To supplement the additional fuel the TRD kit adds the fuel directly to the supercharger inlet. This provides a cooling effect on the charge. I find it interesting that TRD is marketing such a product because I was asking them (TRD, Eaton and Magnuson) if it would be OK to blow nitrous and fuel into the SC intake. They all said they could not provide any information due to lack of testing under those conditions. One of the guys said the fuel could damage the powdercoating on the supercharger rotors.

Anyway... it is true the engine would realize a second benefit of a cooler charge... using the extra injector.

Regarding fuel delivery ... I am still not convinced that my 1998 4Runner 5 speed is lacking in this department. The only mods I have are: Smaller pulley, TRD exhaust, KenBell boost a pump. And the SplitSecond FTC-1 (currently only used to map the timing retard). I have found that best performance at the dragstrip is achieved with a LOW boost a pump setting. If I push more fuel at the mess, the ET and MPH slow down. My webpage has data to support this condition.

Anyway... if you guys are really interested in knowing for a fact what your air to fuel ratio is there is a new wave of wide band air/fuel ratio controllers coming to market. I just bought a LM-1 from INNOVATE Motorsports. It cost $349.00 including the sensor. The box will data log air to fuel over time, provide calibrated narrow band output (to drive a narrow band gauge) and lots of future options relating to datalogging. You have to weld a sensor bung in the exhaust to mount the wide band sensor but most exhaust shops can perform this task.

My wideband stuff and the new ACT 6 puck clutch will be installed tomorrow... I am very curious to see what my air/fuel ratio is stock. I will post results some time in the next couple of weeks.

http://N8RWS.COM

 

It's in

It took a great deal longer than the instructions said, as predicted and we didn't even do the thermostat, spark plugs or air box mods. Perhaps another time.

But, for now, WOW! What a difference. Once we had all the connections tight and the wiring done, the truck started right up. At first, it idled way low, around 400 RPM's. but after about ten minutes, it corrected that. Meanwhile we did a lot of scoping with flashlights to make sure there were no fuel leaks.

It's wet and rainy around here so I had to drive a bit conservatively to avoid lighting the tires up, but the difference is pretty obvious. It pulls like a raped ape now. I was even able to run without the ECT on and no matter how hard I tried, I couldn't make it ping, even in circumstances where I could before. Once I get some dry pavement, it will be fun to mash it a bit and see what it does.

Driving home tonight, about a 45 minute commute, it was obvious that the ECU was learning rapidly. I could feel the performance changing as I went. It will be fun to play with it a bit more tomorrow in the light and see where it takes me. I may even take the long way to work in the morning

For those who slammed the kit without even having seen it, I have nothing to say. For those who were cautiously curious, I can only tell you that so far I am quite happy with it. Check back in a couple of months and see if I stay that way.

 

Rob,
I love your enthusiasm, but do let us know after you've run for about 300+ miles, giving the ECU plenty of time to learn. How was the installation of the TRD ECU. Did you like the way it connected and fit under the dash?

Also, are you going to install the colder plugs? Did you disconnect the FMU? I would be interested in your experience with and without the FMU.

I know you want this thing to work (so do I), but please be as objective and critical as you can. We are all (?) watching you.


BTW ---
I think I figured out what I will do should I have to plumb th evacuum hose into the ISR tube. I found poly barbed couplers and I could drill and tap the PVC tube and then use PVC cement to make sure the barb doesn't work itself out. I need to know if the cement breaks down under temperature.

 

Good deal, Rob! I hope it continues to impress you?

Chris

 

Hey Rob, I don't think anyone was slamming the kit (least of all myeslf) or said it wouldn't work. In fact it seemed logical that it would......just very expensive for what it does, that's all. It is obvious that the 4runner was not designed correctly to have a supercharger when it came out so these add ons are simply to bring it back up to snuff. If anything I would chastize Toyota for not giving it what it needed right from the factory, but there are always other issues (such as cost, design time, general public use, etc) we are not aware of when they designed the vehicle. There is no excuse for the vehicle staying within optimal air/fuel ratio if they are touting a bolt on supercharger or at least supply the proper components to do so in the supercharger kit.

