Heres the situation, I'm going to build a small system for my 4runner. My plan is to buy a deck, front components, amp and a 10" sub. The problem is I have limited knowledge about car audio. Specifically what amp do I need to power certain subs and front speakers? Watts, ohms, rms = too many numbers...

I'm getting this deck here http://www.crutchfield.ca/alpine_ida...500idax305.htm

So how does it work if I want a 4channel amp? Do I power the fronts with 2 channels and bridge the other two for the sub? What ohm numbers do I look at on the spec list?

 

i suggest you go with a 5 channel

 

How come 5 instead of 4?

 

I would suggest you read up on car audio threw crutchfields site. You should be able to learn everythjing there.

 

get a 4 or five chanel so you can power up your sub and speakers. you shouldnt need anymore than a 600 watt amp.

 

ok I'll give it a go for ya...

ohms refers to the impedance of the speaker for example most home systems are 8 ohm, most autos are 4 ohm, and subs are usually 2 ohm.

rms = root mean squared basically it is the "average" output power of the amp/deck or whatever.
the head unit you choose has a built-in amplifier (18 watts RMS/50 peak x 4 channels) this means the peak output is 50W averaged out to 18W per channel over the 4 channels (L/R F/R)

watts is the power output or limit of the amp/deck/speakers

the amp you want/need will depend on how much power the speakers can handle for example some speakers like these from alpine http://www.crutchfield.ca/Alpine_SPS...500sps600c.htm (to stay all one mfg.) have a rating of {power range: 2-80 watts RMS (240 watts peak power)} this means they will function with a input signal of as low as 2W up to 80W rms and can handle 240W max before they fail (blow)

now this amp from alpine http://www.crutchfield.ca/Alpine_PDX...500pdx4100.htm puts out {100 watts RMS x 4 at 4 ohms} so you can see it is a little too much for the speakers to handle (potentially) [they also want an arm and a leg for it lol]

now this alpine http://www.crutchfield.ca/Alpine_MRP...500mrpf300.htm puts out {50 watts RMS x 4 at 4 ohms} well within the speakers range and it can be switched to a 3ch. set up so it could power a sub as well.

sub woofers - your choices here depend on how much space you have available and what kind of music you like (seriously) if you like "urban/rap" you probably want a "boomier" bass for this you (typically) need to look at as big a sub as you can fit/afford on the other hand if you are more a "rock/jazz" kind of person then a smaller sub will provide a clean, tight bottom end.
some sub sets are avail. with built in mono amps which would mean you could save a little money now and just get a 2ch system amp if you wanted.

disclaimer: I have no interest in alpine stereo gear or any other co. for that matter. I have no idea if their stuff is any good these days, personally I run JL audio speakers and am saving for a Kenwood excelon series deck I just used them as a quick example. I am not a professional installer so this advice could be taken with a truck load of salt I just tried to answer your ?.
member NYchopshop is an installer and could probably offer some advice if you were to pm him. we have some other members who are serious car audio guys who may be able to offer advice too once the see the post.

Just remember we all have out favs when it comes to gear brands/set-ups
lol.
hope this helped you a bit
merry xmas
aviator

x2 on the advice from the crutchfield site but remember their purpose is to sell you stuff 1st not necessarily give you the best advice.

 

I did the same thing as you. I find myself wanting to expand, I really wish I'd gotten a bigger amp.

My plan was to get a 4 channel amp, put front comonnents on that, then eventually expand to a sub, then put the rear's powered through the deck.

I ended up getting an Alpine deck, some amp that has 1000w, with 80RMS per channel.

i got Polk db6025's for my components, then eventually got a 12" sub.

Now my front comps are underpowered, and so is the sub... and my front comps will be underpowered even if i get a seperate amp for the sub and get rear comps. Bad planning on my part? probably, but they sound sweet.

 

Thanks all, especially Aviator, that was helpful.

After some scouting for an amp, I came up with these:

http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...nce+5350a.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...APPA+FIVE.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...ine+PDX-5.html
http://www.sonicelectronix.com/item_...08ZX700.5.html

Any recommendations?

 

Don't feel really qualified to offer any recomendations since I don't have any experience with any of them but the alpine PDX-5 unit is an all class D amp which is a good thing they are the most modern technology wise generally speaking. They are all solid state electronic and are more energy efficient then the older class A B and AB types they also tend to run cooler which means less thermal stress.
Class A amps are tube amps they give a very rich warm sound but can be prone to failure when used in the "rugged" environment of a car this is why today you don't usually find them in auto amps.
Class B were an improvement with some solid state parts but were not very successful standing alone. (not sure what the specific issue was)
Class AB is a combination of the two technologies and are the most common type found today they are cost effective to produce and generally stand up well in the mobile environment.
Class D is an all solid state unit as noted they are most commonly used in mono block sub amps where their ability to handle vibration and high output is needed. A few mfgs. are producing "full-range" amps like the PDX noted.
As with everything some mfgs. produce better amps then others you really need to talk to some folks that have them. Talk to a few different shops {or members} and audition several mfgs. amps before you take the plunge.

 

Yeah, that Alpine is a little more money. I think I'm between the Kicker and Infinity Kappa. Anyone preferential to either one?

