Thought you guys might get a kick out of this!

http://www.theautochannel.com/....html
Quote »
DETROIT, June 3, 2004; Reuters reported that Toyota Motor Corp. stripped Ford Motor Co. of its crown as the maker of America's best-selling car in 1997, and it may soon be gunning for its share of the lucrative full-size pickup truck market.
But Ford Chairman and Chief Executive Bill Ford Jr. said on Thursday that Toyota, which overtook his company last year as the world's second-largest automaker in terms of global sales, was "not invulnerable."

The Ford family scion spoke at an investment conference sponsored by Sanford Bernstein in New York, where he was asked about Toyota's plans to open a new assembly plant late next year outside San Antonio, Texas, to build an all-new version of its Tundra pickup.

The truck, designed for American tastes and powered by a big V-8 engine, is expected to be a formidable competitor in the pickup segment and a vehicle that could put a ***** in the armor of Ford's F-150 pickup, a perennial best-seller that generates a major percentage of Ford's automotive profits.

Bill Ford said he had plans for the F-150 to counter anything from Toyota, suggesting his design and engineering teams were already working on a freshened or new model of the truck launched just last year.

He declined to elaborate but said Ford was keeping a close eye on Toyota and would not take any new competition lying down.

"Suffice it to say they have our attention," Ford said of the Japanese juggernaut, whose stock value of about $120 billion exceeds the combined worth of Ford, General Motors Corp. and DaimlerChrysler

"Just as they analyze us, and our potential strongholds and weakness, we do the same for them," Ford said.

 

ilocan,

interesting read. yeah, any company that gets too arrogant is always open to being overtaken. like ford!

more interesting than that is the language that the writer used to describe the japanese (toyota) in rather perjorative terms. you edited one out and the other one, while less offensive, is a hold over word from the WWII days (juggernaut). as if we are still at war with japan for god's sake

bob

 

Ford always redesigns their stuff 3-4 times a year to keep up with everyone else. They should do it right in the first place.

 

Oh man, my stomach hurts again. Bill demonstrates some of the worst aspects of nepotism. He should go play golf with his buds in Naples.

The big Freudian slip came from the writer:

"The Ford family scion..." What, Bill's driving a tC already?

 

Why so quick to bash ford?? Yeah, thier cars may not be as reliable as Toyotas and other companies...BUT they are a very solid company that probably provides a 100,000+ jobs to our nation. There vehicles are good enough as far as Im concerned. SO what if they have a bunch of recalls and whatnot...the cars are typically significantly cheaper than Toyotas anyway.

If every car on the road was built to last 10 years w/o any issues...just think of the negative effect that could have on our economy. The auto industry is a HUGE resource the the US. And just not autos too...Hospitals, Research facilities, etc.

Ford, GM, Chrysler...they are doing it right - just not in everyone's eyes

 

Well, you could've bought a 20 year old Bronco.

Ford will hold the full-size crown for awhile, only by a little less each year. Politics plays an important part in Toyota decision making. They'll be production constrained to 150,000 for awhile. You know, the same way Camry started.

You're right, though. The recall industry can keep hummin' along with Ford in a big leadership position.

I sort of look upon Ford as the Heinz corporation. Profits flow to the family foundations where Beneficiaries spend wildly on some whacky causes. It's an eye-opener to look into if you're interested, but no politics today.

 

I don't know where to begin on a statement like that. So I'll leave it simple, If that is the mindset and that is the way to CREATE jobs there is something seriously wrong.

 

I said nothing about creating jobs...the jobs are already there. But if the industry moves into building indestructable cars...well bye bye jobs. Come on think about it for a minute...

Im not saying Ford purposefully builds cars that fall apart in 10 years...Im just saying that they are more concerned about the first 3 years than the last 7. Make people happy in the first three and they will buy another and another and another. I know MANY ford addicts. My Jappaneese landlord buys nothing buy them...

 

Ford really isnt the full size truck king, GM sells more Chevys and GMC's combined than Ford does, they just choose to count them seperately even though they roll off the same line.

 

Ok just to make JP happy ...

all the guys building fords can move to Texas and build tundras ...

 

PoBoy,

I beg to differ. The premise of your argument is exactly why there aren't more Americans working in the auto industry. And that hurts the domestic economy. Think about it this way: yes, you are right that Ford hires American workers. That is a good thing. But the flip side is if they built cars that were as or even more reliable than Toyota, more people would buy Fords (and less, Toyota).

Bob

 

What happens when cheap and inferior products kill or injure you? Is that worth the money you save buying a vehicle that is being recalled AFTER it's proven faulty from a handful of deaths attributed to quality. It took a few people to die before Mitsubishi recalled a seal on their transfer cases on their AWD Eclipses which Mitsubishi knew was a problem. Quality isn't just about the engine or radio working forever but the vehicle as a whole.

