87 Toyota 4x4 Squeals When not Braking
#1
Registered User
Thread Starter
87 Toyota 4x4 Squeals When not Braking
Alright. I have an 87 Toyota Pickup 4x4 5-speed 22r single cab. I recently had a ton of front end work done to it. New drag link, tie rod ends and fasteners, steering stabilizer, calipers, pads, wheel bearings, ball joints all within 4 months. Today I noticed with my window down, I heard a squealing rotational noise on what I believe to be the front passenger side. When the brakes were applied enough to feel the first bite, the noise would stop After getting home, I lifted up both front tires off the ground. The front driver side spins with a lil resistance. The passenger side takes some strength to rotate. Definitely has way more resistance. I had the calipers replaced because the driver side was seized. Those were the factory pads (or at least the ones when I got the truck). Now it seems the new passenger side is seized. I'm trying to figure out if it could really be seized or if something else is causing the issue. Sometimes around 61 and up I'll get a weird wheel dribble feeling from the passenger side that feels like a caliper that may be grabbing a wheel that is still trying to turn. Do those symptoms sound reminiscent of a seized caliper? Could the LPSV have anything to do with this? I dont really want to get another caliper and end up in the same position a couple months from now. I also dont want to get an expensive LPSV and it not fix this headache. Brakes are my least favorite component to work on and I find myself working on them constantly. Thanks for any advice in advance.
#2
Registered User
Sometimes the flexible brake hoses can come apart internally and act like a check valve keeping pressure in the caliper even when your foot is off of the brake.
Did you re-use the old hoses?
Try jacking that corner up again and verify it's tough to turn, crack open the bleeder valve and see if fluid squirts out then close it again immediately and see if the wheel spins freely.
If so, replace the hose or all 3 in the truck while you are at it (2 front 1 rear).
Did you re-use the old hoses?
Try jacking that corner up again and verify it's tough to turn, crack open the bleeder valve and see if fluid squirts out then close it again immediately and see if the wheel spins freely.
If so, replace the hose or all 3 in the truck while you are at it (2 front 1 rear).
#3
Registered User
Does sound like a sticky caliber or a collapsed hose. Were the hoses replaced? Hub nut tightened to proper specs?
Last edited by Paul22RE; 05-02-2020 at 05:48 PM.
#4
Registered User
Thread Starter
Haven't touched the flexible hoses at all. I had jacked up the front and tried turning the wheels right after a 20 minute drive. The passenger and driver side were definitely spinning freely after waiting inside 5 minutes or so. Could the flexible hoses be the same culprit?
#5
YT Community Team
I frown on this, but some techs will use vice grips, or some equivalent, to pinch off the brake hose when removing a caliper so they don’t lose fluid and make bleeding quicker. The pinching can break down the internal wall of the hose and cause problems.
Im not saying the brake hose is the issue, you’ll need to dig, but don’t rule them out, yet.
Im not saying the brake hose is the issue, you’ll need to dig, but don’t rule them out, yet.
#6
Registered User
Thread Starter
Today after work, I'm going to take the wheel off on the passenger side and inspect. I've been having brake issues (of varying types) in the whole 3 years of ownership. First things changed were booster and master cylinder forever ago. The squeaking increases with speed. Brakes applied and no noise. It's becoming a massive headache. In ownership I never replaced those hoses or the LPSV. I've changed a couple hard lines.
#7
YT Community Team
I kinda doubt the LSPV was an issue. LSPV failures are pretty rare. I think the only one I've seen replaced was due to oil in the line.
If the hoses had failed and sent particulates into the system they typically only hit items downstream; wheel cylinders and calipers.
If the hoses had failed and sent particulates into the system they typically only hit items downstream; wheel cylinders and calipers.
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#8
Registered User
Thread Starter
Alright so I took it apart. The pads were completely worn. This is the third time in a year I've changed the pads. What's causing excessive pad wear? When changing the brakes I noticed a boot ripped off a new caliper piston and then its seal was actually shot. I put the old caliper back on the truck. Luckily I kept it around. But its been such a hassle to work on the brake . I have a new Aisin brake master cylinder that's got the 13/16 bore. I've been thinking of buying v6 pads, calipers and rotors then bringing it to someone who its fed up with brakes yet.
