When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
Not an expert by any means but the other day had an alignment done on the truck. I noticed on the print out the rear axle had +.16deg toe out on the drivers side and the passenger side has -.16deg toe in, if i were to pull the passenger side of the axle back just a tad or drivers side forward could i conceivably get the toe back to zero or is it not enough to worry about. Seems with the toe beinging exact opposites??? I might have the axle in at a slight angle. Have had the axle in & out a number of times over the years. Thrust angle is also.16deg.
cheers
Andy, a thrust angle of .16 is nothing to worry about. Realize that that is less than two tenths of one degree. The left side toe out matching the right side toe in is a good sign and none of these measurements will cause tire wear or drivability issues. If the thrust angle were large enough it could cause your steering wheel to be cocked to one side when driving straight ahead on a flat road, but that is adjustable with the front toe adjusters. It could also cause your truck to "dog track" with the rear end not following the front and this is usually not noticeable from the driver's seat and is most evident to someone following you seeing the truck going slightly sideways down the road.
Keaton, you haven't told what vehicle these alignment readings came from. your numbers for the rear are also very small and should not cause any issues. The total toe of .19 will add slightly to rear tire wear, but would still be very minimal. If this is a solid rear axle there isn't much you could do about it. If there is a noticeable "dog tracking" issue you could try to shift the rear end slightly, but I doubt if it is necessary. If this is a lifted vehicle (especially 4 runners with a track bar) or the rear is sagging it can effect the numbers. Also, your front caster/camber readings are good to fight the typical "road crown" that causes all vehicles to drift slightly to the right, (roads are built this way on purpose to allow water to run off and cars to drift towards the ditch instead of towards oncoming traffic).
Another couple of points you should both realize is that with most alignment machines you can remove and replace the sensor heads and repeat the alignment and you will get slightly different numbers. A little more sag in one rear spring than the other will effect these numbers also (loading of tools, equipment or accessories also).
I was an alignment tech for 10+ years so I am quite comfortable with the subject if you anyone has questions, but please include information about vehicle type, aftermarket suspensions and such. The printout like Keaton included is super helpful.
Andy, a thrust angle of .16 is nothing to worry about. Realize that that is less than two tenths of one degree. The left side toe out matching the right side toe in is a good sign and none of these measurements will cause tire wear or drivability issues. If the thrust angle were large enough it could cause your steering wheel to be cocked to one side when driving straight ahead on a flat road, but that is adjustable with the front toe adjusters. It could also cause your truck to "dog track" with the rear end not following the front and this is usually not noticeable from the driver's seat and is most evident to someone following you seeing the truck going slightly sideways down the road.
Keaton, you haven't told what vehicle these alignment readings came from. your numbers for the rear are also very small and should not cause any issues. The total toe of .19 will add slightly to rear tire wear, but would still be very minimal. If this is a solid rear axle there isn't much you could do about it. If there is a noticeable "dog tracking" issue you could try to shift the rear end slightly, but I doubt if it is necessary. If this is a lifted vehicle (especially 4 runners with a track bar) or the rear is sagging it can effect the numbers. Also, your front caster/camber readings are good to fight the typical "road crown" that causes all vehicles to drift slightly to the right, (roads are built this way on purpose to allow water to run off and cars to drift towards the ditch instead of towards oncoming traffic).
Another couple of points you should both realize is that with most alignment machines you can remove and replace the sensor heads and repeat the alignment and you will get slightly different numbers. A little more sag in one rear spring than the other will effect these numbers also (loading of tools, equipment or accessories also).
I was an alignment tech for 10+ years so I am quite comfortable with the subject if you anyone has questions, but please include information about vehicle type, aftermarket suspensions and such. The printout like Keaton included is super helpful.
AK—thanks for the detailed reply. I appreciate it and, no doubt, so does OP. That printout is from my 1993 Toyota 4Runner. Stock height with Moog replacement coils to fix the sag. My only issue with the truck is the severe vibration and shake on the interstate. As such I’ve been taking a look at every single number available to me to try to pinpoint the issue. Thanks
AK—thanks for the detailed reply. I appreciate it and, no doubt, so does OP. That printout is from my 1993 Toyota 4Runner. Stock height with Moog replacement coils to fix the sag. My only issue with the truck is the severe vibration and shake on the interstate. As such I’ve been taking a look at every single number available to me to try to pinpoint the issue. Thanks
Keaton, it is generally considered that alignment will not cause a vibration. it can cause tire wear which can cause vibration. For a sever vibration the first thing I always look at is tires/wheels and not just for balance. I always watch them when they are spinning on the balancer to see if the tire is out of round or the wheel is bent (even slightly). If that doesn't reveal anything I would look u-joints and driveshafts for play and proper phasing, then I would block the vehicle off of the ground and let it run in gear so you can watch the wheels spinning at an idle to see if the axles are slightly bent.
