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Old Jan 12, 2010 | 02:50 PM
  #21  
NYChopshop's Avatar
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From: Back in New York City!
I never finish rambling... here's some stuff I forgot and couldn't help not mentioning:
~The speakers and wiring I recently ordered all in and shipped cost me about $700. Not all that bad for that much sound.
~Getting a capacitor for a subwoofer amplifier is a very good idea, and I plan on one when I step up to a bigger set of subs and amp.
~Eventually, I plan on running 2x 8" JL subwoofers in custom boxes that protrude from where the trunk mounted 6" drivers are now, and a single 13" sub box (CLS113RG-W7) with a cool thousand watts going to it. This will give me back another quarter of my trunk and up my bass to ridiculous.
~For earthshattering bass that will rob the air out of your lungs, grab your ankles and head on over to memphis car audio. I can't say enough about what these things can do. My friend has a 94 impala wherein the entire trunk has become a subwoofer box for but a pair of memphis speakers, each handling about four thousand watts. I coined the term "life changing bass" when riding around in that car.
~SOUNDPROOFING! Shell out for dynamat xtreme bulk pack(s). 2 packs would cover your truck but good. about $110 a pop when last I checked.
~If you give me a better idea of how much you're looking to spend and what kind of music you like, I'd better adjust my recommendations to suit your taste.

Last edited by NYChopshop; Jan 12, 2010 at 02:52 PM.
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Old Jan 12, 2010 | 03:24 PM
  #22  
aviator's Avatar
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Welcome back NYC sorry to hear your computer had a melt down...
Good to see you back...
For great sound deadening on a budget try B-quiet http://www.b-quiet.com/

I bought a huge roll of bquiet ultimate for about $70 shipped and got enough to do the whole cab (I've only done the doors so far but never mind that lol) the difference is amazing the doors close with a thunk now instead of a clank.
The b-quiet ultimate is almost as good as the dynamat you will never notice that 1/100th of difference.
The folks there are great to deal with and will spend time answering your questions. the how to videos/instructions at the site are extremely helpful.
I also sprayed the inside of the doors with a double layer of rubberized asphalt undercoat which is the exact same stuff as "Dynaspray" sound deadener and it cost less the $5 a can w/taxes (on sale).
The undercoat has a double advantage it is also a rust inhibitor just make sure the surface is very dry and free of oil for best adhesion (it also helps if the surface is warm (near room temp.) so if you can put the truck in a heated garage overnight and do it the next day so much the better.
It drys pretty quick and you won't be touching it anyways so it is safe to apply and then cover the inner surface with b-quiet/dynamat almost immediately. One thing make sure if you have power locks/windows to disconnect all the plugs and clean them with contact cleaner and cover them with dielectric silicone sealant and lube all the rods/locks with a good white lithium spray grease like Jig-a-loo because once you seal the door with the sound deadener it will be a major PITA to get back in there. If you have manual windows/locks lube everything with the white lithium. Hit the window channels with some silicone lube spray. These preventative steps will ensure the mechanisms are functioning long after you are cold and buried.

Last edited by aviator; Jan 12, 2010 at 03:27 PM.
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Old Jan 12, 2010 | 09:30 PM
  #23  
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I noticed one flaw in the advice above...don't waste your money on capacitors. They are a band aid solution to the real problem and in a lot of cases do bugger all but look pretty.

SPEAKER SELCTION
Sound like art is a very personal perception...One person can listen to a speaker set and it will blow their socks off, another may think they are rubbish. For this reason you should only take speaker choice advice lightly. Identify your price range, and outline speakers within that range that you might be interested in. Try and demo them and make your decisions with your ears. A note to make is that speakers sound much different on the board then when installed in a car, but comparisons between speakers on the board should be a good testing point. When you demo make sure that the keen salesman has not used any additional filters are EQ settings, and again don't listen to what he thinks is fully sick, listen to your own ears. Salesmen ALWAYS have another agenda on there mind...usually clearing particular stock for bonuses.

SPEAKER INSTALL
It should go without saying that install is 90% of the final result. Cheap speakers installed properly will sound better than expensive speakers installed poorly. So what is a good install you ask? Most retailers will simply screw a POD to your door trim, plug it into your headunit and call it done...sure they will make sound and you can listen to your tunes but your wasting alot of potential.

The single BEST thing you can do to get the most out of your speakers is sound deaden your doors, ideally both the inner and outer skin (inner is the one you see when you take the trim off, outer is the actual skin which you can get to via service holes in the inner). There are many options, I use dynamatt but it is certainly not the only option and there is endless discussion about which is better.

The second thing towards a good install is a solid mounting. Speakers should be bolted directly to the inner skin! Speaker install is literally open to your imagination and how you want it to look the point is they should be very rigid.

