if it failed once it'll fail again. Especially if the same guys fixed it. From there, my guess would be starter. I'm not too hip on 22RE's, but I think you can rebuild the starter pretty cheap. No idea how much of a chore it is.

mldave

SCLEAD,don't have a working A/C.The uphill was just a short fifthteen foot jaunt to a shopping center parking lot and when I lost power all the dash lights came on and of course was like there was no power steering.But then it started right back up.Not really knowing anything about mechanics I'm just guessing and throwing out alot of what ifs?The truck just quiting wouldn't have anything to do with the starter? as it's already running,except perhaps something to do with wiring as in the fuse blowing for the radio and the push button starter going out six months earlier?Perhaps the wire going from the push button to the starter is shorting something out?The push button start was not fixed and that was installed about six years ago.

scope103

Wow. It sounds like you've got a bunch of just-get-by additional wiring. Your truck is designed to go it's entire life without ever blowing any fuses, so blowing a radio fuse means you've got something loose that is shorting out. You probably also have something loose in your patched-in push-button start, and something loose elsewhere that causes something to disconnect when you go over a bump (and then reconnect -- this time).

IF you knew a lot about mechanics and automotive electrical, intermittent problems like this can still be very hard to track down and fix. When you can't start it, you could put a multimeter to ground on your solenoid wire, and see if it goes to 12v when the push-button is pushed. The starting problem is probably right there.

The "just quit" problem is going to be a lot tougher to find, and as SCLead says it is almost certainly a DIFFERENT problem than the starting issue.

Good luck!

mldave

Scope 103,,I just removed the push button switch from the dash and see one of the posts in the back has alot of white powder on it.The push button stopped working six months ago or so.Couldn't get the screws off the switch as yet as my hands are messed up.Plan to remove the wires from the switch and tape them off with electrical tape and see if that has any results.Will try and find a buddy to check out the battery and starter grounds if I can locate a volunteer,which might take quite awhile.Not knowing about electricity I'm speculating the push button switch with the white corrosion is shorting something out?

RAD4Runner

I suggest restoring cranking circuit to stock.
"Check GROUNDS" People overuse that phrase. Not only should you check grounds, you should also check positive side of power circuit.
All connections should have bare, shiny metal tightly contacting bare,shiny metal.

SCLead

White corrosion isn't necessarily a sign of a short. Could be moisture, could be a reaction between dissimilar metals if it's cheaply made from whatever nonsense they found in the dumpster. Like RAD4Runner said: I'd remove the switch and go back to stock. When you say you're going to "tape off the wires," that could mean anything from "permanently break the circuit" which obviously won't help, to "tie together a circuit that is supposed to be normally open," which also won't help. Not sure what your knowledge level is, and I'm definitely not trying to condescend, but if you're not certain what you're doing is correct, I'd ask or pay someone else to do it for you. There shouldn't be too much amperage at the starter switch, but it sounds like it was installed by some shade tree folks to begin with, so I wouldn't personally go too far with it before I traced it far enough to be certain what I was playing with.

I agree with Scope, I'm pretty handy with this stuff, and issues like you're describing typically aren't easy for me to track down when I know what I'm looking for. Prioritize dumping the starter button nonsense and going back to stock (even if you have to pay someone to put in a new ignition switch, if the button was a solution for another problem there) and see if it helps. You can check the starter in the meantime/before/after, however it falls on your plate.

You're right though, a dead starter, even a crappy starter button aren't likely to cause your sudden dying issues. Take it to an Autozone or whatever's handy and ask them to test your alternator, I think most places will do this for free, they can test your battery as well. Also check that your battery tie down is secure and you can't move the battery at all, or it could be shorting out against something (honestly unlikely).

mldave

YesterdayI removed the push button and taped off the ends of each wire with black electrical tape.So far,no problems.The push button was installed by a reputable shop,but a friend of mine said they should have added a fuse or fusable link inline.After browsing many sites on line I'm thinking that if the problem comes back that it could be the clutch pedal switch.The battery tested good and everything is tight.The ignition switch was always good and the push button was added because my cold start injector switch/and or injector would make me crank about eight times before it would start..so I didn't want the starter burning out.I also have a toggle switch that bypasses the cold start injector switch.or injector.I don't know which and that has never failed as it fires right up in the mornings.If I could have everything put back to stock or get another truck I would,but the money situation dosen't allow it.I only only bought this truck to use when I was hard rock gold mining and then my body started falling apart,so I had no need for it then.When it cools down weatherwise Ill try and find someone to crawl under the rig and check the grounds.Thanks for the replies.

mldave

Today was a repeat of my first post.The truck died at the exact upward driveway and then was able to restart.Then started up good the rest of theday till it wouldn't start at the coffee shop this afternoon.Same exact scenario as my first post,except now my GPS which is plugged into the cig lighter stopped working.The GPS stopped working after the coffee shop owner jumped started my truck.No money for a mechanic.

RAD4Runner

Starter has absolutely nothing to do with truck just shutting down.

