airrikk17

well after going to lunch and coming back with no problems i get in to go home from work , and my baby cranks fine , but no start.
i looked at the cap and rotor and they looked destroyed to me , until i picked up the new one and they looked cleaner but essentially the same.

so my question is where do i start next ?
95 toyota 4runner 3.0 v-6

tomorrow im chekcing the ingnition coil and everything else listed ,electrically in the haynes manual.

my guess is no spark , but it was hard to tell with jsut me .

my other guess is if its getting spark , then its not gettting fuel.
i checked al lthe fuses and they looked good , im goingot get a fuse checker tomorrow.
but is there any way to check the fuel pump ?

please help

airrikk17

ok, i finally got it fixed , thanks to a toyota dealership, if it wasnt for them i wouldnt have figured it out.
the efi fuse panel in the fuse block was bad , the wire hook up where the fuse goes had become disconnected. i think this happened when i removed a secondary wire that was there for a cb hookup fro mthe previous owner. it was a bout 2 weeks ago that i removed it and it finally worked itself loose. my bad. lesson learned when removing things from fuse panel , take your time instead of jsut yanking things out . total bill $300, including tow back to the dealership, but this is only a tempory fix , im going ot have ot replace the whole fuse panel. the dealership temped it up to keep it running , but it may work itself loose again. thank good ness for junkyards.

airrikk17

miket223

You're on the right track to next check the presence of spark. Fuel problems aren't very common. Your igniter is the likely problem if you've got a good set of plugs, wires, cap, and rotor.

airrikk17

any chance is my timing belt ? and how would i know with out tearing it down ?

airrikk17

callmej75

Ya know I had the same thing...and I don't know to this day what caused it...but last minute resort ya might wanna try this. It sounds funny...but its what made mine run. On the drivers side of the motor on the front on the fuel rail is a regulator. you should see a gas line going to it. Unhook this gas line from the metal line it attaches to that routes around the front of the intake. Get in and see if it starts up...if so shut it down and reattach line. I think mine might have been vapor locking or something...i dunno but it would crank and crank but no sounds of fire in sight. *Also mine had a strong fuel odor when I was trying to crank it like it was overloading bad.

TRunner

Was it running any different before? Sluggish, low idle, surges, stuttering, etc? Do you smell fuel when you are cranking it? Does it ever fire when you try and start or is it just a clean crank with no fire?

In any case, definitely check the for sparks before swapping out too many things, it can tell you a lot.

miket223

The timing belt is a possibility. When a timing belt gives up it usually cranks faster with an intermittent slow spot to the overall cranking. If it jumped a tooth or two from a loose belt then it can still sound normal while cranking but not start.

airrikk17

just got it towed home , so i can do more checking with out going back and forth to work to check email and suggestions.

as for as i can tell, and this is with out getting too involved in it yet , is that im not getting any spark out of the coil. but i havent checked to see if its getting power to the coil. i was hoping someone could give me some suggestions on how to do this .

im a one man show right now , so its really hard ot crank the motor and look for spark.
but i did hook up a timing light to the #1 plug like you would to check for timing and it wasnt lighting up at all well cranking it , so then i hooked it up to the coil wire to see if it lit up at all and still nothing.

like i said i replaced the coil and ignitor with a used one from a salvage yard, which doesnt mean its good , but im thinknig it is. i also replaced the cap and rotor , but not the wires , my budget is sort of stifled for a little bit until payday.
i checked all fuses and they looked good and i tested the fuses them selves and they were good. the only thing i couldnt check was the soliniod for the efi , the one in the engine compartment, i dont know how to check them . any ideas ?

it cranks like it should no stuttering or possible start up. jsut crank crank crank.

if i can determine that there is spark getting to the coil then the plugs , then my next guess is fuel , and ill try the sugesstion of checking for fuel . if the fuel is coming , my next step is going ot be to check the timing belt, i didnt want to have to tear it apart until i had spark and fuel.

