Famous "high idle/surge" culprits!
Apr 22, 2008 | 03:17 PM
#121
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From: Sweet Home, OR
o yes btw my engine leaks oil and has a few other quirks in it that I would just feel better with a rebuilt engine from Oregon Engine Rebuilders, seeing as its like an hour and a half drive from here.
Apr 22, 2008 | 03:19 PM
#122
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From: Salem, OR
Is it really? Yeah, mine has been leaking pretty bad lately (good example of why not to fill it up with too much oil!!!) I prefer doing my own work. Would yours be easier than mine? All the bolts are in different places on the intake. Its all fubared up...thats how I bought it
Apr 22, 2008 | 03:37 PM
#123
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From: Sweet Home, OR
I can't think about how it would be any harder? You'd have to get a different model, post-85, but other than that it should be just as easy. Plus you get a lifetime unlimited mileage warranty.
Oh yes and get the longblock that way you just have to put the intake plenum, exhaust, and accessories on there. Then you don't have to worry about drilling out er I mean breaking off the bolts.
FYI- post-85 22r(e) is $1,095 for a longblock
http://www.oregonengines.net/home.nxg
Oh yes and get the longblock that way you just have to put the intake plenum, exhaust, and accessories on there. Then you don't have to worry about drilling out er I mean breaking off the bolts.
FYI- post-85 22r(e) is $1,095 for a longblock
http://www.oregonengines.net/home.nxg
Last edited by rowdy235; Apr 22, 2008 at 03:40 PM.
Apr 22, 2008 | 03:50 PM
#124
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From: Salem, OR
I can't think about how it would be any harder? You'd have to get a different model, post-85, but other than that it should be just as easy. Plus you get a lifetime unlimited mileage warranty.
Oh yes and get the longblock that way you just have to put the intake plenum, exhaust, and accessories on there. Then you don't have to worry about drilling out er I mean breaking off the bolts.
FYI- post-85 22r(e) is $1,095 for a longblock
http://www.oregonengines.net/home.nxg
Oh yes and get the longblock that way you just have to put the intake plenum, exhaust, and accessories on there. Then you don't have to worry about drilling out er I mean breaking off the bolts.
FYI- post-85 22r(e) is $1,095 for a longblock
http://www.oregonengines.net/home.nxg
What do you mean breaking off bolts? I didn't break anything last time I took it apart (1k-2k miles ago) and had absolutely no probs. Are you talking about head bolts?
Apr 22, 2008 | 07:40 PM
#127
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From: NW Ark on wooded ten acres...Ozarks at large!
Howdy...
It's true. Rings may be all you need, depending on old your timing chain is.
And, when you get in there to pull the pistons it would quite dumb to not check the bearing clearances.
I just finished my rebuild, and all told I don't think I spent $500. The cylinders just needed honing, the head needed new valves, the cam and bearings were fine, the crankshaft was fine, put in new rings, bearings, front end kit, and all new gaskets and seals. I'm set for a good, long while.
It's true. Rings may be all you need, depending on old your timing chain is.
And, when you get in there to pull the pistons it would quite dumb to not check the bearing clearances.
I just finished my rebuild, and all told I don't think I spent $500. The cylinders just needed honing, the head needed new valves, the cam and bearings were fine, the crankshaft was fine, put in new rings, bearings, front end kit, and all new gaskets and seals. I'm set for a good, long while.
Apr 22, 2008 | 07:50 PM
#128
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From: Salem, OR
lol. I looked at the inside of the piston walls. There were minor groves but nothing too really worry about. It could completely rebuild it but I have other priorities too.
thook, what kit do you suggest? This one seems about the best...http://www.engnbldr.com/Toyota-Hotlicks.htm
It's $220 for the kit
thook, what kit do you suggest? This one seems about the best...http://www.engnbldr.com/Toyota-Hotlicks.htm
It's $220 for the kit
Apr 23, 2008 | 05:53 PM
#129
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From: NW Ark on wooded ten acres...Ozarks at large!
Good price.....good kit, but there's some things you might want to think about and look at before you're set on what to buy.
With the one dead cylinder, there's the possibility for some damage or excessive and/or uneven wear to the cylinder bores and the rod and main bearings. Depends on how much you drove it like that and how long the foaming was happening. Hard to say.... you'll just have to look at all. If it all looks good, you'll really only new just few parts.....not even the whole kit. But, if things are wacked, you'll need machining, pistons, and oversized parts.....as opposed to standard.
