Jin_Chris

I am being prepared for AC system DIY. The first diagnostic (by myself) shows there are leaks in condenser and dryer can. Now, after reading many of those informative posts by other members, I feel I would like to try myself to replace those parts and "properly" vacuum and recharge the system myself also.

Then, getting new parts and tools, I have others opinions,

1. First for condenser, is this 68bucks ebay condenser good enough? We are usually pretty cautious about radiator quality as it critically affects engine's life. But do we need to be such cautious and stick to oem/denso quality condenser too? Or is this ebay one good enough?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/96-97...=p4506.c0.m245


2. Second, as to vacuum pump, I found this rather inexpensive gauge and venturi type vacuum pump. I believe this ebay gauge should suffice but how about that "bonus" venturi type pump? Do I need to shell out another 100bucks or so to get electric type vacuum pump?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/AC-A-...=p4506.c0.m245


3. Third, for the o-ring, Do I need special material type o-ring for A/C system or is just regular rubber ring good enough?

A/C o-ring (green color)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/270pc...=p4506.c0.m245

Rubber o-ring (black)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-R...=p4506.c0.m245



Thank you in advance for your support.
Have a great day!

FogRunner

A condenser works at much higher pressures than a radiator and refrigerant will leak out of ANY crack or pin hole, so to answer you question getting a good name brand quality condenser is very important.

You can get a spectrum premium or proliance condenser from Rockauto.com for about a $100. Also the quality of the reciver is important too. I've seen cheap knock off receiver driers that had no descant in them at all. You can gear a four seasons brand driver for $15.00 from rock auto also.

As far as that style of vacuum pump, I would avoid it for two reasons. The first reason is they don't pull a really good DEEP vacuum (29.95") and the second reason is the air consumption.

You pull a vacuum to get the air out but also the "boil" out the moisture that enters the system when you have it open. This means leaving the vacuum pumping run for 30minutes to an hr in most cases to do the job properly.

At 4.5cfm at 90PSI, is going to be allot of air to keep flowing for 30min to an hour. If you can I would recommend finding someone with a vacuum pump or going to your local A/C supply and getting a small one for around $175.00. You can make your money back by charging friends 10 bucks to vacuum out their systems.

Jin_Chris

FogRunner

You are my AC system sensei
Actually, your numerous posts about AC systems for other forum members strongly motivated me to tackle this AC problems myself. If I didn't find your informative posts, I have no choice but to probably continue to suffer and chock myself in 90degree summer weather inside of car.

Back to the topic, I still want clarify and absolutely make sure before making purchase so please bear with my repeated questions on the same topics..

1. Regarding condenser, I like your suggestion of Rockauto.com. I like that seller, I have had nothing but good experience with Rockauto. But, checking Spectra or Proliance condenser in its web page, I found multiple parts as below..

SPECTRA PREMIUM Regular inventory Part # 74744 $90.79
PROLIANCE or SPECTRA PREMIUM 6 Millimeter Construction Part # 640074 $102.89
PROLIANCE or SPECTRA PREMIUM Parallel Flow Construction Part # 644039 $119.79

What are those "6 mm" or "paraller flow" features? Are those features important?


2. Regarding vacuum pump, the reason that I was thinking to going with such venturi type is that I have 5.8cfm at 90psi compressor at home, that I can run for 30min or 1hour whatever duration I want. My question is if such venturi type is "fundamentally" inferior to electric pump even if supplied with specified air flow, then, I must go with electric pump. So, what do you think?

And if I go with electric pump, what should be the cfm rating of the electric vacuum pump? 2.5~3cfm should suffice? there are so many choices....


Sorry for repeated questions, I am just being cautious before taking steps for this rather new area...

Thank you again.

FogRunner

No problem for the repeated questions, glad to help.

As far as the condenser style go with the spectra 74744 (regular inventory) for $90.00. The parallel flow (the 74744) is a better than the 6mm tube and fin style. The parallel works like a radiator with a tank on each side vs the 6mm is a tube and fin style which IMHO tend to leak more.

If your really in a tight spot you can get away with the venturi pump if you absolutely cannot get your hands on a electric vacuum pump. If you do got with the venturi pump make sure your air compressor can put out that volume CONTINUOUSLY for at least 30 minutes. Unless its a pretty robust and definatly not an "oilless" compressor it will over heat after 10-20 min of continuous duty.

As far as electric vacuum pumps even the smallest 2-3cfm will evacuate a auto a/c system with no problems at all. One place you can just about always find a vacuum pump is the pawn shops for less than 100 bucks. Just be sure to look at the oil level window on the front. If it looks really brown and dirty it means the owner never changed the oil much and it might not pull a good vacuum.

The biggest thing to keeping a vacuum pump running good and lasting is to change the oil after EVERY use. Vacuum pump oil is DIRT cheap so there isn't any reason not to.

On a side note, if your anywhere near Houston,Tx you could drive it over and I could pull a vacuum on it for nothing (I already charged plenty of friends 10$ so my pump is paid for hehe)

Also in regards to the O-rings when you put the system back together put a little refrigerant oil in your o-rings so they don't get ripped or torn when you push the fittings in.

You can just take your old condenser and turn it on its side and get a tablespoon or two of oil out of it to rub on the O-rings.

And speaking of oil when you refill the A/C system with refrigerant shoot in a can of oil charge. Between the condenser and the receiver you will have lost some oil and some should be added.

