88 dead after ign switch replaced HELP
07-30-2017, 01:37 PM
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88 dead after ign switch replaced HELP
88RUNNER was a "turn the key, CLICK, no crank" problem.... normal at on-got power, gauges, radio, all good, turn to start- dead lost everything no clicks- .
Tried to jump start no good, charged up battery, tried again-no good, charged it again (accidently forgot to pull the charger) tried it IT STARTED.
SO I tried shortcut - the battery+ to relay wire (30a fused wire) did not work.
Bought new ignition switch, replaced the switch... simple job, line it up right, screws back in, wiring checked connectors tightened etc.
Tried to start... now got NOTHING, no power at all to anything completely dead.
Checked battery- solid 12v, checked connections- seem good, checked 80A, 50A, 40A and other fuses in fusebox all good.
Anyone have an idea what went wrong?
Tried to jump start no good, charged up battery, tried again-no good, charged it again (accidently forgot to pull the charger) tried it IT STARTED.
SO I tried shortcut - the battery+ to relay wire (30a fused wire) did not work.
Bought new ignition switch, replaced the switch... simple job, line it up right, screws back in, wiring checked connectors tightened etc.
Tried to start... now got NOTHING, no power at all to anything completely dead.
Checked battery- solid 12v, checked connections- seem good, checked 80A, 50A, 40A and other fuses in fusebox all good.
Anyone have an idea what went wrong?
07-31-2017, 04:23 AM
#5
If all you did was change the ignition switch, and touched nothing else... You got a bad switch.
Starter current flows through the switch due to bad wiring design by Toyota. Easy fix if that's all, but everything else must work.
Check the starter relay on the passenger side fender well, that maybe loose or corroded.
I made a bypass switch for the starter, two wires custom panel and a 30amp NO Pb switch from ebay. Hold the key in "start" to run the pump and roll the engine with the little button next to the shifter. easy as pie. engine starts, airvane switch closes for the fuel pump and off we go!!!!!!!!!
You know maybe I should do a thread on a custom panel on the cheap & ugly?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-Red-LED-...JXV7NO&vxp=mtr
Starter current flows through the switch due to bad wiring design by Toyota. Easy fix if that's all, but everything else must work.
Check the starter relay on the passenger side fender well, that maybe loose or corroded.
I made a bypass switch for the starter, two wires custom panel and a 30amp NO Pb switch from ebay. Hold the key in "start" to run the pump and roll the engine with the little button next to the shifter. easy as pie. engine starts, airvane switch closes for the fuel pump and off we go!!!!!!!!!
You know maybe I should do a thread on a custom panel on the cheap & ugly?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-Red-LED-...JXV7NO&vxp=mtr
07-31-2017, 05:16 AM
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THANKS GUYS...back to the drawing board, charge battery, pull/clean connections, check/change fusible link, ck batt w/load, try old switch to verify poss bad switch.Makes me tired to say it all :-)
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08-01-2017, 07:18 PM
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Battery not up to max (prob 70%) putting a full charge on it now, I have no load tester, or 2nd person to help. Doesn't really matter anyway...after trying it so many times now the key will not turn, So gotta order a new cylinder. sigh. Will this ever end.>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
08-01-2017, 08:39 PM
#11
Quick practical load test if you absolutely have no way of getting it to the auto parts store, or buying one from HF:
Measure battery voltage with no load: __________? Volts
Turn on Headlights battery volts: ____________? volts
Then probe all points from battery to areas enclosed in red, green and blue (below - ignore text notes). They all should have same a battery voltage.
Measure battery voltage with no load: __________? Volts
Turn on Headlights battery volts: ____________? volts
Then probe all points from battery to areas enclosed in red, green and blue (below - ignore text notes). They all should have same a battery voltage.
Last edited by RAD4Runner; 08-01-2017 at 09:57 PM.
08-02-2017, 02:07 PM
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latest...battery charged...found key problem TEMPERATURE, the car got so hot the key was stuck, covered it up and waited til am- key turns!! (temp= 68F)
Tried to start got dash-lights-buzzer all normal, turned the key to start- dead. tried a second time no dash lights no sound no start. dead.
Hooked up a jump to battery... lights, start and varoom......let it run awhile took very short test drive.
Turned it off. Tried to re-start, nothing- dead, no dash lights, no crank Nothing.
Is this any info to indicate the specific problem?
I am going to start RadRunner instructions to the letter as soon as it cools down tonight I am beat, need a rest.
Later
Tried to start got dash-lights-buzzer all normal, turned the key to start- dead. tried a second time no dash lights no sound no start. dead.
Hooked up a jump to battery... lights, start and varoom......let it run awhile took very short test drive.