there is a tool at napa i want to pick up but it was 26 bucks and im on the poor side right at this minute , always seems to be that way when things dont work, but its a ignition check light , you hook it up in place of the plug wire and it lights up if the ignition is working and doesnt if its not . any one used one of these? worth it or not ?

please any suggestions ?
by the way i do have a circuit tester , the dial kind that you set ot different setting wit hthe 2 probes , but i have no idea on how ot use it properly to check the coil and ignitor , according to the haynes manual.

airrikk17

TRunner

Just out of experience, you could have made yourself chase a false problem here. Did you bother checking for a spark prior to replacing anything? If not then reinstall everything you had before and check it then. I have seen lots of money spent because someone replaced something thinking that was their problem and then started the testing thinking that the replaced item is not the problem. In other words, it could have sparked before and now you are chasing another added problem. What I just typed barely makes any sense to me, but it is good advice.

airrikk17

i was all by myself trying to check for spark, so possibly not , but ill start fro mthe begining and find out for sure .
by the way the something comes on when the key is turned , sounds to me like the fuel pump .
any chance its the cold start ?
its not cold out , but i dont know for sure how those work.

any one out in spokane that wants to come over and help try and diagnios the problem your more then welcome to come on over.

i need an extra set of eyes and hands . my roomates are all gone out of tow nfor a bit.

airrikk17

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

Try the fuel pump test jumper:

http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTri...shtml#FuelPump

callmej75

For some reason I thought the same thing...no spark. Usually you will hear an engine "hit" sometimes but it just cranks and cranks. I was trying to check for fuel to see if it was pumping when I pulled it off the regulator...just guessing at it and left the hose off and cranked it...then it started right up. So immediately I shut it down because I was a one man operation...looked by the hose...no gas...so I reconnected it and it fired right up. Might wanna try this too...
http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTri...shtml#FuelPump
Just put a paper clip in the diagnostic plug on the passenger side fender in the FP & B+ slots and see if it will crank up with it in.

callmej75

ha...he beat me to it!

airrikk17

ok i tried the jumper wire thing , no different .
i also tired reseting everything , by removing the negative terminal for a while , no different , after dinner im goingot see if i can get some spark .

airrikk17

airrikk17

ok i disconnected that hose at the fuel rail and cranked it , no fuel came out , and of course it di not start .

airrikk17

airrikk17

ok i have determined no spark at the #1 plug wire and no spark out of the coil wire
now i need ot find out how to check the coil and igniter all i have is the haynes manual. and i have a circuit tester , but im lost on how to use it properly.
any one have a comprehensive knowledge of them. i guess i should have paid more attention in high school when we learned to use them. it may still be a bad coil wire , does anyone have a way to check plug wires for continuity?
more help please.

airrikk17

TRunner

Plug wires are cheap and if you don't already have them, go get some NGK's. As far as testing it, I hate electronics and always have someone else do that. I don't like getting shocked or playing in poo, so when it comes to electrical or plumbing, I am not your man.

callmej75

This might help...
http://personal.utulsa.edu/~nathan-b...12onvehicl.pdf

dragon564

Okay the distributor cap/rotor is driven by gears to the cam shaft. If it the cam does not turn the signal generator inside the dist. cap will detect and not stop the coil for sending power for spark to prevent it from getting burned up from over cranking.....Pull the Dist. cap off and mark the location of the rotor, just tap the starter over, a real quick bump and see if the rotor moves at all. If the rotor does not move the most likely cause is is a broken timing belt. If the rotor is turning then I would start checking the COIL....it might have gone bad....

BOSTON4RUNNER

i am sure

ignition control module / ignitor

is why it is not starting

coils do fail

but not near as often as modules / ignitors

and i am talking in general, not toyota per se

i will bet that it is the ignitor

airrikk17

alot of great info , the step by step instructions are going ot help alot .

the distributor turns so im thkning not the timing belt , thank good ness

im still thinking its something bewteen the coil and the battery , anyone know if the 30 a efi solnoids go bad ? its the one in the engine compartment fuse panel.



thanks guys for all the help

airrikk17