DOT legal bead lock rims?
May 15, 2008 | 05:41 PM
#42
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From: Tucson, AZ USA Age:60
May 15, 2008 | 07:55 PM
#43
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From: Aurora, CO
Get the Stauns internal beadlocks and forget about it. Beadlock wheels are sweet, but expensive and not worth the hassle. No one will balance them for you or install them for you, where-as any good shop will install the internals for you.
May 16, 2008 | 06:55 AM
#44
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From: Tucson, AZ USA Age:60
Actually, out here in Southern Arizona, it's very difficult to find a shop that'll install the Stauns. The Stauns require drilling a hole in the wheel for the new valve stem.
The Stauns are great though, no doubt about it and they've been throughly tested out in JV.
Regarding balancing bead locks (or any tire for that matter), Harbor Freight sells a tire balancer (bubble type) that works great. I've got one and several of us have been using it for years. It produces a great balance, if you do it correctly, that's good even for freeway speeds.
They also sell a manual tire changer that, again, works great. I friend of mine has that and we've used it a lot.
With bead locks, other than the Stauns, you wouldn't need the tire changer though.
Fred
May 16, 2008 | 07:37 AM
#45
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From: Montrose, CO
But as many have stated, DOT approval is not even necessary since it is not an issue in any state-- except for Kommifornia...maybe.
McCain in '08
Last edited by 4Mogger; May 16, 2008 at 07:54 AM.
May 28, 2008 | 10:47 AM
#46
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From: Littleton, CO
It's an issue in Utah, they do have a law on the books referencing 'beadlocks' rather than DOT compliance. One wonders if that would hold up in appeal. I have had no problems to date, as I am a very happy user of Champion beadlocks like Roger Brown's, and there are a lot of faux beadlocks out there that look similar to them.
The Champion folks were super helpful. I have had no issues getting the Goodyear shop to balance them, and they STAY balanced and ride great on the highway. Periodic retorquing is a good idea. I picked up track width using 15x10s with 35x12.50 MT/Rs. What a difference wheeling! MT/Rs stick MUCH better at 11psi than at 14 or 15. Almost no chirping on the Moab slickrock.
Roger, a question- looks like you changed out the hardware to stainless allen button head screws. Are you concerned about the difference in hardness between those and grade 8?
The Champion folks were super helpful. I have had no issues getting the Goodyear shop to balance them, and they STAY balanced and ride great on the highway. Periodic retorquing is a good idea. I picked up track width using 15x10s with 35x12.50 MT/Rs. What a difference wheeling! MT/Rs stick MUCH better at 11psi than at 14 or 15. Almost no chirping on the Moab slickrock.
Roger, a question- looks like you changed out the hardware to stainless allen button head screws. Are you concerned about the difference in hardness between those and grade 8?
May 28, 2008 | 11:03 AM
#48
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From: Littleton, CO
I should have simply assumed such a detail would not escape the engineering mind of 4Crawler... 
BTW, your sliders are holding up wonderfully; one bent upwards slightly in the rollover but a strategic cut and weld fixed that completely. I modified them to support 'rock glides' for the rear fenders, and will extend the front to support front rock glides.
Best slider out there IMHO.
BTW, your sliders are holding up wonderfully; one bent upwards slightly in the rollover but a strategic cut and weld fixed that completely. I modified them to support 'rock glides' for the rear fenders, and will extend the front to support front rock glides.
Best slider out there IMHO.
Last edited by Red_Chili; May 28, 2008 at 11:05 AM.
May 28, 2008 | 11:09 AM
#49
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From: St. Loser, Misery
Here is a good description of the "issue":
http://web.archive.org/web/200302071..._statement.htm
My take is that beadlocks kind of fall into a gray area. You start with a DOT wheel and put the lock ring on it. Is it still a DOT wheel or not? Some bead lock designs cut off the outer bead and replace it, while others add the bead lock ring to the outside of the existing bead. So do either of these mods make a formerly DOT approved wheel non-DOT approved? In fact with the kind you place outside the existing bead (like the RockStomper locks), if you were to mount the tire to the original beads would it be legal and if you remounted it to the lock ring it would suddenly become illegal?
Now there are non-DOT wheels that are bead locked as well, for example dirt track racing wheels, etc. These wheels are not DOT legal even without a bead lock. They are usually built very light and lack things like safety beads inside the wheel, etc.
I don't think there are any regulations saying what it would take to make a beadlock "DOT approved", so while they may not be techincally be 100% "DOT approved" that is not the same as being illegal. I talked to a CHP officer a few years ago and he runs bead locks on his Dodge 4x4 that he drives on the street and in the desert. I also talked to another guy who did get pulled over in Calif. for beadlocks. He pulled off the spare (same wheel/tire as on the truck) and showed the officer the "DOT" stamp inside the wheel and that was enough to get him out of any ticket.
I think the bigger issue would be the added potential for tire failure due to air leaks. Beadlocks require periodic checking of bolt torque. In mine, I run some internal tire pressure monitors so that I can see the tire pressure as I drive. I can set an alarm to go off if the pressure drops a few psi. I also got the most inconspicuous beadlock ring I could get and also modified the harware to make them look almost like the fake "street locks" (replaced the inner studs and lock bolts with the same style fasteners):
http://web.archive.org/web/200302071..._statement.htm
My take is that beadlocks kind of fall into a gray area. You start with a DOT wheel and put the lock ring on it. Is it still a DOT wheel or not? Some bead lock designs cut off the outer bead and replace it, while others add the bead lock ring to the outside of the existing bead. So do either of these mods make a formerly DOT approved wheel non-DOT approved? In fact with the kind you place outside the existing bead (like the RockStomper locks), if you were to mount the tire to the original beads would it be legal and if you remounted it to the lock ring it would suddenly become illegal?
