LSUMatt1514

Alright, first let me give you a brief background. My truck is a 2001 with the 5VZFE V6 with approximately 187,000 miles on it. Here is a brief explanation of the problems that I've had in recent history...

1. About two years ago, I started gettting code P0420...Catalyst Efficiency Below Threshold. Based off the advice here and from my local dealer's service deparment manager, I have just lived with this. I have not noticed any performance degradation, so I have just checked the code when the CEL came on and if it was P0420, then I cleared it. The service manager said that he could not guarantee that if I spent $1,500 on two new cats that the code wouldn't come back in a couple of weeks so again...I've just dealt with it for the past couple of years.

2. About 6-7 months ago, I was driving on the interestate and the CEL started to flash. I had never seen this before. I pulled over and the code was P0300...Random/Multiple Cylinder Misfire. Since I had recently had my 180k service done at another dealer than I normally use (including a timing belt replacement which at the time I thought was the culprit here) and had just had it done, I figured they screwed something up. I took it back in to Hoover Toyota and they found a loose vacuum hose. They also talked me into replacing the plugs and plug wires. The plugs were due and the wires never replaced, so I let them do it. I have since gotten this CEL at least once, maybe twice since then before the episode today.

3. On the way to buy my wife's Sequoia in November, I started to hear a ticking/clicking sound from the engine. That dealer checked it as well as a local one...as did I. The sound appears to be coming from the driver's side and both dealers said that it was a lifter that was chattering. I swapped from 5W30 Mobil SuperSyn to 10W40 Mobil SuperSyn per both dealers' recommendation in an attempt to stop it. Both dealers told me it would not harm the engine to drive it with this ticking sound. Just embarrassing and annyoing. So that's what I've been doing since November. It's still ticking by the way.

4. Now the big one...Let me preface it by saying that we finally came to a decision last night not to buy a 2003-2004 Camry. I just got a promotion that is going to double my commute to work (now 100 miles round trip each day) and since I want a new Tundra in a few years (no sense in buying it now and running up the miles on it...not to mention the MPGs!!!) we were going to park the 4Runner and buy a 4 cylinder Camry for me to drive back and forth to work that had less miles and got much, much better MPG. I've got so much tied up in accessories on my truck and know that I will not get much for it so we basically decided we'd have it for years and years to come and not trade or sell it. Then today happens....

My wife and I are on the interstate on the way home from Circuit City. I had just bought a new Garmin 260W GPS. It was my gift to myself for my promotion and a way to add another mod and spruce up the 4Runner since I was gonna keep driving it. On the way home, the CEL starts flashing again and the other two amber lights on dash come on. I get home and I've got FOUR codes in the computer's memory...

P0302...Cylinder 2 Misfire
P0300...Random/Multiple Cylinder Misfire
P0305...Cylinder 5 Misfire
P0442...Evaporative Emissions Control System Leak Detected (Small Leak)

And don't forget the P0420 (Catalytic Converter) that I've been dealing with for two years but it wasn't present today.

I've read stuff online that this could be coil packs, it could be a head gasket, could be caused by the catalytic converters, that the evaporative emissions code is a pin hole leak in a fuel line, on and on and on and on. It's one of those deals that there is no easy way to pin point it.

Help me out here guys. It's got to go to the shop tomorrow so I can at least determine if I've got major engine issues and/or two cats that need to be replaced. Anyone that can provide any help on these codes will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance for your help.



Matt

97ltd4x4

Since cylinder #2 and #5 are controled from the same coil......could switch coils....My money is on that coil pack needing replacement.

That first random cylinder misfire code p0300 way back when, could have been the first sighn of a cylinder starting to missfire,but if its a weak spark,not a totally dead cylinder the computer is not fast enough to detect it.

Your evap code is an isolated problem.

Your cat code is an isolated problem.

Food for thought on your knocking noise,I have seen cam gear bolts not tightened enough causing a noise after a t-belt service especially if seals were replaced.Noise comming from loose side......Also using thicker oil would do no good to try and quiet a loud lifter since Toyota only uses soild cam tappet shims and buckets.

toytech76

I would also suspect a coil pack or possibly injectors. If you switch the coil pack and the miss follows it, you will know for sure. The evap code could be from a loose gas cap or another loose evap hose, so those are easy to check. Cat code is self explanatory. Its hard to diag a noise without hearing it. I would get it running right first then go after it. You have no lifters, just shims and buckets sitting on top of the valve spring retainer. Make sure nothing was dropped into the cylinder when they did the plugs. That could cause your misfire as well on #5 if there was something in there. It would probably of bent the electrode on the plug if so. As far as you buying a camry. Don't get a 02-03 4cyl camry. They have problems with the back middle 3 head bolts pulling threads out of the block. I have personally fixed 3 within this last year. Toyota is not acknowledging this as an official 'problem'. They put out a TSB for those years for an 'updated' engine block, but nothing about the problem. I would stick with camrys before or after those years

mt_goat

I'd check to see if the crank bolt has loosened up. It often happens after a timing belt change (if not torqued to spec, 217 ft-lbs) It will make a ticking noise and can throw a misfire code.

3w41d

check your compression and see if there is any variation...if there isn't, at least you can rule out mechanical problems

LSUMatt1514

Thanks for the input guys!!! I'm going to my reliable dealer tomorrow....no that's not a misprint. The guys I normally use are reliable and reasonable. Thanks again and keep it coming!