Turned it off. Tried to re-start, nothing- dead, no dash lights, no crank Nothing.
Is this any info to indicate the specific problem?
I am going to start RadRunner instructions to the letter as soon as it cools down tonight I am beat, need a rest.
Later
08-02-2017, 03:11 PM
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Maybe. He's also got a really bad igntion switch.
A load tester is a very good quantitative way to gauge a battery's condition, but you don't need it for a quick test. Just put your voltmeter on the battery. With everything off, you should get about 12.6v. If less than, oh, 12.3 it's discharged. Now have someone turn the key. If the voltage drops below 12v, the battery is probably gone. If it the voltmeter doesn't flinch at all, the ignition switch is probably shot.
If the battery is suspect, almost all places that sell batteries have a load tester, and they can confirm your diagnosis before you spend any money.
A load tester is a very good quantitative way to gauge a battery's condition, but you don't need it for a quick test. Just put your voltmeter on the battery. With everything off, you should get about 12.6v. If less than, oh, 12.3 it's discharged. Now have someone turn the key. If the voltage drops below 12v, the battery is probably gone. If it the voltmeter doesn't flinch at all, the ignition switch is probably shot.
If the battery is suspect, almost all places that sell batteries have a load tester, and they can confirm your diagnosis before you spend any money.
08-02-2017, 07:15 PM
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Really?
Battery is 4months old with very light use and v.good quality. I just put in a new ignition switch 3 days ago after several days of problems. no improvement.
I do get 12.6v at the battery, can try again I guess, can't check drain while turning the key since it needs a jump to get it to "start".
(see beginning of this thread) I'm back where I started.
Why do you think the switch is really bad? can you explain please....
BTW (mountaingirl is female)
I could pull the batt and take it in (but I'm suspicious of those places and "testing" results).
"Starting" over at the beginning?
pun intended
Battery is 4months old with very light use and v.good quality. I just put in a new ignition switch 3 days ago after several days of problems. no improvement.
I do get 12.6v at the battery, can try again I guess, can't check drain while turning the key since it needs a jump to get it to "start".
(see beginning of this thread) I'm back where I started.
Why do you think the switch is really bad? can you explain please....
BTW (mountaingirl is female)
I could pull the batt and take it in (but I'm suspicious of those places and "testing" results).
"Starting" over at the beginning?
pun intended
08-02-2017, 07:46 PM
#16
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The fact that it starts when jumped points directly to a bad battery. You seem to be resistant to reality, and resistant to making the tests that can easily determine the nature of your troubles.
The fact that a voltmeter shows 12+ volts at the battery terminals means NOTHING.
I surmise that your ideas of 50% charged-70% charged, ect, are coming from some info that a 'smart' battery charger is telling you.
Those things are junk.
If you do not trust others, as you might be smart not to, you require appropriate tools for your own.
Although you may have more than one issue, stacked on others. I still think your symptoms point directly to a battery that will not discharge any substantial current.
Load testing will tell.
The fact that a voltmeter shows 12+ volts at the battery terminals means NOTHING.
I surmise that your ideas of 50% charged-70% charged, ect, are coming from some info that a 'smart' battery charger is telling you.
Those things are junk.
If you do not trust others, as you might be smart not to, you require appropriate tools for your own.
Although you may have more than one issue, stacked on others. I still think your symptoms point directly to a battery that will not discharge any substantial current.
Load testing will tell.
Last edited by millball; 08-02-2017 at 07:50 PM.
08-02-2017, 08:12 PM
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Measure the voltage on the battery, then turn the key. It doesn't need to start (I assumed it wouldn't). If the voltage remains exactly the same, then there is no significant current being drawn from it. It is not connecting to the starter (or even to the starter solenoid). On the other hand, if the voltage takes a nose-dive (to anything less than about 12v), that means that the battery IS being connected to some load, the load is pulling the voltage way down, and the voltage is not enough to turn the starter (most likely a bad battery). [What SHOULD happen is the voltage should drop about 0.4-0.6 volts as it turns the starter.]
If the battery is "good," how can this happen? Lot of ways, and your voltmeter is the way you look for it. Since your key got stuck, and on several attempts turning the key gave you no lights, that points to a problem with the switch or key cylinder. If the key cylinder doesn't turn the switch to close the starter contacts, nothing will happen. "But the switch is new!!" That doesn't mean it was installed correctly; don't "eliminate" the possibility with wishful thinking. Test!