 

i dont know about kappa but i do have the infinity recfence it sound very clear but not alot of bass

 

The Kicker is out, way to big to fit under the seat. Its looking like the Kappa is a good fit for size, power and price. I'm also leaning towards these for the doors. http://www.crutchfield.ca/Alpine_Typ.../500SPR17S.htm

 

for similar money you might try these JLs http://www.crutchfield.ca/JL_Audio_V...136vr650cs.htm

 

Wouldn't it be better to use the Alpine's as they have a higher RMS. The amp puts out 150 x 2. The Alpines are 220 watts per set and JL's are 120 watts per set. Am I missing something?

 

I was'nt looking at matching to the amp output since the amp choice had'nt been locked down yet as far as I knew, my bad...

 

So if the amp output is 150 watts x 2, would the Alpines be the better choice then?

 

Really can't say for sure myself, you really should talk to some members with a lot more experience with this then me. I don't want to steer you wrong.
like I said pm NYChopshop he knows this stuff cold... (good thing since he makes his living at it lol)

 

No, you've been a big help Aviator, thanks. I'll try to PM NYchop to see what he says.

 

Do you still need any help? I have a fair amount of experience in car audio, havn't dabbled in it for a few years but I could probably help you out.

 

Sorry it took me so long to find my way over here, despite your PM. My computer crapped out and I'm on a borrowed laptop. Over Christmachannuquanzakah I managed to order myself a nice stack of stereo goodies, and although I haven't installed them yet, I'd be happy to outline what I got and what I think about what you've figured thusfar. Let me start with a little bit of an extension to Aviator's glossary:

Tweeter - small 1" (in automotive terms) speakers only designed to play high frequencies. It is most important that these speakers be pointed as directly at the listener as possible.
Midrange - the common driver that carries all but the high frequencies and the lowest frequencies well.
Crossover - a device that (usually) passively separates the useful frequencies for specific speakers from the full signal put out by your head unit. Tweeters get only the highs, mids get what they are designed to work with etc.
Midbass driver - a speaker that falls between a real sub and a midrange, usually 6"-8". If you like hard rock or electronica, without these speakers your music will really be lacking something.
Capacitor - basically a small battery you put inline with your amplifier so when it makes a large power draw on your driving battery, the demand is pulled from the capacitor instead. This makes the music better, and prevents embarrassing light-dimming effects of loud music.
Coaxial vs. Component - Coaxial speakers have the tweeter mounted right in the middle of the driver. I'm sure you've seen them before. Component speakers have tweeters that are physically separate from the drivers and can/should be mounted elsewhere. I'll save you the lecture on sound physics and speaker construction principals: the sound quality that you will get from a component set is markedly better than coaxial.

What I got:
MB Quart PVI-210 4" component set (2 4" drivers for the dash in front, 2 tweeters to be installed in the corners by the side view mirrors, and 2 crossovers)
MB Quart PVI-164 6.5" midbass driver set (2 6.5" midbass drivers for the lower front corner of the front doors where the map pockets are. The map pockets can pretty easily be relocated to the back of the door panel. Check, there's room. Oh, and 2 crossovers)
MB Quart PVI-216 6.5" component set (2 6.5" drivers for the rear doors, 2 tweeters to be installed near the drivers, and 2 more crossovers)
HIFONICS Zeus ZXI6410 4 channel amp. Puts out 85w to four channels at 4 ohms, and with the way I will be wiring it in the future, 170w to four channels at 2 ohms.
WIRING! I got a rockford fosgate 4-gauge dual amp wiring kit. The quality of these kits is outstanding, and all you have to do is bolt on one end and trim the other to fit when you snake it all the way to the amplifier(s). Crucial. There isnt anything that will shoot your sound quality in the face quite like bad quality wiring.

I can't speak for the quality of the components. I know that MB Quart used to be top of the line german made audiophile quality speakers, but the company was sold to another named MAXXSONIC. Hifonics is a newer brand under Maxxsonic. I hear the quality has gone down, but the price is 1/10 what it once was. I figured I'd give them a shot since I haven't heard any specific bad things about the brands yet. I'll be sure to post again when it all goes THUMP!

Oh, I already have a MTX Terminator sub/amp combo, so I have 2 12" subs that get 400 watts at 4 ohms. Weird sub configuration, but they sound alright for now. Cheap as sin. Also, a simple and reliable head unit. That stuff should be in my build thread in my signature, or in the 'off road audio' thread https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f96/...eivers-184615/.

For now, I'm going to be wiring up the 4" component set and the stock rear component speaker from the head unit's built in amplifier. I will be running the 6.5" drivers in the front and the new rear components from the hifonics amplifier. That makes it a 14 speaker setup including 2 subs.

What you got:
I am a big fan of infinity kappa (and kappa perfect) speakers. Unfortunately they are 2ohm, which can be odd when it comes to amp selection. I know a lot of fans of Alpine speakers, but I like their electronics more than their speakers. I like JL audio for higher end retail type speakers from crutchfield's selection. For the best value in speakers for the money, if this whole MB Quart thing backfires on me, is definitely Boston Acoustic. I don't know what kind of volumes of what kind of music you plan on listening to, but I can only suppose that when cranked all the way up your stock head unit just wont cut it. The 4" speakers in the dash have a limitation just based on their size. I highly recommend getting some front components. I recommend a 4 channel amp. I would say get the 6.5" component set, mount the drivers in the doors as I will, and put an identical set in the rear doors. Get a 4" coaxial set and an additional tweeter, put the 4"ers in the dash, and the tweeters in the factory trunk location. 1x 10" sub
will work great with rock and give you a nice rich low end. For subs that will keep up with all kinds of music at all volumes, you need to look at JL audio for subwoofers, midbass drivers and amplifiers to match. Size and power depending on music and budget, of course.