#9
Registered User
That kind of wear seems, to me, to possibly be caused by one of two things: 1) excessively rough, or damaged rotors. Either get them turned, or just replace them with new ones. Not really all that hard to do. I had to do it on my pickup after my EX wife drove it a LONG time, while I was overseas in the Marines, with pads worn down to the metal backing. REALLY...umm...irritated me, shall we say.
2) The pistons in the calipers are rusty/dirty, and sticking, thus holding the pads against the rotors after the pedal has been released. Either rebuild them, and clean the pistons to a nice, mirror like finish, so they'll move smoooooth in the calipers, OR get new calipers. Probably the easier choice, really.
Since I am NOT a professional mechanic by any stretch, I may be missing a possibility. Probably am. I hope someone will chime in. Maybe something about the master cylinder...
Good fortune to you!
Pat☺
2) The pistons in the calipers are rusty/dirty, and sticking, thus holding the pads against the rotors after the pedal has been released. Either rebuild them, and clean the pistons to a nice, mirror like finish, so they'll move smoooooth in the calipers, OR get new calipers. Probably the easier choice, really.
Since I am NOT a professional mechanic by any stretch, I may be missing a possibility. Probably am. I hope someone will chime in. Maybe something about the master cylinder...
Good fortune to you!
Pat☺
#10
YT Community Team
Curious, why isn’t the shop that did the calipers and front end work not involved? Did you bring in a box of parts and just ask them to install, or did they recommend the repairs and supplied both the parts and labor?
if you just gave them stuff to put on, than oh well (though the ripped piston boot is questionable). But if they diagnosed, Made repair recommendations, supplied parts and labor, than they got done skin in the game. At least if it was in California they would.
if you just gave them stuff to put on, than oh well (though the ripped piston boot is questionable). But if they diagnosed, Made repair recommendations, supplied parts and labor, than they got done skin in the game. At least if it was in California they would.
#11
Registered User
Alright so I took it apart. The pads were completely worn. This is the third time in a year I've changed the pads. What's causing excessive pad wear? When changing the brakes I noticed a boot ripped off a new caliper piston and then its seal was actually shot. I put the old caliper back on the truck. Luckily I kept it around. But its been such a hassle to work on the brake . I have a new Aisin brake master cylinder that's got the 13/16 bore. I've been thinking of buying v6 pads, calipers and rotors then bringing it to someone who its fed up with brakes yet.
That kind of wear seems, to me, to possibly be caused by one of two things: 1) excessively rough, or damaged rotors. Either get them turned, or just replace them with new ones. Not really all that hard to do. I had to do it on my pickup after my EX wife drove it a LONG time, while I was overseas in the Marines, with pads worn down to the metal backing. REALLY...umm...irritated me, shall we say.
2) The pistons in the calipers are rusty/dirty, and sticking, thus holding the pads against the rotors after the pedal has been released. Either rebuild them, and clean the pistons to a nice, mirror like finish, so they'll move smoooooth in the calipers, OR get new calipers. Probably the easier choice, really.
Since I am NOT a professional mechanic by any stretch, I may be missing a possibility. Probably am. I hope someone will chime in. Maybe something about the master cylinder...
Good fortune to you!
Pat☺
2) The pistons in the calipers are rusty/dirty, and sticking, thus holding the pads against the rotors after the pedal has been released. Either rebuild them, and clean the pistons to a nice, mirror like finish, so they'll move smoooooth in the calipers, OR get new calipers. Probably the easier choice, really.
Since I am NOT a professional mechanic by any stretch, I may be missing a possibility. Probably am. I hope someone will chime in. Maybe something about the master cylinder...
Good fortune to you!
Pat☺
What 2ToyGuy says about the rotors is true, a rough surface will wear the pads much faster, if they are worn thin they will overheat quicker too and cause the pads to wear faster, but... after running them a while the surface will smooth back out being polished by the pads as they are worn down.