Now there are non-DOT wheels that are bead locked as well, for example dirt track racing wheels, etc. These wheels are not DOT legal even without a bead lock. They are usually built very light and lack things like safety beads inside the wheel, etc.
I don't think there are any regulations saying what it would take to make a beadlock "DOT approved", so while they may not be techincally be 100% "DOT approved" that is not the same as being illegal. I talked to a CHP officer a few years ago and he runs bead locks on his Dodge 4x4 that he drives on the street and in the desert. I also talked to another guy who did get pulled over in Calif. for beadlocks. He pulled off the spare (same wheel/tire as on the truck) and showed the officer the "DOT" stamp inside the wheel and that was enough to get him out of any ticket.
I think the bigger issue would be the added potential for tire failure due to air leaks. Beadlocks require periodic checking of bolt torque. In mine, I run some internal tire pressure monitors so that I can see the tire pressure as I drive. I can set an alarm to go off if the pressure drops a few psi. I also got the most inconspicuous beadlock ring I could get and also modified the harware to make them look almost like the fake "street locks" (replaced the inner studs and lock bolts with the same style fasteners):
The regulations are different state to state obviously..... "beadlocks" specifically are not banned but "Multi-piece" wheels are. Beadlocks fall into this category. The safety issue is that the wheel can come apart when the vehicle is in motion...hope that helps a little..still some gray area on this subject
May 28, 2008 | 11:15 AM
#50
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From: Littleton, CO
May 29, 2008 | 08:50 AM
#51
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From: Spokane, Washington
http://www.4wheelparts.com/Wheels/Mi...n=M%2fT450421A
May 30, 2008 | 02:01 PM
#53
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From: Auburn, CA
Cheap fix in the mean time is to mark your tires and wheels so that you can tell when they've spun. If/when they spin, remove tire, let the air out, break the bead with a hi-lift, and then spin the wheel in the tire back to where it was when it was balanced. Kind of a pain, but not as bad as having to get them rebalanced all the time.
May 31, 2008 | 05:10 AM
#55
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From: Oklahoma State
Here's may experence with the Equal stuff in my tires:
https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f2/e...failure-55775/
https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f2/e...failure-55775/
May 31, 2008 | 08:18 AM
#56
I run wheel balancers on my '85:
Haven't had a wheel/tire re-balanced in over 8 years.
http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTri...ce/index.shtml
Haven't had a wheel/tire re-balanced in over 8 years.
http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTri...ce/index.shtml
Jun 6, 2008 | 07:16 AM
#58
I don't think there is a specific DOT stamp for beadlocks, per se.
A few ways to make beadlocks. One way is for non-DOT-approved racing wheels and beadlocked or not they are not street legal.
Then you have DOT-approved wheels and the internal locks like Staun that make no change to the wheel so they are still DOT-approved. Then you can take a DOT wheel and shave off the outer bead and weld on a bead lock ring. The wheel still has the original DOT stamp on it, but since it has the bead lock ring, is it still a DOT approved wheel or not? My Champions have a DOT stamp on them, they are built from DOT-approved American Racing wheels.
Then there are the DIY bead lock kits where you weld the bead lock ring to the outside of the existing bead on the wheel. So the wheel still has the original beads plus the bad lock ring. And it is possible to mount the tire to either the stock bear or to the bead lock. So is this wheel DOT approved or not? Maybe it depends on how you mount the tire. Mount it to the original beads and you have a DOT legal "street lock" wheel. Then if you mount the tire to the bead lock and the wheel is now non DOT-approved?
Then you can have bead lock wheels that are built from the ground up to be bead locks like the H1 wheels and some of the other DOT-approved bead locks.
A few ways to make beadlocks. One way is for non-DOT-approved racing wheels and beadlocked or not they are not street legal.
Then you have DOT-approved wheels and the internal locks like Staun that make no change to the wheel so they are still DOT-approved. Then you can take a DOT wheel and shave off the outer bead and weld on a bead lock ring. The wheel still has the original DOT stamp on it, but since it has the bead lock ring, is it still a DOT approved wheel or not? My Champions have a DOT stamp on them, they are built from DOT-approved American Racing wheels.
Then there are the DIY bead lock kits where you weld the bead lock ring to the outside of the existing bead on the wheel. So the wheel still has the original beads plus the bad lock ring. And it is possible to mount the tire to either the stock bear or to the bead lock. So is this wheel DOT approved or not? Maybe it depends on how you mount the tire. Mount it to the original beads and you have a DOT legal "street lock" wheel. Then if you mount the tire to the bead lock and the wheel is now non DOT-approved?
Then you can have bead lock wheels that are built from the ground up to be bead locks like the H1 wheels and some of the other DOT-approved bead locks.
Last edited by 4Crawler; Jun 6, 2008 at 09:11 AM.
Jun 7, 2008 | 09:44 AM
#59
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From: Littleton, CO
Jun 7, 2008 | 10:51 AM
#60
An interesting thread below:
- http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...threadid=15915
And here are the two FMVSS sections referenced:
- http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_20...cfr571.110.htm
- http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_20...cfr571.120.htm
They do mention "locking rings" and "multi piece wheels" in both sections, but do not preclude them. About the only thing I see where most external beadlocks fail is that all the pieces of the wheel are not suitably stamped (i.e. the bead lock ring is missing the wheel designation information).
- http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...threadid=15915
And here are the two FMVSS sections referenced:
- http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_20...cfr571.110.htm
- http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_20...cfr571.120.htm
They do mention "locking rings" and "multi piece wheels" in both sections, but do not preclude them. About the only thing I see where most external beadlocks fail is that all the pieces of the wheel are not suitably stamped (i.e. the bead lock ring is missing the wheel designation information).