Another possibility is a really loose battery clamp. You can have a completely charged good battery, but with loose (meaning: high resistance) clamps, you can get enough current to light the dash lights but not turn the starter. Then, when you "jump" it, where to hook the jumper cables? Not to the battery posts, but right to the battery clamps. There is a good connection to the wire and the starter turns. You can test for this directly; with key turned, compare the voltage you get on the battery posts to on the battery clamps. If there is ANY difference you have a bad connection.
P.S. Officially, nobody cares that you are female. You're just as capable as the rest of us, you are just as welcome, and everybody gets the same help. Also, the same wisecracks.
If the battery is "good," how can this happen? Lot of ways, and your voltmeter is the way you look for it. Since your key got stuck, and on several attempts turning the key gave you no lights, that points to a problem with the switch or key cylinder. If the key cylinder doesn't turn the switch to close the starter contacts, nothing will happen. "But the switch is new!!" That doesn't mean it was installed correctly; don't "eliminate" the possibility with wishful thinking. Test!
Another possibility is a really loose battery clamp. You can have a completely charged good battery, but with loose (meaning: high resistance) clamps, you can get enough current to light the dash lights but not turn the starter. Then, when you "jump" it, where to hook the jumper cables? Not to the battery posts, but right to the battery clamps. There is a good connection to the wire and the starter turns. You can test for this directly; with key turned, compare the voltage you get on the battery posts to on the battery clamps. If there is ANY difference you have a bad connection.
P.S. Officially, nobody cares that you are female. You're just as capable as the rest of us, you are just as welcome, and everybody gets the same help. Also, the same wisecracks.
Last edited by scope103; 08-02-2017 at 08:18 PM.
08-03-2017, 05:43 AM
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BACKGROUND INFO
Working on two vehicles, safari awd van with electrical problem (main vehicle) which has left me stuck on a windy gravel road 18 miles from "civilization".
I live alone, distant/absent neighbors. (Formally a wildlife field biologist dislike being near "civilization")
Trying to get a temporary replacement to get around (survive), this 88runner was my original vehicle but is semi-retired (backup only), as of april 2017 (with new battery) and a bad ignition switch.
Not budgetwise to invest time and money into it. It is my fifth 22re TOYOTA vehicle total of >600,000 miles todate, never had a problem repairing any of them.
BUT, I must be self sufficient and have backups in place.
This problem obviously has me stumped and pissed off about it.
After 3 days in the heat, sun cooking me (garage is 10ft away blocked by very large van stuck in driveway)
I asked for help on this site. It is 7 days working the problem.
I am extremely grateful for the guys on here taking their time to try to help.
I have borrowed a tiny old sedan (sigh) when I must go into town can't keep it for long, going today to return the Interstate 700cca battery and begin again.
But not before I get a stiff drink! :-)
what IS done
switch installed: button connector into key cylinder attached w/2 tiny screws, switch body slides into column carefully lined up with cylinder cam, 1 screw attached to anchor it.
2 electrical connectors are plugged into harness and snap into place.
new key cylinder on the way, cables checked/cleaned, fusible link checked, voltage batt to relay verified at all points
NEXT: new battery, maybe new relay maybe pull wiring to starter and/or new wiring back to switch
later guys and again THANKS
P.S, STILL open to ideas
Working on two vehicles, safari awd van with electrical problem (main vehicle) which has left me stuck on a windy gravel road 18 miles from "civilization".
I live alone, distant/absent neighbors. (Formally a wildlife field biologist dislike being near "civilization")
Trying to get a temporary replacement to get around (survive), this 88runner was my original vehicle but is semi-retired (backup only), as of april 2017 (with new battery) and a bad ignition switch.
Not budgetwise to invest time and money into it. It is my fifth 22re TOYOTA vehicle total of >600,000 miles todate, never had a problem repairing any of them.
BUT, I must be self sufficient and have backups in place.
This problem obviously has me stumped and pissed off about it.
After 3 days in the heat, sun cooking me (garage is 10ft away blocked by very large van stuck in driveway)
I asked for help on this site. It is 7 days working the problem.
I am extremely grateful for the guys on here taking their time to try to help.
I have borrowed a tiny old sedan (sigh) when I must go into town can't keep it for long, going today to return the Interstate 700cca battery and begin again.
But not before I get a stiff drink! :-)
what IS done
switch installed: button connector into key cylinder attached w/2 tiny screws, switch body slides into column carefully lined up with cylinder cam, 1 screw attached to anchor it.
2 electrical connectors are plugged into harness and snap into place.
new key cylinder on the way, cables checked/cleaned, fusible link checked, voltage batt to relay verified at all points
NEXT: new battery, maybe new relay maybe pull wiring to starter and/or new wiring back to switch
later guys and again THANKS
P.S, STILL open to ideas
