smwells

I have a 95 4 runner w/ 165000mi; V6 w/ 5speed manual trans. It will not shift into any gear with the engine running but readily does so when the engine is turned off. Once it is in 1st gear and going, it shifts through all the gears fine. It can be downshifted through all the gears to decelerate and placed in first gear as you come to a stop. However, if you place it in neutral once you are stopped with the engine running, it will not shift into any gear. Once the engine is turned off and comes to a stop, it will go into any gear easily.
Just had a new clutch put in so that should not be the problem. Took it back to the mech. who put in the clutch and he swears it can't be the clutch and that it needs a rebuilt tranny. He seems to think it might be the synchros but I think that is horse˟˟˟˟ since it up and downshifts fine. The whole problem reeks of the clutch not fully disengaging from the flywheel. I am going to pick it up today and bring it home to do a thorough check out of the freeplay, master cylinder and slave, etc..

Anyone else have/had a similar problem? Any Advice???
Thanks!!
(sorry for the long post)
-sean

growinseed

So when the drive line i.e. wheels are turning it shift fine?
Do you have the flywheel surfaced and replace the throwout and pilot bearings when clutch was done?
Have you checked the tranny fuild level?
Just trying to collect more information. I think you might be on track with the pedal freeplay. If you can have a buddy press the clutch pedal while you watch the working (slave) cylinder to make sure you getting the movement needed to disengage the clutch.
Happy hunting.
Nathan

smwells

Tranny shifts fine while driveline is turning. As far as I know, flywheel was resurfaced (will have to re-check w/ mechanic) and throwout should have been replaced . The problem is I have no way to verify the truth of the mechanic's statements regarding these items without tearing the whole thing down (which, if I had time to do in the first place I wouldn't have had to take it in... Aaarrgh...) :mad:
I still have to check the slave but the fluid level, master, pedal freeplay, etc... all look fine.
One guy suggested pilot bushing/bearing. This sounds feasible- in that it could intermittently hang and cause the input shaft to spin even with the clutch engaged but I thought you always had some kind of grinding or grating noise when the pilot goes out..?
Any thoughts?


Thanks for the reply

Vrooooom

maybe it's the shift lever seat and bushing. I tried that first when my tranny was having difficulties shifting. It worked. It's cheap. Try it.

http://www.off-road.com/toyota/tech/shifter/index.html

Fahrenheit 451

You have reached the psychic auto repair hot line
....Karnak, says, "Your pressure plate is shot, or your clutch master cylinder, or your clutch slave cylinder..." Gotta cover the bases LOL!
Ok, granted that is just a guess, but it sure sounds familiar to me. I had a tranny that did almost exactly what you are mentioning except that in order to upshift and downshift, it had to be in the shift range for the synchros. What happened on mine is that two of the rivets by the "fingers" on the pressure plate broke off and got bound up in the clutch assembly. This had the effect of making it so the clutch would not release at all or sometimes not release fully.
When you depress the clutch pedal do the RPMs go up? This would point to the clutch actually releasing. If your tranny is in good shape you can go through all the gears with a bad clutch as long as the problem is that the clutch isn't releasing.
Other suspects, check the pedal freeplay to make sure the clutch is actually being disengaged. If there is too much freeplay you won't be able to press the pedal far enough in. The adjustment is at the clutch pedal itself. You will see a rod with adjusting nuts on it. You should be able to get a pretty good idea if that is the problem just by how the pedal feels. If when you press it there is a bunch of slop before any resistance that might be the problem.
Also, it could well be the clutch master cylinder. Hooked up to the old tired pressure plate a weak master cylinder could still provide enough hydraulic pressure. With a new pressure plate it could be that the fluid in the master cylinder is bypassing the piston enough such that there isn't enough hydraulic pressure to work the clutch. From what I hear, if the clutch slave cylinder is bad you will find out really quickly since apparently they tend to be real drama queens when they die and simply blow the seal and shoot hydraulic fluid everywhere.
Good luck!

Duh...just reread your post and saw that you had already done some of what I said LOL!

DarylD

Check the clutch pedal bracket. Sounds like its broken.This is the bracket under the dash that also holds the brake pedal.

smwells

Thanks to all for the input. I have checked both of the cylinders and the bracket; all are good. So, here is my proposed course of action: First, The yellow guy is me, the green guy is my former mechanic Wo ah Ha hahahaha
Second, I am going to replace the shift lever bushing and seat- just on the tiniest remote chance that is it (hey, you never know). If that doesn't fix it, as I guess it won't, I am going to pull the trans and inspect/replace the pilot bearing. As I understand it, one or more of the needles can be damaged without compromising the functionality of the bearing most of the time. Those few times when the damaged needles go astray it causes an entrapment of the input shaft with resultant inability to shift even though all the other clutch components are working fine. I guess if the pilot bearing looks fine while the trans is out and all other parts are functioning correctly then it's off to the rebuild shop with mr. transmission. Thanks for all the good advise, I will keep y'all posted.
Thanks,

west_89_

i am having the same issue as smwells in my 88 pick up 4x4 3vz-e 5 speed. i just had the clutch redone by a bcaa approved shop and they replaced everything throw out and pilot bearing and resurfaced flywheel. i replace the master and slave as well as the bracket. but still i am having the issue when i come to a stop and take it out of gear and my foot off the clutch it will not go back in to gear. i was thinking it is my shifter and linkage. but i just thought i would let you know im having the same issue.

west_89_

http://www.off-road.com/toyota/tech/shifter/index.html also this link does not work id really like to take a look at it for the shift lever seat and bushing.

93toyrunner2

http://www.ncttora.com/FSM/1990-1995...2/assembly.pdf
Page #2, Step 4

hamish_18

Clutch disk was put in backwards is what this sounds like!!! If you put the clutch in, with the motor running, and try reverse does it grind real bad? As if the tranny has not spun down to let you engage the gear? It's really bad, but you can shift without a clutch while moving.. just fyi.