Plus if Ford makes cars that only last a little while then they will just fill up our landfills over time and contribute to global decay but I guess that creates jobs too,huh?

I'm not rich so I buy products that are proven to last a while and get my money's worth and IMO vehicles should be one of them.

Ford will be losing jobs if they continue to make inferior products since eventually people will smarten up and Ford will lose sales and jobs,oh wait a minute,that's already happening.

 

I guess I just dont feel that ford makes that much of an inferior product. There cars cost less than toyota's...so you have to expect it not to last as long. I also dont feel that ford makes a cheap vehicle that falls apart either. We've had 3 mustangs, a couple minivans, and now a Lightning...all great cars. Sure they had some minor problems...but so did my 96 4Runner. Not much different.

I totally see ya'lls points though and understand completely. If I was ford, I would beef up on reliability too...but at the same time - its just gonna create problems if all cars last 10 years. Say Ford beefed up their reliability...people buy ford. Well what happends when everyone has a reliable car that lasts 10 years? There is no need to buy anymore. Thus, less production and it goes down from there. I just see bad things in the future for the auto industry. If toy and honda start producing with a "more power" attitude...the american auto industry will die. Toy and honda will survive only because they have the market cornered and they sell a mass amount of cars - but probably just as many as they do today because people will start driving their reliable cars for 10 years.

Basically, there just isnt room for 10 automakers all making reliable cars...you gotta have the cheap, ok, and good levels. Thats how business works. If I can save $4k on a car that I only want for 3 years anyway...why spend the extra money? Yeah, resale yatta yatta..but that $4k makes a big difference in your payements...so who cares what you could get for it in 3 years if you cant afford it in the first place. Thats why you have the cheap beer, the okay beer, and the good beer.

This is too hard to explain...give me a call if you want to talk about it I just think that if everyone made same thing (reliable cars)...well then there is no need for all the automakers. Gotta have different levels...

 

I think my problem with some of these arguments stems from the assumption that "toyotas are more expensive because it costs more to make a reliable car". (feel free to substitue hondas or whatever).

The reality of it is that Toys (etc) are more expensive because they are perceived as being more reliable and thus fall at a higher point on the demand curve, and can therefore charge higher prices.

In reality, due to higher automation and what not, I think it costs *less* to make them than their theoretically less reliable "american" counterparts.

--

Also, I've always had a problem with the idea that anything that creates/maintains jobs is by definition a good thing. That's why we still have helium factories in operation in the south generating gas for our dirigible fleet (which, of course, doesn't exist, and I suspect never did).

If the fords, etc. were more desirable (higher on the demand side of the supply/demand equation), the job utilization would increase due to higher demand for those products, not from a need to treat them as a disposable resource.

I am, of course, completely biased because I've never kept a car for less than ten years! My commuter (Acura) just passed 200K, and my runner's on its way past 100k. My g/f is trying to convince me I need to get a new car, and I just look at her with that big-ole confused face and say "why would I do that?"

EDIT:
After re-reading PoBoy's last post, I realize I didn't say anything to do with his points at all, so my apologies if anyone thinks I did. Whoops! Treat this as another one of my random socialogical rants....

 

A comparable Explorer cost the same as a 4Runner so I don't see where Fords are cheaper except when you move to the under $20k price range but with Toyotas the quality is a major jump from anything in the Focus price range for a few grand more. The Focus initially has had more recalls than any car i history but I admit Ford has fixed most of it's problems but it sure took a few model years to fix 'em.

 

guys,

dont forget that importing adds onto the price of our 4runners. i believe it, the prius and the land cruiser are the only toy vehicles still imported into the united states. if those import duties and taxes were removed, 4runners would be cheaper than a comparably equipped exploder.

jp, ill agree with you on the point where you say that all mfgs have their bottom end, mid-level and high end products. i do agree in a different way with respect to your point that there isnt enough room for all mfgs. as a firm beleiver in capitalism and competition, the market will dictate which ones survive and which ones will be relegated to the low end or bankruptcy.

to me, the best thing to happen to domestic car mfgs is competition from german and japanese auto mfgs. it forced our big 3 to re-examine how they do business, improve their products to meet japanese quality standards, etc. there's a classic example of how the ford taurus could be optioned/spec'd out over 200 ways while the honda accord could only be optioned out in 4 or 5. this allowed honda to achieve its profitability objectives and at the same time, focus on building a better product.

bob

 

[QUOTE]to me, the best thing to happen to domestic car mfgs is competition from german and japanese auto mfgs. it forced our big 3 to re-examine how they do business, improve their products to meet japanese quality standards QUOTE]

The big three should have listened to Dr Deming years ago. He tried to tell them this exact thing but they wouldn't listen, so he went to the Japanese.

 

Some people ignore quality since they become such brand whores with cars;I'm glad I now own a Yota since they have true quality built into them and is reflected in customer surveys like J.D. Power and such.