Dave,
Good job getting rid of that Mickey Mouse fix. This is Yotatech, not Disneyland.
I strongly suggest you trace the whole length of the wires connected to the switch. It is added after-market and there could be exposed wires somewhere along that run that causes your fuse to blow. You ABSOLUTELY do not need that pushbutton. It was there because before, people have not realized that OUR cranking circuit was wired wrong. We'll... mine is NOT anymore.
You most likely do not need the bypass for CSI timer switch, either. Inexpensive but thorough maintenance is all you need for that system. All temp senders, AND THEIR MOUNTING need to be cleaned at least every 31 years . The thread on CSI timer switch mounting provides ground to it. If scaled it would cause hard cold start.

Re: not cranking, that can be fixed inexpensively by NOT replacing parts that are not broken in the first place. Toyota components are bullet-proof. The problems arise from poor wiring, and assembly, like this:
Toyota is also the most reputable truck maker. However, it also wired your starter relay wrong at the factory. If made in early 1986, it would also be missing the starter relay. Also wrong.
Does yours have a starter relay? When was it made? Relay location is below...

Won't start as in will not "crank" or will not "VROOM"?

But you have a steel brush? A Battery terminal cleaning brush worth a few bucks? What have you done about our suggestion to clean all your connections, Most especially at the battery?
This test ( HERE ) will let us know whether your starter solenoid and starter are good.
Both of the above will cost next to nothing. These are things that everybody should do to help save money and time.

RAD4Runner

Dave, you also had issue with your cigarette lighter. Pls check the socket and wiring. The wires in the back may have twisted and are shorting against each other.

mldave

It has a starter relay,it was made in the fall of 1985.The battery posts and cables are clean.Wouldn't crank at all in the afternoon,though lights and radio go on..Can't open up your HERE link.The cig lighter and housing are loose,since I could never get the plastic housing back together correctly.The radio is loose as the vertical stud holding it in place was lost(is this a ground???.I just recalled that about four years ago the truck won't even click and my upstairs landlords nephew took a peek and reconnected a thick wire in the engine compartment fuse box.and it started right up.

RAD4Runner

Good and thank for the manuf date... (Odd... this is the first truck made before mid-1986 that has a starter relay. Maybe mid-1986 only applies to 4Runners.)

That's a common problem.
Let's start on that by checking your starter solenoid and starter motor... here is the procedure again

The just shutting off while running is a separate issue, but could be related.


was lost(is this a ground???.I just recalled that about four years ago the truck won't even click and my upstairs landlords nephew took a peek and reconnected a thick wire in the engine compartment fuse box.and it started right up.[/QUOTE]

You gotta help us help you by helping us see, hear, feel, smell what you're working on.
What did you find out about the things we suggested you do?
What did you do with the lighter socket?
Got pics of things you are wondering about?
Got pic of that thick wire?
Got pic of how your battery connects to things and to the body?
Are connections bare, shiny metal touching bare, shiny metal?

RAD4Runner

Got a multi-meter?
Next only to our senses (common included) it is the most important electrical troubleshooting tool.
$6 bucks and learning how to use this would save you hundreds of dollars and time by NOT relying on incompetent shops who would guess and make you pay for their guesses.

mldave

Rad4Runner,as mentioned earlier and not to have people feel sorry for me I'm half crippled up and have bad breathing issues..COPD..so not much I could do even if mechanical..and my hands are half shot with nerve damage so lot's of things are a great chore that I use to take for granted.A friend that has a shop in town might take a look tonight ot tomorrow.He said on the phone without visably seeing as yet it may be all the wires on the battery from the pushbutton and cold start bypasses.Hopefull he can check it out in his shop this week if he has the time and space.He's helped me many many times over the years on my vehicles with either letting me pay off parts and labor by the month or not charging me a fee at all.Ill keep you and the forum updated.I just keep plugging along as I did for many years in hardrock gold mining here in the Cali gold country..thanks for all your replies and efforts..102 temp here in Angels Camp,Ca.

RAD4Runner

Sorry about your challenges, MLDave. However, we're glad to know you have a friend who can do the hands-on work for you.
Clean workmanship, methodical troubleshooting and restoring your truck to stock should fix your truck pretty quickly.
Please relay to him what we just told you, and keep us posted.

mldave

So far the fellow hasn't called.even though he said he would.This is nothing new with him as sometimes he'll forget altogether or just not want to do it and never sasy a thing.Anyway,inthis mornings warm up over the same route I noticed it died out immediately when stepping on the clutch to down shift from fourth to second when entering the parking lot.All lights on the dash and radio and headlights were on//put in neutral and it started right up.

RAD4Runner

Most likely a bad connection, Dave,
Please keep us posted

mldave

Rad4Runner,checked up under the dash and all fuses are tight and no loose wires.On the clutch pedal what do the bushings do?Something felt loose near the the top of the pedal,but I couldn't see up there and the old body(71) wouldn't let me stay in that position for very long.I'll borrow a flashlight one of these days and see if I can see if anything looks out of place(as if I know what I'm looking for,ha,ha).

RAD4Runner

Hi Dave,
Unfortunately, simply looking at the fuse will not tell us it is 100% good. Really need to poke around with a multi-meter.
Best to start at your battery positive and ground connections. Need less acrobatics to inspect/fix them . I assume by clean battery post and connectors you mean inside and out?
Unless there are loose open wires with 12V shorting down there, nothing on the clutch pedal assembly would cause a short and make vehicle shut off. The Clutch Safety switch only has ground. If the switch or its wires sort to ground, nothing will happen, except it may allow you to crank the starter while in gear.