Of course the best way to diagnose a vibration is to use an ass-ometer, but they don't work long distance. The frequency (hertz) can tell a lot about the issue, fast (high frequency) is likely something at driveline speed, slow (lower frequency) would be wheel speed, very high frequency could be engine or accessory belt speed. Location is also very important, does your steering wheel shimmy when you let go? do you feel the vibration more through the seat? Does it change when you touch the brakes? how about when you corner/turn?
Keaton, it is generally considered that alignment will not cause a vibration. it can cause tire wear which can cause vibration. For a sever vibration the first thing I always look at is tires/wheels and not just for balance. I always watch them when they are spinning on the balancer to see if the tire is out of round or the wheel is bent (even slightly). If that doesn't reveal anything I would look u-joints and driveshafts for play and proper phasing, then I would block the vehicle off of the ground and let it run in gear so you can watch the wheels spinning at an idle to see if the axles are slightly bent.
Of course the best way to diagnose a vibration is to use an ass-ometer, but they don't work long distance. The frequency (hertz) can tell a lot about the issue, fast (high frequency) is likely something at driveline speed, slow (lower frequency) would be wheel speed, very high frequency could be engine or accessory belt speed. Location is also very important, does your steering wheel shimmy when you let go? do you feel the vibration more through the seat? Does it change when you touch the brakes? how about when you corner/turn?
So, I've replaced the rear axles since I thought one was a bit bent, but it didn't change. Swapped tires and wheels with another truck, didn't change. New u joints AND driveshaft. The only thing I haven't checked is phasing. I've driven around with just the front DS in though and it still shook. I've let it run in gear, but just the back wheels. A shop told me the issue was in the front. I think it is a low frequency shake. It is speed related, not RPM related. Steering wheel doesn't have shimmy, except when I brake but that is because of the left front rotor being warped. That is going to be replaced in short order though. I feel it in my butt, the other passenger seat shakes when no one is in it. Seriously--check my thread. I'm running out of ideas. The shake doesn't change when I touch the brakes, but if I'm accelerating faster or decelerating faster, it feels more severe. I feel like when I go over bumps it stops shaking, but turning doesn't seem to affect it.
Thank you! I wish I could borrow your ass-ometer for a while
No worries on hijacking, from 128keaton, it helps me learn. Akwheeler thanks for the input leaves me more reassured that everything is okay. Trying to get some coffee in me now so i can come to life. Will post up my alignment sheet a little later so you can see it. For some reason that little bit of toe was bothering me.
your numbers look great Andy, don't worry about any of it unless you find loose parts later down the road. Rotate your tires occasionally and drive it like you stole it.
Thanks akwheeler! Replaced everything in the front end last summer @ approx 245000 miles except the shocks & steering dampener which is on my list for "real soon" as the dampener is original and the shocks have at least 200000 miles on them, some old Rancho 9000's. Have owned truck since new.
control arm bushings
wheel bearings
tie rods
idler arm
pitman arm
steering knuckle bushings, needle bearings
rotors
ball joints
All toyota parts except bushings (poly) and idler arm (Proforged)
Everything in the rear end was replaced/rebuilt about 2 yrs back.
leaf spring & shackle bushings
axle bearings / seals
rebuild of differential
I knew better and now regret not getting the alignment done right after the front end rebuild as it really ate the tires up. So hopefully I should not see any loose parts for awhile.
2019 stock Toyota Tacoma driver rear toe off by 2 degrees.
Originally Posted by 128keaton
AK—thanks for the detailed reply. I appreciate it and, no doubt, so does OP. That printout is from my 1993 Toyota 4Runner. Stock height with Moog replacement coils to fix the sag. My only issue with the truck is the severe vibration and shake on the interstate. As such I’ve been taking a look at every single number available to me to try to pinpoint the issue. Thanks
I am new here and to all of this, so forgive me if there is missing info, and forgive me for lack of exact terms and knowledge. I bought my 2019 Toyota tacoma sport 4dr long bed like 2.5 Ish years ago. I went through the set of tires that were on it pretty quickly, they were maybe half life, don’t know for sure, didn’t measure and didn’t expect these issues. The second set lasted 7 months and 7,000 miles. Yes, both of those were with a heavy foot, and I have fixed that. This third set I’ve had for 1.5 years and 10,000 miles and they are almost needing to be replaced. They are wearing a good amount more in the outisde than the inside even though I’ve had regular rotations/balancing and alignment checks.
Today I took it in with the tire eating concerns, and a couple other concerns.
-The driver rear side seems to sit lower than the passenger rear side sometimes, especially noticeable when towing my ATV trailer with it. The trailer is all aluminum and small, and it only has 2 ATV’s on it, so the whole setup can’t be more than 2,500 lbs gear fuel and all.