"The best info so far is that the additional TRD injector is not progressive at all. It is full on or off. It is not pulsed or modulated in any way. The Tundra guys say that their system goes from proper to lean, to super rich when the injector turns on, then leans out again near red line. Kind of like the old TRD FMU they used to have in the kit.

Gadget"

No modulation is definately a DESIGN bandaid in my book but that does not say that the kit is ineffective in any way especially if you are trying to eliminate the lean condition.


I am glad you like it and we'll have to hear more as you report back.


Hey Peter,
The PVC cement should work fine, just drill the hole as close as possible to the diameter of the barb. I don't think the cement breaks down any sooner than PCV does under heat.

 

WATRD-

So cool that you got the injector kit installed. Any pictures of the kit or the install? I'm optimistic about TRD stuff, and generally like the designs but not the price.

Keep us updated.

 

I can't remember who it was now, but there was a question about whether the piggy back controller plugs back in to the stock ECU. Can you clear that up for us?

I know that you remove the two left plugs and plug them into the adapter box, but are there plugs that you plug back into the ECU?

Gadget

www.GadgetOnline.com

 

As anyone who has known me a while will tell you, I have torn as many mods out of my truck for lack of performance as I have left in it. So, I will certainly remain objective

Yes, I *want* it to work, but either it will or it won't and if it doesn't, out it comes

There were a couple of posts regarding the kit talking about it being a rip off and warning members to stay away, all from authors who had never even seen it. All I am saying is that the jury is still out, let's get it on a few rigs and beat the crap out of it before we start thinking our opinions are fact. It wasn't really Gadget I was referring to, he has remained remarkably objective in my opinion, considering the work he has put into S/C fixes and the way that TRD has treated him.

Once you figure out what TRD is trying to tell you with the instructions, they make sense. You need to be a contortionist to get the junction box and new ECU up under the dash, but once you figure out what TRD wants you to do, it all fits in right where they want you to put everything. In that respect anyway, the kit was pretty well thought out. The instructions are no more or no less difficult to figure out than other aftermarket parts, they could be better, but they certainly could be a hell of a lot worse. I would put them on par with the Trailmaster instruction set.

Gadget, you remove the left two plugs from the factory computer and they plug into the TRD ECU, the harness then has two plugs that go back into the stock unit. Installing the harness was similar to octopus wrestling and getting it all back under the dash was like trying to put a five pound octopus into a sack meant for a two pound octopus. But, once you get everything in right, it seems to fit just fine.

 

Here's a shot of the kit last night...

 

I was wondering if you could find a brand name on that injector and a part number. From here it looks like a Lucas or a Bosch injector. It would be nice to know what the info on it is and from that we can figure out what the capacity is.

Also, does it plug back into the stock ECU?

Gadget

www.GadgetOnline.com

 

What ya fishin for buddy? I wonder hmmmm.

Todd

 

Does this help?



See my post above for details, but yes, the harness does plug back into the stock ECU.

 

So, they are using a 60# or 630cc single injector. That is a sufficent fuel capacity. My 305s at 80% duty cycle flow 1464cc. The TRD thing and the primary injectors is a total 1656cc at 80% duty cycle. That should be more then sufficent, well unless the pump can not keep up and I have yet to see one that can.

Gadget

www.GadgetOnline.com

 

I just did a quick Google search.