If the bearings clearances are well in spec with even wear between them all and there's no scratches or scoring on the bearings or crankshaft journals, you won't need to replace the bearings....or any machining. But, if you decide you want to "just because", go standard. Personally, I'm not a "just because" kind of person, so I wouldn't because they're Toyota and will last you a long time to come. Saves money for other things, and I'll bet you don't have a lot of that floating around...like me.
It's obvious you'll need new rings, but you'll need to check the present ring end gaps at middle and top of the cylinders. That way you'll know how the cylinders are wearing. If you find the tolerances to be fairly larger at the top than towards the middle, you'll need to have the cylinders bored....meaning pistons and oversized rings. A slight difference won't matter as you'll be fine with just some standard replacement rings for quite some time to come.
Check the crankshaft end play. If it's in spec, you don't need thrustwashers. They will go quite a bit longer, also. I'm betting you won't need them.
The oil pump I also doubt you'll need. It's simple mechanical, crankshaft/gear driven pump that really only wears and....considering the OEM quality....takes a long time to do so. Unless, you've been a goober and not changed the oil regular like or had a major mechanical failure that damages it. Mine, with 220k, was/is fine, but I bought the complete front end kit w/pump before I knew what I'm telling you now. So, I just put the new one in, but I have my OEM "in case" something happens.
Valve stem seals you, of course, don't need. No reason to buy them (except they just come with the kit, right?
)
Timing chain.....how old is yours, anyway? Determining factor, here...
Sleeve-n-seals I'll bet you need. If you get the crankshaft exposed and find grooves worn on the tailend and the vibration dampener, you'll need them.
Out of all the parts listed, what I've mentioned would be the only things you'd possibly need. Wrist pins would be the only other thing in question, but I believe if you find you need those you'll find you have all the qualifying factors for new pistons, anyway. So, in that case, pins are moot.
Now, this is all an "economy" rebuild. I know some people would argue this is foolishness because they believe in replacing "while you're in there". But, this is the approach I took with my rebuild and I'm confident I won't be tearing it down again for a long time. I actually believe in the Toyota reputation for a number of reasons. Well, not ALL of it, but most of it....
With the one dead cylinder, there's the possibility for some damage or excessive and/or uneven wear to the cylinder bores and the rod and main bearings. Depends on how much you drove it like that and how long the foaming was happening. Hard to say.... you'll just have to look at all. If it all looks good, you'll really only new just few parts.....not even the whole kit. But, if things are wacked, you'll need machining, pistons, and oversized parts.....as opposed to standard.
If the bearings clearances are well in spec with even wear between them all and there's no scratches or scoring on the bearings or crankshaft journals, you won't need to replace the bearings....or any machining. But, if you decide you want to "just because", go standard. Personally, I'm not a "just because" kind of person, so I wouldn't because they're Toyota and will last you a long time to come. Saves money for other things, and I'll bet you don't have a lot of that floating around...like me.
It's obvious you'll need new rings, but you'll need to check the present ring end gaps at middle and top of the cylinders. That way you'll know how the cylinders are wearing. If you find the tolerances to be fairly larger at the top than towards the middle, you'll need to have the cylinders bored....meaning pistons and oversized rings. A slight difference won't matter as you'll be fine with just some standard replacement rings for quite some time to come.
Check the crankshaft end play. If it's in spec, you don't need thrustwashers. They will go quite a bit longer, also. I'm betting you won't need them.
The oil pump I also doubt you'll need. It's simple mechanical, crankshaft/gear driven pump that really only wears and....considering the OEM quality....takes a long time to do so. Unless, you've been a goober and not changed the oil regular like or had a major mechanical failure that damages it. Mine, with 220k, was/is fine, but I bought the complete front end kit w/pump before I knew what I'm telling you now. So, I just put the new one in, but I have my OEM "in case" something happens.
Valve stem seals you, of course, don't need. No reason to buy them (except they just come with the kit, right?
)Timing chain.....how old is yours, anyway? Determining factor, here...
Sleeve-n-seals I'll bet you need. If you get the crankshaft exposed and find grooves worn on the tailend and the vibration dampener, you'll need them.
