mummer43

Do car dealers think we are idiots?
I recently came to an agreement with a Toyota dealer for a 2004 Tacoma V6 TRD/manual tranny. The price we agreed on is $22,600. I tell him that I'm going to come in a put a deposit on it this weekend.

I start doing some figuring, just to see what my payment will be. Toyota is offering 2.9% financing, which I qualify for. So I figured that with $5,00 down, my payment will be $339.77 per month, but I didn't add the title fees. I figure that should only be about $100 or so and it won't affect my payment all that much.

So I email the dealer with this just to make sure we're on the same page. I got a call from the sales person a little while later saying that my figuring was right, but I forgot to add in the title fees. He says that my payment is about $30 off because I didn't add the title fees.

I told him that would mean my payment would be around $370 per month and he said "that's right." So I told him I think his figuring is wrong and he better correct it or I'm going elsewhere and he says "ok."

Does he think I'm stupid? An extra $30 per month for 60 months is $1,800!!!! Adding $150 to the price only makes it $342 per month.

Does anyone know what title fees should cost in PA? The sad thing is some people would fall for this.

Paul H.

Its been a long time since I bought a vehicle, but it shouldn't cost more than $100. I think he is trying to pad his profit.

Bob_98SR5

wait...he's trying to roll up your TTL into the car payment?!?! why not pay the TTL right up front? why finance all that? or am i not understanding something here?

bob

DSP

I would also ask for a detailed settlement sheet, so there is no way there could be any GREY area for what you are financing.

I also agree with bob, it seems silly to roll your licensing and title fees into your payment, especially with 5K down, whats another couple hundy up front?

mummer43

He was trying to roll tag, plate and registration into the payment and get over on me. I told another dealer about it and he made it sound like it's a common practice.

In PA, it costs $58 for registration and probably another 20 to 30 for a plate and temp. tags. The registration may even include the plate.

Another thing I hate is how they say their giving me the car for invoice when I already know what invoice is. It's readily available on the net. They are not giving me the car for invoice... it's about $500 over, which I think is fair.

mummer43

Are there any PA guys here who could tell me what title and registration should reasonable cost?

4RUNR

Title/Tags $95 in PA in 2002. So slightly above that now.

mummer43

Ok, thanks! I don't plan on spending more than $100.

bamachem

You guys have it lucky. Down here, the price of the tag is proportional to the value of the vehicle. My 99 2wd and my wife's 03 Acura TL together are about $750 per year! That's just for the tags EVERY YEAR! Sales taxes are anywhere from 3-4.5% at the time you purchase the car. That's in addition to the $about $35 title app fee.

Sac State

Pay the tax, title, etc. out of pocket. Don't finance taxes!

EDGE

He knows you want the truck so now he's gonna start raising the price,

Check the invoice price of the truck you want, email several dealers in your area and ask them if they can deal with you on this price then when the dealers say yes use that price to get other dealers to lower their price, telling them your ready to buy now is good incentive for them, then your playing the game with them.

AgRunner06

Yeah, that additional $1800 is TT&L, not just the title fees. You won't be able to get out of that if you go anywhere else. It will always be there no matter what dealership you go to. Your $22,600 price is just the price of the vehicle, not the "out the door" total. Yep, TT&L is just a fact of life. When I was looking at a $15K truck, my TT&L was still going to be about a grand.

TT&L = Sales Tax (.08% give or take a little), title ($100 or so from what you guys have said), and license (not too sure how much that costs)

If he pays the TT&L up front it's going to cut into his down payment. Unless he has almost 2 grand laying around. If you pay the TT&L up front than that will be less interest you pay in the long run. The problem is that your payment will be higher unless you come up with more money for the down payment.

SLC Punk

That's exactly what I was thinking. Its gotta be sales tax that is part of the $1,800

Billrunner

salestax is a bitch
I hate it especially on a pre-owned vehicle- how many times can a state make tax on one vehicle

mummer43

The tax is included in tthe $339 per month payment. In PA, sales tax is 6%. that would make the tax $1,356. I figured out the payment INCLUDING tax. the saleman even said my figures were right, just that I forgot to add the title fees, which he tried to tell me would make my payment $30 per month MORE.

mummer43

Here are the figures:

Sales Tax 6%
Selling Price $22,600
Sale Tax = $1,356
Down $5,000

Principal Amt. borrowed $18,956

Number of months 60
Interest rate 2.9%
total interest $1,430.37

Total cost of the loan $20,386.37

MONTHLY PAYMENT $339.77

The dealer was definately trying to get over on me. I told another dealer this story and he just laughed.

AbramHart

One thing I hate about car dealers is trade ins. They always want to give you Wholesale for your vehicle NOT TRADE IN. Then they will turn around and sale it for what ever the highest value is on the car. I have traded 3 vehicles in Arkansa last trade was over 3 years ago. But on these trades I was able to get a trade in value and them still come off there cars. It seems now that since people like United Auto group have come in they only offer wholesale. Other dealers are now doing the same thing. Heres a great one. I purchased a new 02 dodge dakota RT for $25,900 turned around in one year to trade it. This thing had 11000 miles on it and was in perfect condition NO scratches and just a clean truck. $12800 is what they would give me for it. That is wholesale. That was 8 car dealers. I had to sale the truck out right to get rid of it. Key word is it was a DODGE. But this applies to all vehicles pretty much. My dad has a 1996 4runner SR5 that is worth more trade in than his 2000 tundra SR5 TRD. What is up with that. I had a car dealer at Landers Dodge in Benton and I was looking at an RT I asked him if that was the best price he could do on it. He said yes. So I talked a little more and told him that I found one of the same calibur for 600 less. He told me that I should go buy it and then he hoped on his golf cart and drove off. Me standing there in dis belief that a car salesman would do this. I took my happy but to another dealer and bought my truck from them. Then I got screwed by them to.

Man dealers have become such anal people that I hate to deal with them.. I have only found 2 dealers in the state of Arkansas that want to work with you. Russell Honda in Sherwood Arkansas
and Teeters motor group in Malvern Arkansas. These guys are great. For all the other Yahoo robet car dealers. GO F yourself because you are loosing customers for beeing the way you are.

mt_goat

Make sure he isn't adding something else in. I bought a car in San Diego once and when we were starting the paper work the guy is trying to sell me a extended warranty for $500. I said no thanks. Then he comes down to $300. I said no thanks. Then he comes down to $200. I still said no thanks. Well he finally got down to zero!!!!! That's right FREE! Well being very wary of a salesman trying very hard to sell me something for nothing, I ask how he was able to offer me the extended warranty for free? He gave me some bull and I kept on asking questions and finally it dawned on me he has already added it into the deal and now he just needs my signature on it. He had already added $500 into the calculations for the payments for the car, and now was trying to add it in again. Had I said yes to the $500 for the extended warranty I guess I would have ended up paying $1000 for it. Since I figured out what he was doing I was able to get the payments lowered by removing the extra $500 he had put in the fine print on the contract. Don't ever go by the monthly payment. What you need to keep an eye on is the purchase price for the car and everything else added into the fine print. Make them account for every penny over the purchase price agreed on. Take your own calculator into the office and crunch the numbers your self before you sign anything.

AgRunner06

Those are the exact same numbers that I got. Now I'm going to say go somewhere else. Almost $3200 in extra fees is rediculous.

Maybe you can get another dealership to purchase the truck from that dealership and then buy it from the other one.

mummer43

I have an appointment at another dealership tomorrow. I plan on going to the original dealership for service, though, because it's much closer to my house.