6lug

Im in the same boat...DD so I dont have a lot of down time with it.

And its not really a rush or anything...just figured I would do it in the summer when Im not in school, and have steady paycheck comin in...another reason for spending the money on the SAS is not because Im breaking IFS parts, but because Id rather spend the money I would be using to repair IFS to save up for a solid axle, which in the long run on an expedition style vehicle will be better, from what I have researched. The big prob here is just finding out how to do it...thanks for your help man!...Alex

Flygtenstein

Sprung under with a Toy axle would be a waste.

A 5" lift swap is still low. If you used Front Range stuff with a 3" spring you could conceivably be at 4", but why? Travel would be so out of whack.

Toy axles are set up for spring over. High steer is easy that way. Just do it.

Swaps are not cheap if done well. I am throwing a lot of other stuff at mine, but it would still not be cheap to be done well.

sschaefer3

Are the FJ60/62 and FJ40 a waste?

I still say my sprung under 4Runner is higher than your sprung over old junk.

Willys will be a low rider too......

Beep Beep it's a Jeep.

6lug

Flygtenstein, thanks for all the bashing of the idea, but Im thinking the same thing as Schaefer here....FJ 60's and 40's arent a waste IMO. And getting an 60 or 40 axle under my truck may not be great to you, but its not your truck. This is what Im looking to do, so why not help me out with it? Not getting pissy, just sayin. Thanks guys. Alex

Flygtenstein

I am helping you out.

A 40 front would be foolish.

A 60/62 front would at least be wider.

The diff is huge, but the birfs are the same.

I helped Steve hang it sprung under. Mine is spring over. Lah dee freakin' dah.

Do a low lift spring over. Almost every inch of travel will be extension.

Do a low lift spring under. Almost every inch of travel will be compression.

sschaefer3

Actually you do want to do a spring over, and here is why, your frame is a good 4-5" higher up than the newer trucks.

In 1996 they lowered the frame and the center of gravity, but everything 1995 and older has the same frame base as the orignal 1979 Mini. FJ's not included.

So a spring under works very well on new stuff, but a stock 1979-1985 Toyota SA sprung over is the way to go on your truck.

I recently did a 1991 4Runner with 6" lift springs and due to the frame distance, I know it's going to end up the same hight as my truck.

This is way a Tacoma or 3rd Gen 4Runner with the "old truck" formula always ends up a Monster truck with 12" of lift.

For example, my 3rd Gen and 2nd Gen rear bumpers sit in the same spot on each vehicle. But the 3rd Gen brackets g o up 3" and the 2nd Gen brackets go down 3".

The frames are not the same, do a small spring over lift and you will be fine. Seriously.

sschaefer3

I see someone needs to go to Band-Aids. I think you are going through desert withdrawl.

6lug

Fly, again, Im not tryin to be pissy...I was just sayin.

And shcaefer...I see what youre saying...I was actually thinking about that frame thing. Also, if I did a SOA, but a small one, what would I do about steering, b/c everyone is saying you have to go pretty big with lift to use Hysteer. If you get 4wd and Sport Utililty mag, there is an article on an FJ45 that has a SOA, but his tie rod goes below the springs. How do think that is accomplished?

Thanks to all of you guys....even FLY....Alex

sschaefer3

Use an FJ60 or FJ62 steering box with a forward arm and you won't have any problems.

Start collecting parts, buy an axle and then ask more questions. It will work, no worrries.

6lug

by forward arm, do you mean the pitman goes towards the front?

and FLY said something about the 60/62 dif being a lot bigger...is it not an 8"? Im not that familiar with that series and the axles and stuff. would it be better to use a 60/62 axle but SOA?

thanks, Alex

sschaefer3

Yes the arm goes forward, the problem with the IFS box is people have to shove them as far forward as possible.

The 60/62 series and the 40 series have a 9" diff not an 8". The 80 series has an 8" up front and a 9" out back.

When a 62 axle is converted to spring over they have a tendancy to break pinons on hill climbs.

You need an early 80's mini truck axle, after you get that and clean it up check back in and we'll go from there.

Good luck hunting one down.