Out of all the parts listed, what I've mentioned would be the only things you'd possibly need. Wrist pins would be the only other thing in question, but I believe if you find you need those you'll find you have all the qualifying factors for new pistons, anyway. So, in that case, pins are moot.
Now, this is all an "economy" rebuild. I know some people would argue this is foolishness because they believe in replacing "while you're in there". But, this is the approach I took with my rebuild and I'm confident I won't be tearing it down again for a long time. I actually believe in the Toyota reputation for a number of reasons. Well, not ALL of it, but most of it....
Apr 23, 2008 | 06:07 PM
#130
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Joined: Feb 2008
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From: Salem, OR
Good price.....good kit, but there's some things you might want to think about and look at before you're set on what to buy.
With the one dead cylinder, there's the possibility for some damage or excessive and/or uneven wear to the cylinder bores and the rod and main bearings. Depends on how much you drove it like that and how long the foaming was happening. Hard to say.... you'll just have to look at all. If it all looks good, you'll really only new just few parts.....not even the whole kit. But, if things are wacked, you'll need machining, pistons, and oversized parts.....as opposed to standard.
If the bearings clearances are well in spec with even wear between them all and there's no scratches or scoring on the bearings or crankshaft journals, you won't need to replace the bearings....or any machining. But, if you decide you want to "just because", go standard. Personally, I'm not a "just because" kind of person, so I wouldn't because they're Toyota and will last you a long time to come. Saves money for other things, and I'll bet you don't have a lot of that floating around...like me.
It's obvious you'll need new rings, but you'll need to check the present ring end gaps at middle and top of the cylinders. That way you'll know how the cylinders are wearing. If you find the tolerances to be fairly larger at the top than towards the middle, you'll need to have the cylinders bored....meaning pistons and oversized rings. A slight difference won't matter as you'll be fine with just some standard replacement rings for quite some time to come.
Check the crankshaft end play. If it's in spec, you don't need thrustwashers. They will go quite a bit longer, also. I'm betting you won't need them.
The oil pump I also doubt you'll need. It's simple mechanical, crankshaft/gear driven pump that really only wears and....considering the OEM quality....takes a long time to do so. Unless, you've been a goober and not changed the oil regular like or had a major mechanical failure that damages it. Mine, with 220k, was/is fine, but I bought the complete front end kit w/pump before I knew what I'm telling you now. So, I just put the new one in, but I have my OEM "in case" something happens.
Valve stem seals you, of course, don't need. No reason to buy them (except they just come with the kit, right?)
Timing chain.....how old is yours, anyway? Determining factor, here...
Sleeve-n-seals I'll bet you need. If you get the crankshaft exposed and find grooves worn on the tailend and the vibration dampener, you'll need them.
Out of all the parts listed, what I've mentioned would be the only things you'd possibly need. Wrist pins would be the only other thing in question, but I believe if you find you need those you'll find you have all the qualifying factors for new pistons, anyway. So, in that case, pins are moot.
Now, this is all an "economy" rebuild. I know some people would argue this is foolishness because they believe in replacing "while you're in there". But, this is the approach I took with my rebuild and I'm confident I won't be tearing it down again for a long time. I actually believe in the Toyota reputation for a number of reasons. Well, not ALL of it, but most of it....
With the one dead cylinder, there's the possibility for some damage or excessive and/or uneven wear to the cylinder bores and the rod and main bearings. Depends on how much you drove it like that and how long the foaming was happening. Hard to say.... you'll just have to look at all. If it all looks good, you'll really only new just few parts.....not even the whole kit. But, if things are wacked, you'll need machining, pistons, and oversized parts.....as opposed to standard.
If the bearings clearances are well in spec with even wear between them all and there's no scratches or scoring on the bearings or crankshaft journals, you won't need to replace the bearings....or any machining. But, if you decide you want to "just because", go standard. Personally, I'm not a "just because" kind of person, so I wouldn't because they're Toyota and will last you a long time to come. Saves money for other things, and I'll bet you don't have a lot of that floating around...like me.
It's obvious you'll need new rings, but you'll need to check the present ring end gaps at middle and top of the cylinders. That way you'll know how the cylinders are wearing. If you find the tolerances to be fairly larger at the top than towards the middle, you'll need to have the cylinders bored....meaning pistons and oversized rings. A slight difference won't matter as you'll be fine with just some standard replacement rings for quite some time to come.