Jin_Chris

FogRunner...........................



Ok!, in summary, this is what I am going with

1. Condenser : SPECTRA PREMIUM Regular inventory Part # 74744 $90.79
2. Vacuum pump : 2.5~3cfm or higher electric pump (should run 70~100bucks in ebay or so)
3. Gauge : should get from ebay or so. (40~50bucks)

Now, one more question, what kind of o-ring set I should get?

Black rubber o-ring or those green color oring?

A/C o-ring (green color) : http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/270pc...=p4506.c0.m245

Rubber o-ring (black) : http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-R...=p4506.c0.m245

I have bunch of black rubber oring, but I wonder if those green o-ring must be used for AC system. If so, then, I shall purchase the green o-ring set also.


By the way, thank you for your kind "invitation" to Texas. But I am afraid that I can not accept the invitation "at least" this time as I currently reside in Michigan. I will choke myself if I just drive down there with no-functioning AC in this weather. hahahahaha....

FogRunner

Don't bother with the ebay O-rings. Add the O-Ring/gasket set for $10.00 four seasons P/N 26749 on to your rock auto order.

Didn't know the temps got that high up in michigan. I just got back from nice 70 degree weather in Colorado and the 95+ degree temps 80% humidity here in Houston are horrible.

Was a great trip overall (didn't have to use the A/C) only bad part was I almost got killed on a mountain 4wheel drive trail https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f100...arning-187788/

Jin_Chris

Haha you just saved me great deal of "ordeal" which could make me wondering, counting, measuring and coloring orings etc. I am placing orders of "condenser, dryer and o-rings" all together in one-shot through rockauto.com. That will surely save me shipping. By the way, I already ordered "electric vacuum pump" 5cfm from ebay at pretty decent price.

Now, the only piece left is AC gauge which I am currently shopping around ebay, amazon etc etc... I wish rockauto also carries AC gauge... or do they?

Weather in Michigan right now is about 80deg, tomorrow it will be around 86deg, which is more than enough to toast me in the car during 30 min commuting...

Here it often goes upto 90deg or even 100deg in hot summer, not to mention that muggy hot humid effect from Great lakes. Oh! yes, it is of course freezing cold in winter... so the total temperature swing throughout whole year can be roughly 100 degree... (from single digit degree in cold winter to near 100degree in hot summer). Good is that my 97 4runner never failed to start in such cold winter nor overheated even in such hot summer...

Jin_Chris

Ok! now I have all the parts arrived. Condenser, drier, vacuum pump.
Tomorrow, I will pick up ac gauge from local part store and start tearing down the condenser. By the way, I was told that I should use "pure R134A" and good oil for AC system.

Where can I pick up such "pure R134A" and good oil for AC system.
Most of the can of R134A in local store seem to have some sort of leak sealer etc.

Anyone can recommend, brand of pure R134A can and where to buy it?

Regarding oil, can I just pick up those PAC100 oil can, which is widely available even in grocery store....? A can of PAC100 oil (4oz) enough for new Condenser?

Thank you in advance.

FogRunner

Virgin or 100% pure 134A can be found at walmart and most autoparts stores. Look for the cans of Johnsons brand 134A. You can find pure 134a you just have to really look.

As far as the oil charge Toyota specs ND-8 oil which is PAG 46. Toyota specs 1.4oz when replacing the condesner and .7oz for the receiver so 2oz-2.5 (make up what you lost in the leaking).

Rember when you charge the 134A leave the can UPRIGHT or you will hydrolock the compresser and send it hell REALLY quick. The only exception is the oil charges, you charge them upside down and SLOWLY.

Jin_Chris

FogRunner

Finally!, I finished replacing condenser & drier and also recharged the system with 2 can of pure R134A + 1 small-can of PAG46. By the way, I did this ac service for other car first, 14years old beater car, once this is successfully done, then I will work on 4Runner next.

Following is what I did for recharging,

1. Vacuum the system with 5cfm Electric pump for 45min~1hour.
2. Feed 1 can of R134A through yellow line of AC manifold gauge. Can was upright for entire cycle but it didn't feed very well. so, I did some trick. I put the can in the bucket of warm-water. Only 1/4 of bottom of the can was put in the warm-water. Then, the gas seemed being fed more smoothly.

3. Feed 1 small can of PAG46 + R134A gas through yellow line and put the can upside down. After I finished this step, I was wondering how much of oil was successfully injected into the system as some oil seemed trapped inside of gauge hoses (yellow and blue). I feel like I should have used dedicated feed line for oil....

4. Feed another can of R134A (so, now the total is 2 can's) with exactly same method as the first can.

When I just got in car, the cabin was ice cold. I conclude (at least for now), the mission was accomplished!!!

I hope all go well and the ac serves for many more years without any other issue... If it breaks down again, that means the compresser is mostly the one... But obviously, I do not want to see it happens again. I will do the test driving tomorrow morning to see if it holds the charge well....

I thank so much for your generous/expert advise on this matter. Without your encourgement/advice, I would either not even dare to do this job myself or seriously mess up the system.

Now, I will start preparing 4Runner...

FogRunner

Glad to have been of help, living in Houston I know how bad not having A/C in a car can be. Thats why I'll drive a rust bucket with bald tires and everything leaking but the A/C WILL WORK and blow ice cold air