I suspect what is happening is that either the brake pedal pushrod or the pushrod in between the master cylinder and brake booster is improperly adjusted (or both) and the brakes are never completely released. Some pressure is still being applied to the calipers and causing them to drag, wear out the pads and overheat the rotors which caused the caliper piston boot to get brittle or to melt.
Of course this could also be caused by brake hoses with internal damage and trapping pressure in the calipers, but we need more information. Like the 3 sets of pads in a year was important info that you didn't share earlier.
Are your brake pads wearing out on BOTH sides of the truck?
How about inner pads vs outer pads, are they wearing evenly or just inner or just outer?
Did you try the test I suggested to crack a bleeder valve and see if the wheel suddenly gets easier to spin?
To determine if it is the hoses are at fault you can crack the line above the hose and see if you get the same result (hit the brake again and verify it's hard to spin first). If the bleeder relieves the pressure but cracking the line above the hose does not then the hose is at fault. If you get the same result then you move up to the fittings at the master cylinder and repeat the test, press and release the brake, verify it's hard to spin, crack the fitting for the front brakes, verify how hard the wheel spins. If this test ALSO relieves the pressure and the wheel spins freely then your master cylinder is either shot or the pushrods are improperly adjusted.
Regardless of the testing and such your rotors should be replaced since they are probably worn past the minimum thickness and are likely warped, maybe the calipers too if they have been cooked (you did say the seal failed on one right?). Rebuilding calipers is cheaper, but with the time involved and the relatively low cost of new ones I recommend new.
My go to recommendation when it comes to brake systems is "fix it right, fix it once, and don't pinch pennies".
From what I see online your local parts store should be able to hook you up with calipers for about $50 each and rotors for the same, all in for the front is around $300 for parts, hoses, pads, rotors, calipers. Master cylinder is another $75 if you need it. These are Alaska prices and depending on your area or which store you use you will likely get by cheaper than that and it will save you a lot of time rebuilding calipers and wondering if they will hold pressure or not move smoothly enough.
Last edited by akwheeler; 05-04-2020 at 01:12 PM.
#12
Registered User
Thread Starter
This is the first time changing the pads since all the front end work was done. So I was under the assumption that the excessive pad wear was done until I checked them that day. It happens at a quicker rate on the passenger side. When I got the calipers put on, I supplied the part and the shop did the labor. Since the passenger side caliper failed at one piston I put the old caliper back on. The booster and cylinder are both newer. Although if I'd take a good guess I'd say the master cylinder isnt 100% up to par. The shop that replaced it cycled through a few masters before this one actually worked but I'm sure they were all of the same brand. The pads do wear pretty evenly. Maybe a 10% gradient difference when pads were removed from passenger side. Sometimes the pedal will catch high and quick and other times I'll require a couple presses. Which it was something I had gotten used to. But I don't want my brakes sticking lol. Sorry for replying so late. I got busy with work and house duties.
#13
Registered User
This is the first time changing the pads since all the front end work was done. So I was under the assumption that the excessive pad wear was done until I checked them that day. It happens at a quicker rate on the passenger side. When I got the calipers put on, I supplied the part and the shop did the labor. Since the passenger side caliper failed at one piston I put the old caliper back on. The booster and cylinder are both newer. Although if I'd take a good guess I'd say the master cylinder isnt 100% up to par. The shop that replaced it cycled through a few masters before this one actually worked but I'm sure they were all of the same brand. The pads do wear pretty evenly. Maybe a 10% gradient difference when pads were removed from passenger side. Sometimes the pedal will catch high and quick and other times I'll require a couple presses. Which it was something I had gotten used to. But I don't want my brakes sticking lol. Sorry for replying so late. I got busy with work and house duties.
Did you?
#14
Registered User
Thread Starter
I havent done any of the tests your recommended yet. I'll start tomorrow on my day off. I'm leaning towards the brake hoses or the master cylinder. I'm willing to pay for what it costs. I just dont want to replace anything that is genuinely good.
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