Check the crankshaft end play. If it's in spec, you don't need thrustwashers. They will go quite a bit longer, also. I'm betting you won't need them.
The oil pump I also doubt you'll need. It's simple mechanical, crankshaft/gear driven pump that really only wears and....considering the OEM quality....takes a long time to do so. Unless, you've been a goober and not changed the oil regular like or had a major mechanical failure that damages it. Mine, with 220k, was/is fine, but I bought the complete front end kit w/pump before I knew what I'm telling you now. So, I just put the new one in, but I have my OEM "in case" something happens.
Valve stem seals you, of course, don't need. No reason to buy them (except they just come with the kit, right?
)Timing chain.....how old is yours, anyway? Determining factor, here...
Sleeve-n-seals I'll bet you need. If you get the crankshaft exposed and find grooves worn on the tailend and the vibration dampener, you'll need them.
Out of all the parts listed, what I've mentioned would be the only things you'd possibly need. Wrist pins would be the only other thing in question, but I believe if you find you need those you'll find you have all the qualifying factors for new pistons, anyway. So, in that case, pins are moot.
Now, this is all an "economy" rebuild. I know some people would argue this is foolishness because they believe in replacing "while you're in there". But, this is the approach I took with my rebuild and I'm confident I won't be tearing it down again for a long time. I actually believe in the Toyota reputation for a number of reasons. Well, not ALL of it, but most of it....
I am only going to replace what is necessary. Which I am not sure what all I need. My truck will rarely get driven this summer since I will be riding my motorcycle.
Timing chain is apparently new, I left it on there when I took it apart.
Sounds like it's not that bad of job.
Anything else I should replace?
Also, does the kit come will ALL the gaskets necessary?
Apr 23, 2008 | 11:44 PM
#131
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From: NW Ark on wooded ten acres...Ozarks at large!
If you're financially up for it, I'd get the injectors rebuilt. It's well worth it. Better fuel efficiency and saves on piston and cylinder wear from possibly running lean. They do stop flowing as well after 100k or so. At 220k, three out of four of mine were pretty crappy....two being REAL crappy. And, I'd tried several Seafoam treatments not too long before the rebuild.
If the timing chain is pretty new, I'd leave it. But, do inspect it. It's not unheard of for people to reuse tensioners. It's just not a good idea. Even if they "look" good, the material does get brittle and breaks down faster after a point. So, instead of the new timing chain going 100k or more with a new tensioner, it may only go 80k and you bend some valves...like mine...pfffth!!!!
But, other than that, nothing else to replace....unless, you get in there and simply find "whatever" is bad. But, this is not the 3.0 where...like the knock sensor.....things are a real biotch to get to. After you rebuild and find something wrong....like sensors and what not....it's all pretty easy to do. And, you're right....it's not the bad of a job....if you have all the tools handy.
Complete gasket kits come with all gaskets for the exception of fuel rail washers and one or two small coolant gaskets. Oh, and no cold start injector gasket. Just have a tube of black RTV handy for the coolant gaskets, but you'll need a new gasket for the cold start injector...unless, you're original one is still in good shape. OEM appears to be a rather think piece of plastic type material and is reusable if not wacked. Same for the fuel rail washers.....only they're copper...brass....one of the two.
If the timing chain is pretty new, I'd leave it. But, do inspect it. It's not unheard of for people to reuse tensioners. It's just not a good idea. Even if they "look" good, the material does get brittle and breaks down faster after a point. So, instead of the new timing chain going 100k or more with a new tensioner, it may only go 80k and you bend some valves...like mine...pfffth!!!!
But, other than that, nothing else to replace....unless, you get in there and simply find "whatever" is bad. But, this is not the 3.0 where...like the knock sensor.....things are a real biotch to get to. After you rebuild and find something wrong....like sensors and what not....it's all pretty easy to do. And, you're right....it's not the bad of a job....if you have all the tools handy.
