Let me illustrate the difference:

Noliwan's supercharged 3.4 V6:


Here's a modded 7M-GTE Supra turbo:


Note how quickly the s/c V6 gets into its power curve. Now look how it falls off compared to the turbocharged Supra motor. Very different animals.

 

I call complete and total BS on this prototype 3vze. Period.

Ill believe it when I see it first hand.

 

it's not a 3VZE

See post #52

 

 

whether or not its a 3vze I still call bull˟˟˟˟˟. The mere fact that he wont talk about it here PROVES that he doesnt have anything special. That and picking races at a light 100% full-o-˟˟˟˟˟ ricer...

 

you do bring up a good point, since he never wants to show his face. However, it would help if he actually told us what was going on and posted up to prove it.

 

Great post paddlenbike! I especially like the dyno graphs. I think a lot of people will learn quite a bit about forced induction from this post!

We agree that turbo and supercharged vehicles typically exhibit the "driving dynamics" you discuss above. I would argue that this is a nature of the design and implementation, not how the turbo and supercharger actually work. A turbo could be made to perform exactly as you describe a supercharger - no lag, but a little breathless on the top - by using a small turbo and small diameter/high velocity piping. You could also make a supercharger perform as you descirbe a turbo - but why? This to some degree negates the potential benefits that can be derived from how the compressor is driven. Even the different types of superchargers (Roots, turbine, etc) have different performance "feels", but it's not because they are doing anything "different".

IMHO, there is a lot of misunderstanding about turbo/supercharging and it's because people get too tied up in the application, skipping over the general theory of what's happening:
- Turbo and superchargers are just air compressors, with the only difference being how they are driven
- Compressing the air allows you to stuff more oxygen into the cylinder
- More oxygen allows you to burn more fuel
- Burning more fuel creates more power

Note: if you (or the ECM) were not to increase the fuel rate, you would not make any more power with forced induction. Of course, this would also lead to a VERY lean combustion condition that would likely frag your motor in short order...

There are DEFINITELY people on here more knowledgeable about forced induction than I am (check out Node's post on turbos for 5VZE and 3VZE!) This is just my $0.02 to help people understand the basics so when someone (like Node) comes along with a great idea, people understand what's going on and what the tradeoffs will be!

 

I wouldn't disagree one bit. On a similar note a friend once told me that a double overhead cam multivalve engine will always lack low end torque and only make its power up high. The 3.4 V6 is a good example of how wrong this guy was--it makes most of its power down low and in the mid range and quite frankly I think the top end power sucks. I couldn't get it through this guy's head that just because you have a less efficient drivetrain (pushrods) it doesn't magically make more torque; it's all about combustion swirl, camshaft design, etc. Likewise, I agree that a very small and/or variable nozzle turbo could produce similar engine performance as a supercharger.

 

I have read through some of the latest posts on here, Thanks Guys, Jared, Bumpin' Yota & ThomasJ. You are right, it is VOLUNTARY to post here on YotaTech, so if somebody DOES'NT choose to post their ideas or their build-ups here, it's not right that you start Flaming and calling names such as Drama Queen and calling BS on someone because they don't choose answer-up. That's Juvenile and IMHO is completely unacceptable behavior for this forum and for this reason, I will no-longer posting ANYTHING on this board. There are plenty of other Forums out there with Friendly and Willing participants to share ideas and build-ups with, this is not the only game in town.
I came here today specifically to post a write-up on how we duplicated this so-called Fable engine that everybody keeps flaming about, after reading the posts here today, Sorry, now you can go figure it out on your own and look at the tailpipe of that another 4Runner that's Blowin' your doors off.

RBMC

 

Lighten up, I haven't seen this post in a while so I had know idea what a bitchbattle I had started until I got an e-mail from my nephew telling me about it. Since I wrote this post, I have become very good friends with Harry and also RBMC, both are extremely cool and very generous people. So when I saw this, I called him, not only to find out about this post but to ask some exhaust questions for my nephew. After talking, he said it was cool if I outed his name, I asked him what about your screen name, he told him that it really wouldn't matter because since about week ago it no longer exists for reason and he doesn't know why. As for wanting to keep things on the downlow he owns a business on the side with a partner, they make aircraft and specialty auto parts, mostly for rice rockets, but are starting to go towards the truck and suv market, they make a lot of cnc parts and ecu computer management stuff. He said the reason for the downlow is people keep showing up at their door(about 10 a day) and some at his station, out of the blue, wanting stuff done to their cars for free or next to free and his partner is getting pissed and harpin on him about it. So there ya have it in a big nutshell.

 

Good to know. Thanks for the update. As far as showing up at someone's door asking for stuff for free, that's just stupid. Business owners should have no problem sending them away QUICK.

 

Or explaining they are in business to make money, and they would be happy to charge a fair rate for whatever the customer wants...

 

Just read through this thread...and all I have to say is what do you expect when you are out here racing and showing it off...people want some kind of answers so they come to his business. The top secret 4runner of yotatech...

 

I would think him coming forward would give more business than freebies. Heck I'd probably even pay really good friends to work on my car.

 

Hell yeah, a few years down the road when I have a nice bank account, I'd send my 4Runner out there to get tweaked. And expect to pay for it, as most normal people should...

 

Wtf is a turbo? is that like nozz?

 

Geez, I wouldn't go getting so upset as to never post again over a little razzin! This is a good site, take it in stride we're all adults here.

 

ok my searches keep bringing me back to this thread...and I never did see the update until now.

RMBC, Busjack, and the mysterous 3vze owner, I apologize for my calling out, I now understand why you dont want your screen name let out.

But please understand that Im used to people bragging about their brother's, sister's, boyfriend's, uncle's, roommate's car running 10s with nothing more than exhaust... ...and then not being able to substanciate the claim.

So when someone brags about an unusual car it is not out of the ordinary, or out of line, to ask for proof. After nearly a complete YEAR had gone by without proof, I decided to dig it up and call BS. Im still extremely skeptical but im giving it the benefit of the doubt from recent events....

 

Thats amzing,

I have never heard of a 3.0 doing that till now....

I wish I had that in my 3rd gen with my 3.4.....

Eventually I wanted to do a V8 toyota swap.....

But now I am reconsidering....

 

I cannot understand for the life of me why this guy dosn't want us to know who he is. If he owns his own shop, he can make tons of money off us. I guess he dosn't need the money. Some business man.