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I recently developed an oil leak at the front of the engine. i started noticing drips coming of the skid plate. Initially I couldn't tell where it was leaking from, oil was kind of spread around the front and left side of the engine. I went to a car wash and sprayed the engine with engine de-grease and then power washed it. After driving a bit I could see the area it was coming from. It appear to be right where the fan and pulleys and etc attached to the front shaft coming out of the engine. It only leaks when the engine is running and it doesn't leak very much. Its been 1K miles since last oil change and I still read full on the dip stick. Still, I do not like it and wold like to get it fixed/make it stop.
I showed it to the mechanic I use and he said it was surprising I only had that small leak considering the age of the vehicle. He poured a bottle of something in the oil filler and told me to go home and let the truck idle for 2 hours (I accidentally let it idle for 4 hours) and then drive for some miles and see if it stopped. I drove about 300 miles. I feel it minimized the amount of leakage but that's a bit subjective. It for sure did not completely stop it. His next recommendation is, next oil change, put in high mileage oil and a quart of a Lucas stop leak additive.
He seemed to think it would not be insane to take apart everything necessary to replace whatever seal has worn out, but indicated it would be kind of pricy regardless.
I'm seeking advice and suggestions from you toyota experts. Does the high mileage oil and Lucas additive seem like a good next step? Is this a common leak point? What is involved in replacing the seal? Or any other comments etc. you may have. Thanks in advance for any help!
That leak is either from the front main seal, or , less likely, from the oil pump O-ring. Seals lose their elasticity over time.
The fix for either, or both, requires the fan to be removed, all the drive belts slacked and removed from the harmonic balancer sheave, and the harmonic balancer removed from the crankshaft.
This exposes the oil pump and the front main seal. The seal and O-ring will cost less than 25 dollars. Labor??? Well..... whatever they can hold you up for, if you can't, or won't do it yourself.
Pour-in additives are for suckers. Doesn't sound like your 'mechanic' wants to work on your truck.
Here's the FSM for removing the oil pump. http://web.archive.org/web/201501160.../58oilpump.pdf I don't know much about the 22re, so I don't know if you can use the ol' machine-screw trick to pull out the seal without removing the pump. RockAuto has the seal for about $4.50, and the "o"-ring for about $1.50.
Here's the FSM for removing the crankshaft pulley ("harmonic balancer"): http://web.archive.org/web/201210231.../8timingch.pdf Note the torque is 116ft-lbs. Not too tough with a garden-variety breaker bar; the trick is keeping the crankshaft from turning as you apply the torque! Yeah, yeah, someone will advise laying the breaker bar against the frame and hitting the starter. It might work, but it won't do you any good. You still need a tool to put the bolt back in. Plenty of excellent shop-built tools described in these pages; I (of course) am partial to this one; https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f116...h-3vze-137934/
While you're in there you'd be well advised to check out the timing chain and its guides. Lots of info about that in this forum!
Sound like a lot? A good mechanic might be reluctant to take it on for any price, because warrantying work on "leaks" is pretty iffy. Particularly on an "old" vehicle. But if you do it yourself, the guy warrantying the work is as close as the nearest mirror.
OK And thanks for your replies. I had a new timing chain amd guides put in about 20K miles ago.
I read some previous discussions of this. There are many who state 1.0 - 0.5 hours. Not sure if the shop I go to will be in that range. I’m going to ask for an estimate for main seal replace. Is doing oil pump O ring advised at same time?
I've done the front main seal on my pickup 3 times, and the 4Runner once. The 4Runner was a lot easier to get my fat butt under to do the work. I don't fit under my pickup like I used to for some reason
Absolutely replace the oil pump seal (o-ring) at the same time. The second you get the oil pump off, you'll see why. They get hard, brittle, and easily just fall apart. Very much like the PCV valve grommet.
The front main seal is easy to get out, and back in again, but, since it goes in from the back, you will have to pull the oil pump off to get it out. All you need is a socket about the diameter of the front seal, and you can tap it out, and the new one in again. Quick, simple, easy, painless. A hydraulic press is another simple, easy method to use, if you have one available. I still used a large socket in the hydraulic press we had at work, when I used that. Otherwise, I just put the oil pump up on couple chunks of 4X4 (wood) set just far enough to allow the seal to come out, put the socket on it and tapped it with a rubber mallet.
