Definitely but even with out doing it I'm convinced the injectors arent getting signal but that will confirm it, just not sure what to do from there.

 

well then your to resistor is it getting power is it getting signal from the ecu? are the wires to the ecu intact are they sending signal

again this sounds like terry's open air pipe to the AFM which no air flow shuts the engine down

also since she misfired an has been giving ya issues might want to clean/check the plugs JUST to make sure when you do find the problem the plugs dont mask it leaving you to think its still acting up (dont forget anrtiseize on the plug threads)

 

Jason,.... Any luck with the buddies ECU? ...... Getting PIIIIIIFFED FOR you a this point!

Quick update would be good and I'm curious..., actually I'm positive knowing you, being a good mechanic... You have checked and it runs on ether ... So from the, let's just check A-Z of things here......

I can't store as much info as I could in my twenties... So sometimes I lose pieces of the puzzle. My gremlin's are very tricky.... Because with mine, its running... You would think rolling through the items that could be involved from there a little more easily and then finding it would be the case... However, since I don't want to throw brand new parts at it all the time... Well, I guess you could say at this point I'm probably screwed until I do! Lol.

1. We turn the key just past on....

2. C.O.R. gets permission from IGN Switch....

3. AFM completes that circuit and the Fuel Pump is engaged....

4. Fuel Pressure Builds enough to engage ingectors...

5. Then, as key fully contacts IGN current to starter, the flywheel turns.....

6. As motor turns over, fuel is at the rail (should be), timing chain is engaged and turns dizzy cam gear....

7. Dizzy contacts points and secondary coil. ...

8. Secondary signals Ignitor...

9. Ignitor signals ECU

10. Injector Resistor is constantly powered up but not ground until No.10 & No.20 pins switch ground....

11. No.10 & No.20 pins signal injector pairs to fire by switched ground that runs off lower-rear intake bolt (ECU is ground at that bolt, No.10 & No.20 are grounded with each ignitor indication so then the power coming from the resistor is then grounded with each pulse) ....

12. As dizzy contacts points after secondary coil, (as fuel is being compressed) the spark is sent through the coil as it hits each of 4 contacts...

13. Fuel is ignited and returns piston and as the motor comes back around, #7-#13 all over again. ....

I'm trying to refresh, so if I'm missing something, let me know?

I know other things are involved in the EFI system, but as far as turning over and firing up,... isn't that the most of it?

Since you have spark, and as it was running before.... What could possibly be cutting ur injector pulse all the sudden?

You said you swapped in a known good injector resistor... Nothing.

Dizzy/secondary/ignitor and ECU....

You're sure you have fuel pressure, yes? CSI, I thought at least, should be giving A LITTLE gogo, initially.... I would think it would Sputter.

You also said that you are getting it no power to the injector connector which should be coming from No.10 & No.20 pins.

 

Hey mark the short of it is I got called back to work early so I didn't get a chance to try the ECU however he did say come grab it when I get back.
The power for the injectors comes from the resister on the passenger side fender, they ground through 10/20. I do have fuel presure and it will fire momentarily off the CSI, if the igniter were bad it SHOULD be throwing a code for it but I did swap in another just in case. I have learned a few things and there are a couple things I want to check, I am convinced that the injector signal is not grounding post ECU I have check what I believe to be those wires but not in the way I should have. I will figure this thing out I just might be bald before its over.

 

mark me an jason were on the phone for quite a bit yesterday an think we got it narrowed down to only one thing at this point

ecu the part that controls the injectors is not functioning

wiring checks out
resistor is feeding power an its to the injectors
he noid lighted the injectors an they arent getting signal to fire
coil good
afm good

engine runs on a leaking CSI due to the fuel pressure being lower it allows the CSI to leak gas into the intake full pressure an it seals off an doesnt leak fuel for the engine to run
connectors all good

as sherlock holmes has said in many a book when all else is proven false then the impossible or unlikely must be true

my phone died while talking to jason (i left a message jason sorry bout that) to double check the ECU was getting power but its showing up a check engine light with a code not related to the running

the injector controls in the ecu arent workin i PM'd a couple things to jason one was a PDF on testing an 85 ecu i think but the tests were very limited i did find out the87 ecu will fit his 86 fine an 85 depending on the truck its out of might an might not

 

Thanks guys, I corrected above and you can let me know if I got it right. When ECU gets signal from ignitor, it sends a signal to the injector resistor which then opens power from the number 10 number 20 pins... ? Anyway, it sounded as though Jason was saying he got power to the injectors for the noid but no ground. I'm just kind of curious maybe you could explain how voltage could even get to the connector to light a noid if there is no ground? I could have sworn jason said he could not get the noid light to light up.

