894runnernda808

I have a 1989 v6 4Runner......
It seems to me that my 4x4 sucks........
I get stuck in mudd holes I shouldn't...
and my front tires don't spin
Yesterday I was in a hole where my passenger rear tire had no traction...so ofcourse it was spinning...but neither of my front tires were spinning.......
HELP ME....whats wrong??
My 4x4 indiactor says its engaged but it doesn't seem as though it is...

Turbo4Runner

The automatic hubs actually require a bit of distance to engage, so if you were already stuck and put it in 4wd, your hubs will not engage. You have to put it in 4wd then drive about 15ft or so for them to lock. Yes, they suck.

If you did that and still now 4wd action then your hubs are probably broken which is fairly common for the early auto hubs. If that is the case, most will suggest you swap to a set for factory locking hubs.

Welcome to YotaTech!

RobD

Do you mean automatic hubs or does your truck have ADD? It is possible that your front actuator is not engaging, though the light shouldn't come on on your dash if that's the case.

DeathCougar

iTrader: (23)

89 4Runner didn't have an ADD option. He is talking about actual AUTO hubs.

Swap that junk out and swap on manual hubs. Then you know when they are locked for sure.

Toyota didn't design those auto hubs for anyone who ever planned on using them IMHO. There are actually plastic parts inside. WTF? Plastic? Nothing like having a 2wd 1st gen! lol.

leiniesred

Yup, the ol' "automatic hubs." I had these on my 1989; until the first winter. when it was VERY cold, parasitic drag in the transfer case would cause the front driveshaft to spin even in 2H on the highway, but more slowly than the wheels. None-the-less, the clutches in the "automatic" hubs would TRY to engage the hubs resulting in a horrific grinding noise at 65+ Mph.

Sometimes, the autohubs fail to engage too. A cleaning and degreasing would fix it, but why bother.

The fix: Remove the automatic hubs and replace with manual ASIN hubs. (don't bother with the weaker WARN hubs). To do this, you are going to want to go to the normal 54mm wheel bearing nut, tabbed lock washer, and lock nut located behind the manual hubs.

So go to the junkyard, find an IFS toyota truck with manual hubs. While you are down there, get the 54mm axle nuts and the tab washer. Go home, clean that stuff up and maybe even use a rebuild kit from marlin on your "new" hubs. Then tear off your Auto-hubs. No need to be careful how you get them off. You are going to give, or throw, them away.

You will have to set the wheel bearing pre-load with your new 54mm nuts too. Be ready to use a spring scale or torque wrench there. (Unless wheel bearings are old hat and you know how they should be by feel.)

Peace

tc

I disagree about the Warn hubs - if you can find them cheaper, feel free to use them.

Sure the AISIN hubs are stronger, but IMHO, the Warn hubs are SO much simpler. Plus they have a lifetime warranty. As a matter of fact, if you DO get Warn hubs, just take them in for warranty and get a new set.

All this may be a moot point though as you'll be at the junkyard to get the other parts anyways ...

DO NOT get any other hubs than AISIN or Warn, though, if they are not one of those two they are absolute crap.

894runnernda808

Question.......
I just had my driver wheel bearing and my passenger tie rod end's replaced....could this have affected the front from engaging?

I put the truck in 4x4 more than 200yrds away from where i got stuck.
Sorry I am very new to 4x4....I was a ricer before...
Thank you all for your quick responses..

eightnine

were are you from?

paxil4x4

Lifetime warranty does not mean crap when you stuck on a trail somewhere with a broken hub. Sure it might make some feel warm and cozy inside, but soon fades away in a fury of profanity while on the trail.

Many dogs and wives have been beaten after a warn hub failure.