6lug

Cool, thanks. I actually have a bead on an axle, and dont think its going anywhere. Here in E. Tenn, not too many people are looking for them. I appreciate all the help.

Oh, will the 60/62 steering box bolt right up and use the same plumbing?

Flygtenstein

There is no reason to use that box.

It will not bolt up.

Leave your IFS box where it is, move the axle forward 1.5" and run a standard IFS pitman arm.

No Bandaids, just the rocks. I miss the rocks.

6lug

AAHHHH! Conflicting Info!!! Ha, no worries. We'll see what happens as this project moves along.... thanks guys...alex

Oh, and if anyone wants to add anything else, please do. Ideas and the like are perfectly fine and very welcome...

sschaefer3

The plumbing is the same but no, it will not bolt up. I like the FJ boxes. That's just me, I like FJ parts. You will need to drill 4 new holes and sleeve them, with all 4 bolts throught the frame, not like the 2 through the frame and one through the horn, on the IFS box. You will also need to shorten your steering shaft or have a custom one made from an FJ-62 shaft.

Info is not conflicting, you never asked about installing it. For me it's all about useing a factory SA box and not an IFS box on a SA, sure it will work, but I'm not going to do it.

My buggy will have FJ steering as well. I just like it and will go to the extra lengths to install it.

6lug

Cool...I wasn't really being serious about the "conflicting info." It wasnt any big deal. I assumed you knew how to install one, so I asked. And then Fly came saying dif. so I just dropped a funny. Or a not so funny, I guess. Anyway, I know there have been tons of questions because this is quite a different plan than most people have, and I dont want to just put a lift on and be done. I want this to work how I want it to. Thanks for all of ya'lls help.....Alex

44Runner

don't know off the top of my head how easy this would be because I don't know if you have room for it but the pimpness would be this...

If you want to run a wicked low spring over run an inside the frame rail PS box with the tie rod in the stock location. Retaper the knuckles for 3/4 chevy stuff and run a TRE on the passenger side with a drag link mount. That would give maximum steering clearance. Run a super beef tie rod and setup your leaf suspension any way you like.

rockota

Won't work in his application - there isn't room on the inside of the frame for the steering box.

All this said, I disagree w/ Flyg, and while I think Shaefer has some good points, I see no reason to use the FJ box or axles.

Seriously, this isn't that big of a deal. FRORF hangers, Marlin 3" springs, standard crossover (though, it will be more expensive these days than hi-steer) and be done. No need to mess w/ steering boxes, no need to mess with FJ axles, etc.

You don't need a lot of compression travel for wheeling, unless you are doing desert style prerunning. 2-3" is more than plenty. You don't want your springs to negatively arch anyway, and Marlin recommends about that much up-travel anyway.

You will get 4" of lift out of the above setup, maybe 4.5". But, that's about as low as you can go.

Unless you run the FRORF crssmember mounted in the "stock" position with OME 2" springs and standard cross-over... That will net you about 3", but you'll spend more time ensuring there are no clearance issues.

As for the possibility of he Pitman arm/TRE hitting the springs, go with either a flatter SKY pitman arm or have a normal pitman arm tapered the opposite way so the TRE mounts on the top.

6lug

Im really not looking for a superflexy rock crawler suspension anyway. Just a low SFA. Anything would be an improvement over the IFS, but more than that it is just a whole lot stronger, etc. So really flexy isnt my #1 goal here.


On a standard crossover, would I just leave the tie rod where it is on the axle i get, then do a drag link from the IFS box to the right knuckle? Would I need an aftermarket steering arm on top of the right knuckle to connect the drag link? And one more...any issues with the drag link (after its moved higher on a flat pitman or whatever) hitting the oil pan?

Thanks...Alex

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

Yes, with regular crossover, you leave the tie rod where it is:



This is a 3" - 3.5" lift on my '85 at the time. The clearance issue is mainly with the drag link either contacting the passenger side frame under compression or the passenger side spring under droop. This is especially true on an IFS frame where you don't have the built-in arch over the front axle.



Thus the minimum lift requirement. One option that a few folks take is to notch the frame where the drag link runs, then weld in some bracing to restore the strength.