A little trick the mechanics I worked with showed me for keeping the oil pump gasket in place, which is a PITA while installing it, is to put a little dab of a very thick grease in various spots around the oil pump's channel, especially the corners, that holds the gasket. The grease holds the gasket in place long enough to get the oil pump in place, and a few bolts started. Otherwise, the darn thing will be sticking out somewhere around the oil pump, no matter how careful you are. If you don't see it at first, and tighten the bolts down, you cut the gasket, and have a leak.
Works good for the valve cover gasket, too. Otherwise, you are trying to hold it in place while lowering the whole cover/gasket set up into place. NOT easy!
As has been mentioned, getting the harmonic balancer back ON is the hard part. 116 ft-lbs is a lot of torque, and keeping the crank from turning is rough. There ARE devices made just for this purpose, though. I can't remember where I got mine. I think McMaster-Carr catalog, but that was 30+ years ago. They look like this:
Honestly, I just use the "breaker bar on the frame and hit the starter" method for removal. It's a quick, easy way to do it. You just have to be certain, if you're the one holding the breaker bar, you trust the person on the key implicitly. You also want to be absolutely certain you put the breaker bar on the correct side of the farme, or it will swing around, hard and fast. Dangerous...
Toyota sells the holder wrench too: HERE.
We did those daily bitd.
If calling a shop for a estimate I’d simply call it the front crank seal and oil pump o-ring. Using “main seal” they might visualize the rear one, which is a beast to replace, labor-wise. The front crank seal/o-ring repair was needed every 5-7 years. Because of the location, the fan blade will blow the oil everywhere. Once you get it fixed I’d recommend cleaning, especially the two lower radiator hoses. I’ve seen more than a few radiator hoses blow out from being saturated with oil for a long time.
My crank pulley torqued right up no problem with no special tool other than the torque wrench I used. Put my truck in 5th gear, chocked the wheels, spark plugs installed, and I was able to get the proper amount of torque on the crank bolt.
Check the inside of the crank pulley for a groove from the seal. Toyota has a special seal that is not as thick as the regular size seal. As long as the crank pulley is in good condition other than a groove, then just buy the special seal, and that should solve the seal leaking problem.
My crank pulley torqued right up no problem with no special tool other than the torque wrench I used. Put my truck in 5th gear, chocked the wheels, spark plugs installed, and I was able to get the proper amount of torque on the crank bolt.
same here. no issue at all with getting it torqued back on. transmission in 5th, wheels chocked, parking brake on. done.
the job only takes about 30 to 40 minutes from start to finish if you've done it before, and i have done it about 5 times so far on my 2 '87 4runners.
Thanks to all of you for your very helpful info and advice. I'm contacting a mechanic about this and I will post the outcome/follow up with what happens.
ooops - somehow I put this update into a "related post" by accident. Here it is where it was meant to be added:
Update. I ended up taking the truck to a trusted and experienced mechanic. He quoted me the full book price of @ $500 to replace the front seal and oil pump seal. He agreed to try to save $ by trying the method of bracing a wrench against the frame and using the starter to loosen the crankshaft pulley bolt, versus removing radiator and etc. He warned me, this may not work and even if it does there is no guarantee that in the end replacing the seals will fix the oil leak.
He could not loosen the bolt. It seems it was over torqued by previous mechanic when replacing timing chain. He removed the radiator and went thru 5 cycles of heat/impact wrench. Finally got it loose. He put on a new front seal and oil pump seal and now, thankfully the leak is gone/fixed. Cost $460.
Even though it was a minor leak...I feel better having it fixed.
I've had that front oil seal turn loose, dumping the entire oil load on the ground. Thankfully, I got the engine shut down before any major harm was done, but it was scary to think what could have happened on a freeway with no oil in the engine.
Good thing you got yours fixed when you did.
07-05-2021, 01:34 PM