 

he used his volt meeter to show power to the injectors an the wiring would logically be good as well

the resistor is feeding a constant power to them its the switching ground controls by the ecu that fires them

 

Right, ok. ... But it is the igniter that tell them when to pulse, correct?

 

It is my understanding that you are correct mark, I don't completely understand that side of the system but I do know that the injectors are basicly timed by the distributor/coil ignitor.

 

Corrected my above numbered list for the 3rd time.... Is it right as u understand it? Hahahaha

 

If you say its right then that's the way I understand it lol.

 

I dug into the FSM to find out how to check the igniter. It isnt listed in Haynes. I dont think I could do the 1.5 battery test in 5 seconds, but with the key ON and doing voltage checks should be a quick and easy test. I never could find how to test the igniter til today. Besides, I needed to bump to you the top to find you a little more easily.

Copied...
I found out that my coil is bad. It will pass the secondary resistance checks but fails the primary resistance checks. I had to look into the FSM on how to test the Igniter. I wanted to post the information up, but Photobucket isnt uploading right now. Test for it isnt in Haynes but is in the FSM.

It should be .5-.7


I have not been able to find out how to test in Haynes or on the net. This is out of my FSM. Electric test is easy. The screw is the ground to the igniter with the bracket. With the key on you just look for 12 volts from the ground screw to each of the coils post. Where you hook up the battery it says you have 5 seconds. I think I will pass doing that test. It would take me 5 seconds just to see what is on the meter. My eyes are not as fast as they used to be.


Igniter ground screw.

 

Well I finally found a few minutes to get out and work on the runner, and at my pace I set set myself back about 3 years.
Ok here's what happend or better said what I did because I honestly done know what happened, I got the wireing harness retaped and put the plenum back on hooked everything back up, plugged the computer back in, and put the charger on it because its sat so long. Ok tried cranking it and the same old thing it would fire for a few seconds and die, I decided to change around the harness ground (which sparked alittle as I was clamping it down, I had left the key on) this is the ground I thought was giving me problems. Anyway tried to start it again and poof it caught on FIRE, by the time I got it out there was extensive damage under the hood ( folks don't be an idiot like me. Keep a damn fire extinguser in your work space). The damage from what I can tell is most if not all of the engine harness, 2,3,and 4 injector plugs for sure, the igniter wire all of the vacume lines towards the back of the engine. This might seriously be the last straw for me.

 

oh man jason was it a fuel leak?

dont give up on her jason

 

Im not sure what started it, I meen I know it was fuel but Im not sure where or how it started.
Im not sure what Im going to do with it, I dont want to give up on it but at some point Im going to say its enough.

 

a few pics of the damge I can see.

 

paint on the top of the hood bubbled? hope its okay
from the look of it looks like the CSI line leaked

 

I thought at first the paint took a hit on top but looking at it today I think its OK. I'm thinking CSI line as well its just been moved so many times pulling and reinstalling the plenum, no idea what ignited it tho.

 

Holy crapoly! I'm so sorry man! I can imagine how frustrated you are this point! I wouldn't try to tell you what to do, but if you need help finding the harness or something of that sort, let me know. I would venture to guess that if the CSI was leaking as you turn the key to on or left it in the on position, it leaked down on to the starter and created arc, as when you touch a screwdriver across the posts. As far as I remember from HAZWOPER training, I believe that since the vapor is what a night anyway, that might have been all that it took? SOOOOO SORRY BUD!

 

Thanks mark I may just take you up on the harness hunt.

After a lot of thinking I have come up with a plan for my runner, moth ball it until terry has time to take over it and finish it up. I have spent a lot of time speaking with terry about this and he has agreed to take it on for me. I have to admit part of me feels as though I'm giving up but another part of me is relieved to know that someone that takes a lot of pride in his work and has a passion for these trucks is going to work his magic on my truck.
Terry and I are working on a list of the work that needs done, things I want done and things he finds that need attention.
It will be a month or so before I can get it transported up to him and in the meantime I will be sorceing parts and materials that he will need to do the job.
I'm looking very forward to getting this going, and at some point getting the 4runner of my dreams back. Folks I promise I would love to complete this entire project on my own, but after nearly 7 years of working on it I'm just burnt out, and with the fire damage its just to much for the limited time that I have to devote to it, Terrys attention to detail is second to none and I'm anxious to see what this turns out to be.
I will be posting a parts and to do list soon, its going to be very strange seeing progress on my build thread that I am not doing but I know it could not be in better hands.
Thanks you to everyone that has spent countless hours online and on the phone with trying to get this old girl back on the road, and thank you so much terry for agreeing to help me get it to the finish line.