-The truck in 2WD is way worse in any slick conditions than any other rear wheel drive vehicle I’ve ever had. Like you can feel the back end shifting side to side A LOT more than you would expect and it’s a safety concern.
The tire shop said that my right rear tires toe is off 2 degrees. I asked for the printout, but they didn’t charge me anything and didn’t do the rotation or alignment because of what they found, and didn’t have a printout for me. I am almost thinking that he meant 2 degrees of positive camber since that’s how the tires are wearing, and what it sounded like he was describing when we talked. It does appear that both the left and right side rear tires are both wearing in the same manner, more wear on the outer part of the tires/more tread in the inner part of the tires. He was saying something about the driver side being off causing the passenger side to also be off, or bent axle or frame.
none of this sounds good. Just to add too, the only time I notice anything off when driving the truck is in slippery conditions it has absolutely crappy traction in 2WD.
many thoughts on this and how to proceed? I’d appreciate any and all comments and feedback.
I am new here and to all of this, so forgive me if there is missing info, and forgive me for lack of exact terms and knowledge. I bought my 2019 Toyota tacoma sport 4dr long bed like 2.5 Ish years ago. I went through the set of tires that were on it pretty quickly, they were maybe half life, don’t know for sure, didn’t measure and didn’t expect these issues. The second set lasted 7 months and 7,000 miles. Yes, both of those were with a heavy foot, and I have fixed that. This third set I’ve had for 1.5 years and 10,000 miles and they are almost needing to be replaced. They are wearing a good amount more in the outisde than the inside even though I’ve had regular rotations/balancing and alignment checks.
Today I took it in with the tire eating concerns, and a couple other concerns.
-The driver rear side seems to sit lower than the passenger rear side sometimes, especially noticeable when towing my ATV trailer with it. The trailer is all aluminum and small, and it only has 2 ATV’s on it, so the whole setup can’t be more than 2,500 lbs gear fuel and all.
-The truck in 2WD is way worse in any slick conditions than any other rear wheel drive vehicle I’ve ever had. Like you can feel the back end shifting side to side A LOT more than you would expect and it’s a safety concern.
The tire shop said that my right rear tires toe is off 2 degrees. I asked for the printout, but they didn’t charge me anything and didn’t do the rotation or alignment because of what they found, and didn’t have a printout for me. I am almost thinking that he meant 2 degrees of positive camber since that’s how the tires are wearing, and what it sounded like he was describing when we talked. It does appear that both the left and right side rear tires are both wearing in the same manner, more wear on the outer part of the tires/more tread in the inner part of the tires. He was saying something about the driver side being off causing the passenger side to also be off, or bent axle or frame.
none of this sounds good. Just to add too, the only time I notice anything off when driving the truck is in slippery conditions it has absolutely crappy traction in 2WD.
many thoughts on this and how to proceed? I’d appreciate any and all comments and feedback.
thank you.
I am not familiar with the rear suspension/setup on the newer trucks, is this independent rear suspension or still a solid axle?
You can't align a solid rear axle other than to make sure it isn't bent and sits square in the vehicle (thrust angle).
If you had the truck in an alignment shop and hooked up to their machine but they didn't or wouldn't give you a printout or even tell you what needs fixing you have the wrong shop.
Your comment about crappy traction in 2wd may also indicate that your rear axle is bent (I'm assuming it is a solid axle).
Thank you for your reply, yes it is a solid rear axle.
I figured I should come here and update you all.
I took it to an off road shop near me yesterday and they checked it out. The driver rear is positive toe 1.78 degrees while the passenger rear toe is -0.24…. Diagnosis is a bent axle…. It is a restored title, and we checked the vin on google to see the accident that totaled it, and it was hit hard on the driver rear pushing the axle forward. They must’ve replaced all the suspension and not spent much time checking(or caring about) the driver rear toe.. of course they had it inspected, and I hear that protects them from liabilities like these. Does anyone know if that’s true? Or do I have a leg to stand on for getting the dealer to replace the axle? I’ve had it for 2.5 or so years.
so that shop is quoting me $2,500 for a used axle off a Tacoma that is totaled from a front end collision with 66k miles(mine has 27k miles) with a 12k mile 12 month warranty. Total after labor and tax is $3,700 to replace the axle. Does this sound reasonable?
I’ll share photos of the alignment report, and the report that the tire shop gave me in my paperwork when buying the first set of tires from them. It does show the same rear toe issue and they didn’t catch it/didn’t say anything. The second set of tires looking at the report it looks like they didn’t even hook up the rear tires, so nothing is shown for them, shared that report also.
any advice or comments here would be greatly appreciated.
thank you.
Last edited by 2019 Stock Tacoma; 03-15-2023 at 02:27 AM.
04-09-2018, 04:56 AM
