justinking060310

Pictures will be at the bottom

OK, so we picked this girl up for $1000. The intent is to repair and replace(correctly, no ghetto rigging) any issues and then resell for some profit, hopefully.

Shes a 1994 4Runner v6 Auto 4x4... We have taken the running boards off and added some 33x12.5 BFG a/t's on 15x8 Cragar Black Steel rims. The rims have 4" of backspace and surprisingly arent hitting anything when i turn and drive at full lock in the driveway. I am almost positive they will hit when the suspension compresses. So, we are looking at a 4crawler body lift(for monetary reasons) because I just want to clear the tires and give it the off-road look that seems to sell quite well around where we live.

The interior is in extremely good condition for 150k miles on the truck. It has a 3 inch tear in the driver seat and a crack in the cargo plastic. As far as the prior owners maintenence, he says that the HG and timing were done around 100k. that is all the more info he has given me. I checked and all the recalls are up to date.

So moving on to the adventure at hand the motor has a knocking sound - IE why it was bought for 1000 bucks. I used my stethescope and determined that the knock is in the passenger side head, so I am hoping I only have a valve problem because it sounds just like a valve tap to me. I put the scope on the front and rear of the oil pan and could not hear the ticking sound. I put it on the driver side head, and no ticking sound, only when it is on the passenger side valve cover do I hear it and it is pretty loud.

I did a wet(i put 1 teaspoon of oil in each cyliner and rolled the motor over 6 times and then did the tests) and a dry compression check this morning so I could post it and get you guys to analize it with me. So, here is the results:

Cyl 5 cyl 6
dry - 220 dry - 210
wet - 227 wet - 220

cyl 3 cyl 4
dry - 172 dry - 196
wet - 178 wet - 225

cyl 1 cyl 2
dry - 185 dry - 196
wet - 214 wet - 218

The literature that came with my craftsman compression gauge says:

"if 2 adjacent cylinders show pressure readings of 20 or more pounds below the other cylinder readings, suspect a blown head gasket.

if a cylinder shows 15 or more pounds higher than the other cylinders the probable cause is carbon buildup.

REGARDING results after wet compression test:
if the readings during the wet compression test are greater, then air is leaking around worn or damaged piston rings. If the reading is approximatly the same for both wet and dry tests, then the valves, valve lifters, or the camshaft lobes are worn. Any low reading of cylinder compression indicates worn or damaged parts."

and according to the Toyota FSM i should have 171 PSI on all cylinders with a minimum of 142 psi and is should have a difference of 14 PSI or less.


NOW, for the diagnosis - I am thinking maybe i have a valvetrain problem on the passenger side, and then maybe a blown HG between cylinders 3 and 5.

What does everyone else think?

If you took the time to read this, I thank you. I will be posting all pictures and tech for this project in this thread, so stay tuned because we will find the problem one way or the other - I am just hoping that the shortblock will be good to go.


Kat

Depending what is done on the motor the price may go up but I am shooting for the 5400 mark if I dont have to tear into the shortblock. I have sold 3 Toyotas now for between 5500-6500 and they were all lifted and had the off-road look to them...

Pictures

justinking060310

Just drained the coolant and the oil - everything looked good - no oil in coolant or water in oil...

sdstud212001

How dare you trick me with false promises of pictures.

justinking060310

ok ok, pictures are up- got the pqassenger side valve cover off - look at what I found - anybody wanna venture a guess as to what i should do now?

Jay351

Good luck on the build keep us posted!

p.s who's jeep?

Weasy2k

How is the cam lobe? If its a bit worn it could still be used to grind down which will remove any wearing on the lobe itself....

damn that blasted pass side cam...everyone has hell with just that side...

The clearances were probably pretty extreme on that valve and it spat the shim out. As far as your compression test....im doubting that its HG there...that cyl's rings or wall may be shot. Do you have access to a leak down tester? They are pretty cheap and can tell you what is worn out better then a compression test.

justinking060310

Heres a couple shots of the passenger side cam -





I also checked my valve clearances(this is the first time I have ever done this, so i may need to go check again for accuracy because I am somewhat unsure about the rotate 120* as the FSM states - I mean i know how to do 120* but how do you know its right on, or does it matter?)