Thirdly is direction of the drivers. With a standard passive 2 way split setup (I strongly recommend you go this route first) the midbass drivers (generally 6" - 6.5") should be aimed at the opposite headrest. As mentioned above tweeters should be facing the listener as much as possible. This is trail and error as much as any solid rule but the best way is to get them 'right' is to play around with different locations using blu tack before finnaly mounting them...When it comes to quality installs you need to envision a sound stage in front of you during install and tuning.... as if you were sitting at a concert. The best way to do this is to sit in your seat with your test system at a moderate volume. Shut your eyes and point to where you think the sound is coming from...if you are pointing in the middle of the windscreen about half way up you have yourself a good sound stage. The biggest factor to sound stage location is tweeter placement so experiment with them if you have the time/willingness. You can also use specialist head unit functions to delay timing to help with sound stage. All this will come with time as you learn....this is the reason alot of people spend so much money on bloody car stereo.

AMP SELECTION
Amp selection can be a bit tricky when you havn't had any experience with 12V DC electronics. At a consumer level however, there not that hard to understand. The only 4 ratings or specifications you are interested in is...

1) TYPE (Class & Channel) When it comes to the word channel, it bassicly means how many individually controlled power streams the amp can produce. One speaker is one channel. How many channels you need is based on what you are running and what you want to amp. You may find this as weird news, but nearly every SQ competitor does not amp the back speakers, or in some cases even run rear speakers...why should you? The reason is simple...you don't sit in the back do you? In an ideal standard daily setup you will amp the fronts (very important), run the rears off the headunit (if it all) and amp the sub. In this setup you only need 3 channels, 2 for the front speakers and one to drive the sub. How you do this up to you...you can either run a four channel where 2 channels control the fronts, the other two are bridged (if possible) to drive the sub. Bridging is available on some amps, and is the process of combining the output of 2 channels into one great for sub drive. The only downside to this is that high output 4 channel amps are expensive and they are not the most efficient amps on the market, meaning your electrical system needs to be up to it. Personally I run 2 amps... a 2 channel controlling the fronts (class AB, sounds better at high frequency but not as efficient), and a monoblock (class D, looses quality at high frequency but far more efficient) to run the sub. This reduces strain on the vehicles electrical system. The downside to multiple amps is you will need a larger wiring kit (I suggest minimum 4Awg).

2)POWER OUTPUT (RMS) Always look for RMS ratings and disregard peak/max ratings...they are useless, pure advertising gimicks. Power output is largely based on OHM ratings so is continued below...I just wanted to make the point of RMS vs Peak clear - I get anoyed when kids run around saying I bought this sick 4,000W amp the other day and it pumps. I feel like saying, wow where did you get the 10 grand to pay for that...oh wait your just stupid.

When it comes to power output, always buy as much as you can afford...you can never have too much power.
3)OHM RATING OHM's law is a good starting point when learning any electronics...In summary resistance (measured in the unit of OHM) is just that...resistance to the electrical current. I would ussualy try and include a clever analogy here but I just can't god damn think of one. The concept is not hard to understand however. Less resistance = more curent flow, more resistance = less current flow. It may be a good idea to get a grasp of Ohms law, and understand basic electric theory before getting started in car audio.

When it comes to car audio, OHM ratings defines power output, which is why you will see the specs labeled 200Wrms @ 1 ohm x 2 , 100Wrms @ 2 ohm x 2, 50Wrms @ 4 ohm x 2. So which one is your power output your asking? Well all of them...The specs are read like follows. X Wrms amount of power is available at X ohm amount of resistance x by X the amount of channels. Before going any further it is important to note that the lower the resistance value the more work the amp needs to do. Some amps are not 1ohm stable, some can but not when bridged etc...you need to take this into acount when buying gear. I rarely will run a system at 1ohm despite the power increase....the extra stress the amp and electrical system will take at this low impedance may reduce life span.

The biggest question I find is how do you switch resistances, where is the toggle switch on the amp etc. Well, there is none. The resistance that the amp will run at is dictated by what it is driving. Speakers are simple 4ohm speaker = 4 ohm load. When it comes to subs in can get a little more dificult...subs come in eihter singal voice coil (SVC) or dual voice coil (DVC). It has ZERO effect on how the sub sounds, just how it can be wired. By wiring in either series or paralell you have the ability to change the load the amp receives...the point is you need to match them.

For now I am done typing lol...there is a hell of a lot I havn't covered yet - expect an update.
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Old Jan 13, 2010 | 07:08 AM
  #24  
aviator's Avatar
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Thanks for the input Eric.
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Old Jan 13, 2010 | 11:18 AM
  #25  
Windsor's Avatar
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Originally Posted by milehigheric
I noticed one flaw in the advice above...don't waste your money on capacitors. They are a band aid solution to the real problem and in a lot of cases do bugger all but look pretty.
+1 on this.

I'm glad he said it first, I didn't want to answer a ton of "but I read in --- magazine..." questions.
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Old Jan 13, 2010 | 02:32 PM
  #26  
aviator's Avatar
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From: COTKU,Ontario,Canada
Yeah but they look pretty and I hear they add like 10HP...
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