S107 HIGH-FLOW FUEL INJECTOR

This is the ultimate in compact fuel injectors. Its small size and high flow rate makes it the perfect choice for challenging EFI applications. Only 48 mm end-to-end; this injector flows 60 lbs/hr at 3 BAR (43.5 PSI); and up to 85 lbs/hr at 87 PSI! Adding to the flexibility of application, these units are high-impedance; making them compatible with most ECUs, while delivering the most flow available in a High-Impedance injector. Engine performance and running quality is enhanced through the optimized spray pattern of all MotoTron injectors. Unlike competitors “pencil stream” high flow injectors; MotoTron High Flow injectors utilize a multi-orifice tip providing a true 30 degree spray pattern for improved mixture preparation. This results in lower BSFC and better idle quality than many injectors of less flow. These injectors are also available in a “long body” package.

Comes with High Performance O-rings and inlet filter installed. Impedance - 12.5 Ohm / Flow 6.9-10.7 g/S @ 250-600 kPa

Order MotoTron PN - INJGAS00200 short body Available Now!

Price: $52.00

 

Wow, that's cheap for that large of an injector. Makes me wonder just how much TRD is making off this kit!

Chris

 

Chris,
Any time you buy performance parts from a big engine building company (I.E. TPIS - Myron Cottrel or Lingenfelter) you end up paying big markup bucks for their RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT.

Personally, I do not think this kit is that overpriced, but if this product follows the traditional pattern of TRD, they should be writing us a check for R&D.

 

True!

Chris

 

It seems like if the people running the injector kit are running on the rich side up until the high RPMs then it would seem a clear cut case of the fuel pump's inability to keep up with the demand. Sounds like you should be changing out the pump as well (maybe a Walbro or similar type) if you are going to use the kit.

Any thoughts on that?

 

Jamie,
I was not aware of this fact. Are you relating the experience of those with the 9th injector in the Tundras? Might this once again be a fault of the ECU fuel mapping or is it truly that the fuel pump cannot keep up? Would not the logical procedure be to install a good adjustable FPR and a fuel pressure gauge?

The thing that concerns me about this kit is that TRD is going to put this kit out there and then make a revision to the ECU programming that they will not admit to for future kits. It is awful that I do not trust this company (TRD) --- I have never felt this way before about any big Mfg. Even my parts guy is frustrated with the lack of information he gets about TRD products. He will sell me the kit for $1150.00 but he knows nothing about it.

 

Hey Peter,

Yep, I was referring to Gadget's statement about the Tunda so it would be very important to have someone with this kit installed to check the A/F ratio with a wideband sensor and maybe the fuel pressure at the rail as well. If it is able to stay to the rich side through the entire range, then great. If there is a lean out point similar to the Tundra guys' experience, then I would most certainly change out the fuel pump to one with more output. I would change it out simply for safety reasons and to make sure I stand on the conservative side of fuel delivery.

If we think about this for a sec, it seems to make sense that you would need to because when Gadget did his fuel mods, in order to flow enuf fuel to keep the engine in the green, the pump needed upgrading. Now you are doing the same function (adding more fuel) just with different equipment (ie the new injector kit). No matter what you do with line pressure etc, if the pump can't supply fuel fast enuf you will be into a lean condition regardless. Yes, you are also right that it could be fuel mapping but I am not sure that makes sense. The engineer's goal would be to ensure that the map keeps the car just slightly rich throughout the full RPM range of the vehicle (this may have been a problem on the earlier 4runners 96-98 but should have been corrected when they redesigned the intake on the 99-02 versions). I would be surprised if it was the mapping but this is a possiblity without seeing what the values actually are.

I must say I am quite surprised if it is true that Toyota did not modulate the injector with some sort of duty cycle because I would think the design intent would be to match the duty cycle of the other 6 injectors to keep proper A/F ratio. The whole kit (to me) is an fix for the stock injectors' inability to deliver enuf fuel. As far as I know the ECU does not compensate at every cylinder, it only has an overall reading from the MAF and O2 sensors and has to assume equal distribution of air and fuel. A simple on/off injector would surely choke the engine with fuel and completely demolish any hope of achieving proper A/F ratio.....not to mention gas mileage.