Matt

LSUMatt1514

The two cylinder misfire codes were caused by a shorted coil pack, common to cylinders 2 and 5. Got it replaced and no problems thus far.

As for the ticking/clicking sound that's been going on since November 10....it turns out that Hoover Toyota broke one off in me when they did the timing belt replacement on October 16, 2007. The ticking sound started on November 10, 2007 and I've been living with it ever since. The Wednesday after it started, I returned to Hoover Toyota and had them inspect it. I was told that it was a chattering lifter and they would have to go into the engine and re-shim it (or something to that effect) but that if I didn't want to do it right now...it was fine to drive. I mentioned the recent timing belt replacement and they were very quick to discount that as having anything to do with it. Their recommendation...run a heavier weight oil (10W40) which I did and it did not help the situation at all. Well after today I completely understand why.

So I go to Limbaugh today and here is what they find....they found play in the front crank pulley and found the front crank bolt loose causing the pulley to be off kilter. They also had to replace the crank key due to damage from me driving it since November with it ticking like this and having that much play in it. The tech told me that I'm lucky I didn't break the crank shaft because he has seen it before. I spent 45 minutes on the phone voicing my utter and complete displeasure with Hoover's service manager. He wants me to fax a copy of the invoice tomorrow from Limbaugh so that he and his shop foreman can review it. He then made the statement that they would "see about helping me some." Some?!?!?! Some?!?!?! Don't think so podnah...more like all of it!!! The $280 worth of labor that I spent on that today will be reimbursed in full or I will be contacting the BBB, Toyota, and possibly an attorney. If you are ever in the Birmingham area, in the market for a car...whatever you do...DO NOT GIVE HOOVER TOYOTA ANY BUSINESS!!! Thanks for all the help guys!

BTW...they could find no leaks to be causing the evaporative emissions leak code. I'm just gonna have to see if it comes back but they told me it held pressure for over 15 minutes. Could've just been the gas cap, but I hadn't gassed up in three or four days so I'm just gonna monitor this one.

Matt

cgeorge

Matt - I think your 4Runner knows you were going to park it and it is now getting even with you.

Good luck with the fix and let us know what happens... I feel your pain with the P0420 light.

mt_goat

Yeah you're about the 3rd or 4th one on here I've seen that had that happen. Toyota first started having this problem when the 5VZFE first came out 96-97, the crank bolt was loosening up from the factory. So they changed the torque spec from 185 ft-lbs to 217 ft-lbs and that apparantly solved the problem. Unfortunately the new spec didn't get into the manuals everywhere, and worst of all the main data base that most techs use still has the old spec. So your bolt may still be under torqued and loosen up later, unless you're sure they torqued it to the new 217 ft-lbs spec. I'd ask them what they torqued it to if I were you.

yarosig

My NGK plugs went out on my #1 cyl. after 2 weeks, I'd pull the plugs and replace them on those 2 cylinders if I was you.

LSUMatt1514

Have six new platinum plugs installed at the 180k service....can't remember if they were Denso or NGK but they are practically brand new. Are you saying that the failed coil pack may have somehow damaged the plugs?

Matt

yarosig

I'm just saying I put in brand new NGK's and one went out on me 2 weeks later. I was also getting the same codes as you.

toytech76

Its very possible that a failed coil pack can damage the plugs as in carbon tracking them and causing them to misfire

LSUMatt1514

I'll swap them at my next oil change.

What are the chances that me driving this truck with the loose crank bolt for approximately 4 months could have weakened the crank shaft and it might potentially fail in the future? Maybe not immediately, but within the next year or so?

I sent all my info in to Hoover Toyota this morning. The service manager reviewed it with their shop foreman and without hesitation, they agreed to reimburse me the full amount to have the work re-done. Hoover's service manager told me on the phone that their shop foreman stated that it indeed could have broken the crank shaft and they completely dropped the ball on the missed diagnosis right after the noise started (back in November).

I'm just worried that it's been weakened now guys. I've only put about 8,000 miles on it since the work was done, but I'm nervous that my crank shaft is now weak. Help ease my concerns....please!

Matt

zlathim

Don't sweat it, it's probably fine. Either way though, you have a paper trail of the dealerships misdiagnosis and failure to correct the problem. Sounds like good ammunition if you have any trouble down the road.

mkgarrison5

X2!! your butt is covered if it were to ever f up...

i wonder if my mechanic torqued it correctly too when he replaced the tbelt? hmmm... i told him before i took it in to torque it to 217lb but i dont know if he did... what kind of knocking sound did it give off?? my truck ticks now but its the same ole lifter tick.

1989toy4wd

I bet its the coil, and the evap p0442 is just the gas cap, replace it cause it is starting to leak, or you just didnt tighten it all the way!

LSUMatt1514

I definitely have a paper trail....thanks for the help guys. I was amazed at how quick they admitted fault and were willing to reimburse me for the work another dealer did to fix their crap. I think they know they dodged a really, really big bullet...at least for now. Fingers crossed it doesn't break!!!

Matt

mkgarrison5

phew, i am good to go. my mechanic has the up to date specs on the crank bolt.. lol.. thank you yotatech for making me over paranoid hahaha :-)