Complete gasket kits come with all gaskets for the exception of fuel rail washers and one or two small coolant gaskets. Oh, and no cold start injector gasket. Just have a tube of black RTV handy for the coolant gaskets, but you'll need a new gasket for the cold start injector...unless, you're original one is still in good shape. OEM appears to be a rather think piece of plastic type material and is reusable if not wacked. Same for the fuel rail washers.....only they're copper...brass....one of the two.
Apr 24, 2008 | 09:02 AM
#132
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Joined: Feb 2008
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From: Salem, OR
If you're financially up for it, I'd get the injectors rebuilt. It's well worth it. Better fuel efficiency and saves on piston and cylinder wear from possibly running lean. They do stop flowing as well after 100k or so. At 220k, three out of four of mine were pretty crappy....two being REAL crappy. And, I'd tried several Seafoam treatments not too long before the rebuild.
If the timing chain is pretty new, I'd leave it. But, do inspect it. It's not unheard of for people to reuse tensioners. It's just not a good idea. Even if they "look" good, the material does get brittle and breaks down faster after a point. So, instead of the new timing chain going 100k or more with a new tensioner, it may only go 80k and you bend some valves...like mine...pfffth!!!!
But, other than that, nothing else to replace....unless, you get in there and simply find "whatever" is bad. But, this is not the 3.0 where...like the knock sensor.....things are a real biotch to get to. After you rebuild and find something wrong....like sensors and what not....it's all pretty easy to do. And, you're right....it's not the bad of a job....if you have all the tools handy.
Complete gasket kits come with all gaskets for the exception of fuel rail washers and one or two small coolant gaskets. Oh, and no cold start injector gasket. Just have a tube of black RTV handy for the coolant gaskets, but you'll need a new gasket for the cold start injector...unless, you're original one is still in good shape. OEM appears to be a rather think piece of plastic type material and is reusable if not wacked. Same for the fuel rail washers.....only they're copper...brass....one of the two.
If the timing chain is pretty new, I'd leave it. But, do inspect it. It's not unheard of for people to reuse tensioners. It's just not a good idea. Even if they "look" good, the material does get brittle and breaks down faster after a point. So, instead of the new timing chain going 100k or more with a new tensioner, it may only go 80k and you bend some valves...like mine...pfffth!!!!
But, other than that, nothing else to replace....unless, you get in there and simply find "whatever" is bad. But, this is not the 3.0 where...like the knock sensor.....things are a real biotch to get to. After you rebuild and find something wrong....like sensors and what not....it's all pretty easy to do. And, you're right....it's not the bad of a job....if you have all the tools handy.
Complete gasket kits come with all gaskets for the exception of fuel rail washers and one or two small coolant gaskets. Oh, and no cold start injector gasket. Just have a tube of black RTV handy for the coolant gaskets, but you'll need a new gasket for the cold start injector...unless, you're original one is still in good shape. OEM appears to be a rather think piece of plastic type material and is reusable if not wacked. Same for the fuel rail washers.....only they're copper...brass....one of the two.
Where exactly is the cold start injector? I don't think I've seen it...lol
Apr 24, 2008 | 10:14 AM
#133
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From: NW Ark on wooded ten acres...Ozarks at large!
Look on the driver's side of the plenum body. The injector has a hard fuel line going to it and an electrical connector. Two bolts (10mm) head mount it to the plenum via the diamond shaped flange.
Apr 26, 2008 | 11:19 PM
#135
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Joined: Feb 2008
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Likes: 1
From: Salem, OR
******FIXED!!!!*****************
Hell YA!!!! Its FIXED...FINALLY
Anyway, I got my new Auxiliary air valve or other words Idle control unit or something like that...I got it for $129.99 at Shucks by using this and they price-matched it...http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductD...pe=506&PTSet=A
Originally $250 and it dropped down to $130. Saved $120
As soon as I put it on and started it I could tell. I still have a WEE bit of surging when warming up, since it take like 20 minutes to get fully warmed (rigged thermostat)...
I still have a coupe issues to work out...like the throttle stop screw and the dash pot screw...since I don't know what happened to them
Anyway, it runs really good, and I am surprised that it idles so smooth. Maybe I'll make a video of it. Its still slow/gutless as hell though...but it RUNS good!!!