Warn hubs also stick out further if I recall,

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

Only issues I've seen with the Warn hubs is that they don't use the cone washers and can have problems with working loose because of that. One guy in my club used to carry a wrench in his pocket and at every stop on the trail would have to hop out and snug up the nuts on his Warn hubs. Other issue is that they stick out a little farther, so with narrow wheels, they can tend to stick out and get hit by passing rocks.

waskillywabbit

iTrader: (-1)

I have yet to check a Toyota with Warn hubs and not find a loose fastener as they do not use cone washers. Warns need a lifetime warranty cause they are inferior in every way IMO to Aisin manual hubs.

Warn makes great winches and crappy Toyota manual hubs.

A used set of Aisins will give you more life than a new set of Warns and never need a lifetime warranty.

894runnernda808

I am from Hawaii
Honolulu

tc

Different strokes for different folks I guess. Here is MY personal experience actually using Warn hubs on my rig and AISINs on Molly's.

Warn hubs are a MUCH simpler design than AISIN. They are not nearly as picky about dirt and overgreasing as AISIN. You want to hear a fury of profanity and see wives and dogs get beat, observe the frustration of putting an axle back together and the AISIN hub not working, then having to tear it all apart again because there is one atom too much grease inside it. Molly is currently running one Warn and one AISIN because the other AISIN got thrown across the garage after numerous attempts to get it to work.

I don't have issues with mine coming loose, although when I first put them on I did. It's called lock washers and sufficient torque people... just like any other threaded fastener.

Yes, they stick out further, and yes, my Warns take a lot of abuse that AISINs wouldn't. (Rock damage is the primary reason I have invoked the warranty)

I know, you don't build a truck to break, but if it comes down to a hub, a CV, a stub shaft, or a ring and pinion, you're damn right I want the hub to break.

Anyone who gets stranded because a hub broke is a retard. Even with AISIN hubs, you should have a plan. My plan is to carry the ADD plates. If I were to break a hub (which has only happened once for me, and even then I'm not sure it was really broken), about 15 mins and I'm back on the trail again, fully functional. If my "unbreakable" AISIN hub led to the demise of my front R&P (which is could happen with the 7.5" IFS diff), I can limp on by disengaging the hubs and the front (with the twinstick), but most everyone else is gonna have MAJOR problems and tow truck bills.

FredTJ

This is the perfect correct answer.....
I'd go further and say that anyone who has problems with their Warn's loosening is a retard. As mentioned, fasteners with lockwashers (the Warns come that way), the correct torque, and I use a drop of blue locktite. In about a year with the 4Runner and many years with the Jeep I've NEVER had any of the nuts loosen.
As TC mentioned, bring one (or better yet both) of your ADD hubs with you in your spare bag and no worries.
That's the first thing that I did when I put the Warns on the 4Runner, threw the ADD hubs in the tool/parts bag that I carry with me.
At least with these vehicles it's easy to carry a "trail spare". The Jeep isn't that easy, you have to carry a spare Warn, there is no "ADD style" hub that you can replace in a few minutes on the trail.





Fred

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

Warn hubs working loose seem to be more of a variable than just proper torque. A buddy of mine had them on his '89 pickup. He had more trouble with them over the years, and had them properly torqued, loctite, lock washers and they still came loose. He even went so far as to replace all the hardware and had a shop do the install. He did start having the trouble when he added dual t-cases to the truck (EZ Locker up front). I think the added torque was just too much for the hubs and the whole front end. He ultimately did a SAS and has no problems with that now.

But that said, I know other folks who have had not one iota of problem. Then just slap them on and that is it. But it is hard to beat the simple cone washer design on the Aisins. Those cone washers are great in that the higher the load on them the tighter they grab. Perhaps if the Warns were modified to use cone washers, they might be the perfect hub.

Note that I have Warn hubs on my Dana 60 front axle and those are a very simple and rugged design. The locking parts are inside the hubs and there is none of the axle torque applied to the locking ring of the hub. Only issue I have with them is that since that locking ring carries no load, it is only held on with half a dozen tiny screws (#8 machine screw!) and it is very easy for a rock to get in and snap those off. Luckily it is only an inconvenience when that happens, just remove the broken ones and replace with new.