Cyl 5 in - .005 cyl 6 in - .011
cyl 5 ex - .008 cyl 6 ex - .007

cyl 3 in - .006 cyl 4 in - .009
cyl 3 ex - .011 cyl 4 ex - .008

cyl 1 in - .008 cyl 2 in - .010
cyl 1 ex - .005 cyl 2 ex - .010


Can some of you help me decipher this? Where do I go from here. Do you think that the cam/shim thing is what was causing the ticking and that is all I need to fix? I need help with the diagnosis's from you experts around here...

Katie...

justinking060310

I just reread Johnny's post - my compression gauge set has an "air hold" thing that makes the cylinders hold the air, thats different from a leak down tester, right?

If a leakdown tester isnt too much, I could pick one up early this week, Should the sear's have one? What will it tell me?

Kat

Weasy2k

Ok from the picture it looks like the cam is still in decent shape and that can be reground out with the same cam profile i made for you last time Of course i have to take it to the shop to verify that.

The ticking sound DEFIANTLY came from what you see there...100% sure of that, if you said it was from the cam cover.

All compression testers have leak hold and that is just so you can read the gauge after cranking the engine vs having the gauge goto zero as soon as the engine stops turning.

What leak down tests do is tell you where the compression loss is occuring...what you do is pressurize the cyl with air compressor and there is alittle gauge ont he tester that tells you how much % loss there is in the cyl. Then you listen to where it is coming from...tail pipe? (exhaust valve leak) TB? (intake valve leak) oil cap? (bad or worn rings)

TNRabbit

Kat, how in the hell did you get a valve reading with the shim missing??

justinking060310

?! I dont know - thats the feeler gauge that fit, it wasnt like there was a 1/2" gap there??

TNRabbit

Damn, you're up early!

I'd pull those cams off & check those valve springs well. I'd pretty much bet on replacing everything from the valve that had the missing shim.

Bumpin' Yota

WoW!

Kat, take a look at your FSM, it will specify the proper ranges for the valve shim clearances. As far as the 120*, that is meant - turn the camshaft until the lobe you are measuring is as far from the shim as possible. make sense?

Weasy2k

kat i wonder if you were hitting the lifters outer walls (which holds the shim inside)...hrmm even that is odd...the feeler gauge would bend...

something is messed up that shim shot out somehow..

justinking060310

"Kat, take a look at your FSM, it will specify the proper ranges for the valve shim clearances. As far as the 120*, that is meant - turn the camshaft until the lobe you are measuring is as far from the shim as possible. make sense?"

So, is the furthest point when the lobe is facing straight up from the shim? would that be the correct place to put them? Thats probably the source of a problem for my measurments then, because I just eyeballed 120* each time and measured --

Thanks Bumpin and Johnny -
I will post results when I get home

I went to sears looking for a leakdown test kit and they didnt have one, neither did northern, is this something I am going to have to order online? anyone have a local suggestions? I am going to try carquest on the way home...

Kat

Weasy2k

wow they both dont have one? They are very common tools....

Yea Kat just shim with the lobe facing straight up they should just have mentioned that in the fsm

justinking060310

They just say to rotate 120* and you have to do it like 3 or 4 times throughout the process, therefore there is quite a bit of room for error - I will get good readings tonight - From what you guys are saying the one without the shim shoud have a "huge" gap, right?

justinking060310

another question - do I have to bolt the valve covers and the intake and everything back together for this leak down test?

Weasy2k

nope you just remove the spark plug and turn the crank over until the cyl that you are testing has both intake and exhaust valves closed.

justinking060310

It is pouring rain~ argh~ I have to wait till tomorrow to test valve clearances.

For the sake of the thread and my own sanity, will you make sure I know how to tell that both valves are closed? would that be cam lobes straight up or down?(down i think)

I am getting ready to order a leakdown test kit(~$75) and I found this table:
****I ordered this leakdown detector on Ebay - $60 *****
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/OTC-5...ayphotohosting


Air leakage Table:
Leaking out the exhaust = Exhaust Valve
Leaking into the intake/throttle plate = Intake Valve
Air bubbles in the top of the radiator(take off the rad cap) or into the adjacent cylinder = headgasket
Oil cap, Dipstick, Bottem end = Piston Rings

****THANKS FOR ALL THE HELP GUYS!!!****