Thanks for all of your help...Yotatech is #1...for Yotas anyway...lol
Hell YA!!!! Its FIXED...FINALLY
Anyway, I got my new Auxiliary air valve or other words Idle control unit or something like that...I got it for $129.99 at Shucks by using this and they price-matched it...http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductD...pe=506&PTSet=A
Originally $250 and it dropped down to $130. Saved $120
As soon as I put it on and started it I could tell. I still have a WEE bit of surging when warming up, since it take like 20 minutes to get fully warmed (rigged thermostat)...
I still have a coupe issues to work out...like the throttle stop screw and the dash pot screw...since I don't know what happened to them
Anyway, it runs really good, and I am surprised that it idles so smooth. Maybe I'll make a video of it. Its still slow/gutless as hell though...but it RUNS good!!!
Thanks for all of your help...Yotatech is #1...for Yotas anyway...lol
Apr 26, 2008 | 11:30 PM
#136
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 8,656
Likes: 16
From: NW Ark on wooded ten acres...Ozarks at large!
Hell yeah!!!...lol!
PM that fellow that posted a page or two before that offered you some TB screws, eh. Then, we can get you all fixed up with a really decent idle. Well, as good as we can until you fix the compression issue.
Keep in mind through all of this....the ECU has developed a "memory pattern" (for lack of a better term) and it will take some time for it to adust and even things out for every change you make. So, don't be alarmed if the engine doesn't "magically" run perfectly right away.
PM that fellow that posted a page or two before that offered you some TB screws, eh. Then, we can get you all fixed up with a really decent idle. Well, as good as we can until you fix the compression issue.
Keep in mind through all of this....the ECU has developed a "memory pattern" (for lack of a better term) and it will take some time for it to adust and even things out for every change you make. So, don't be alarmed if the engine doesn't "magically" run perfectly right away.
Last edited by thook; Apr 26, 2008 at 11:34 PM.
Apr 26, 2008 | 11:40 PM
#137
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Joined: Feb 2008
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From: Salem, OR
Hell yeah!!!...lol!
PM that fellow that posted a page or two before that offered you some TB screws, eh. Then, we can get you all fixed up with a really decent idle. Well, as good as we can until you fix the compression issue.
Keep in mind through all of this....the ECU has developed a "memory pattern" (for lack of a better term) and it will take some time for it to adust and even things out for every change you make. So, don't be alarmed if the engine doesn't "magically" run perfectly right away.
PM that fellow that posted a page or two before that offered you some TB screws, eh. Then, we can get you all fixed up with a really decent idle. Well, as good as we can until you fix the compression issue.
Keep in mind through all of this....the ECU has developed a "memory pattern" (for lack of a better term) and it will take some time for it to adust and even things out for every change you make. So, don't be alarmed if the engine doesn't "magically" run perfectly right away.
lol...are you talking about you with the TB screws or Abcedarian (I think???)?
But yeah, if I have to re-adjust the TPS then so be it
The low compression is going to have to stay for awhile until I get that fixed this summer...unless it magically fixes itself
Are you talking about the TPS? Or does the computer just always do that?
Thanks!
Apr 27, 2008 | 12:23 PM
#138
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 8,656
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From: NW Ark on wooded ten acres...Ozarks at large!
lol...are you talking about you with the TB screws or Abcedarian (I think???)?
But yeah, if I have to re-adjust the TPS then so be it
The low compression is going to have to stay for awhile until I get that fixed this summer...unless it magically fixes itself
Are you talking about the TPS? Or does the computer just always do that?
Thanks!
But yeah, if I have to re-adjust the TPS then so be it
The low compression is going to have to stay for awhile until I get that fixed this summer...unless it magically fixes itself
Are you talking about the TPS? Or does the computer just always do that?
Thanks!
And, no....I wasn't talking about the TPS specifically, although that will also affect what I'm talking about. Run a search on "ECU driving patterns" and there will be plenty to read explaining what I mean.
Apr 27, 2008 | 05:30 PM
#139
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From: Salem, OR
Oh, thanks for the help then. I'm not sure whats next...lol
Apr 27, 2008 | 11:07 PM
#140
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Posts: 8,656
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From: NW Ark on wooded ten acres...Ozarks at large!
What do you mean "what's next"? Get the TB screws so you can get your throttle body in the shape it's supposed to be in. All we're trying to do is improve your situation until you can fix what the biggest problem is. Once that's fixed, what you've done prior will make everything that much better. Trust me on that.
