Randyman...

Let me warn you - I'm a bit wordy. I have a 1987 4x4 4-Runner with the 22RE and 5-Speed and some 32"s that's been parked for close to 10 years, and I'm just about ready to get it back on the road. I have tons of questions on the motor swap.

The Transmission, Transfer Case and rear-end are in alright shape. It could use some electrical and interior work, etc, but the Body/Chassis is fairly solid.

The last time I looked into this 8 years ago, the Ford 302 was a good choice since it has the distributor in the front and had lots of adapters available - but now with the newer Chevy's having distributor-less ignition - has that recommendation changed? I'm not partial to either brand.

I also wouldn't mind going with a 5VZ-FE 3.4L as I also have a 99 Tacoma 4x4, and its 3.4L has 215K miles and doesn't burn any oil and runs like new. A bit less power then I'd want, but a big step up from a modded 22RE. What years are the best for the 5VZ-FE? And what mods/adapters are needed? Body lift required?

If I go with a domestic V8, then I'll likely get a new/rebuilt tranny and keep the Toyota Transfer Case and Rear End. If I go with the 5VZ-FE, What transmissions would work with the 5VZ-FE and stock 1987 Transfer Case? Would an entire 3.4L Tacoma/4Runner Drivetrain (Motor/Tranny/Transer) fit in my 87 4-Runner?

For any of these motor options, what are some of the best donor vehicles to look for the complete packages?


A few preferences:

* I'd love to avoid a body lift - and being an 87 it has the IFS. Oil Pan Clearance?
* I'd prefer an EFI setup (hoping to get CPU/Harness with the motor).
* I'd prefer a swap that has adapters available as I'm not a fabricator
* This will be a daily driver - Fuel Economy is nice but not a deal breaker
* Air Conditioning IS A MUST!
* Probably buy a used Motor/EFI/Tranny and have them rebuilt
* Not a hardcore off-roader - mainly on-road daily driver applications
* Want a fairly silent exhaust
* Looking to keep the swap under $10K total (plus another $5K on other fix-ups - interior, etc)

I know there is a LOT of info out there - I'm just looking for the best general concensus on the easier and more reliable swaps for my 87 4-Runner. I hope to get another 250K out of it!

Thanks for pointing me in the right direction - Picking the Motor is not the easiest part - so I'd LOVE to hear your personal pros and cons to any motor/tranny options. If such an outline of "Motor A requires this and has these drawbacks, Motor B requires this and has these drawbacks, Motor C requires this" etc - then please point me to it.

Rock!

Randyman...

Bump.

I realize I seem like a 100% noob begging for someone to hold my hand - but I've just been out of the loop for close to a decade (I turned 36 TODAY!). I've done my share of custom work to my beloved 87 4x4 4Runner (rebuilt the motor twice and tons of other crap - NWOR, Downey, and Jeff Watson @ Toyota Parts sucked my wallet dry back in the day!) - and now it's time to do a motor transplant from a much younger ride My 4Runner was kept at my Grandma's house for close to 10 years - and she passed away recently and we just sold her house - so now I'm having to pay $100/Mo to store the 4Runner elsewhere. The sooner I figure out my game plan and start tracking down parts - the better

I'm honestly overwhelmed by the number of posts on this subject - so I'm requesting a nice shove in the right direction.

My main concerns are with which motor to go with. I'm not a fabricator per se - so I'd like something that has adaptors and stuff available and I'd love to avoid the body lift if at all possible.

I absolutely adore my 99 Taco and it's 3.4L - so if the 3.4L + Manual 5-Speed is something that would work w/o too much trouble in my 87 4Runner - then I'll probably go that route - but I believe a Ford/Chevy V8 would end up being cheaper and stronger (but easier or harder as far as the swap goes?). And I believe a body lift is a must with a V8.

Any suggestions on where to start narrowing down the vast number of possibilities out there?

If there is a "one stop shop" for a list of which motors and tranny's will fit into my 87 4Runner and a list of available adapters - I'd be ever-so-grateful if you would point me to it. I don't mind reading hundreds of pages if I need to - but you generally end up with 99 pages of stuff that isn't relevant to the exact situation and 1 that is - and my old brain's FIFO is filling up QUICK!

My other option is to sell the 4-Runner for scrap (has lots of sentimental value as it was my ride in High School) and shift my focus to my 99 Tacoma 4x4 V6 with 215K miles. Or my 3rd option is to screw both of them, and buy something new/used in the $20K-$25K price range - or a used one in the $10K range and spend $10K on "fixing it up". I'm an emotional sap - so I'd prefer to hang onto my loyal trucks since they've treated me so well over the decades assuming I can get something figured out soon. NTM I'm not a huge fan of the newer Toyota trucks and 4Runners - they look too "American" to me?

Thanks so much from a Toyota 4x4 fanboy of 20 Years!

Randyman...

Point taken. I'll see what I can come up with on my own. So many options!!!

On the topic - does anyone have a shop they recommend for such work (if I have a shop do it) in the Houston area?

Thanks for looking

toyotanube89

hey if you diy could you relay some advice?

Randyman...

It would be my pleasure - but it's not looking like I will have the time or welding capabilities to do the 5VZ-FE I'd prefer to swap in. I believe the Ford 302 has most brackets available to make this possible w/o welding, but then I have to do a body lift, and other fun mods, etc.

I'll have to complete my research (slow going - SO much info and it is hard to find specifics on my 87 and "Motor A will fit with these adapters with this tranny and this transfer case w/o a body lift or any welding" - so I'm having to do a lot of reading in-between the lines and basically learn more about other model years that I care to know

Is there a definitive "one stop" list with what motors fit in which generation trucks with what tranny's and transfer cases - and what adapters are available? I feel sorry for anyone that doesn't have 8 hours a day to research all of the available options out there as the info is sprawled across thousands of threads on dozens of forums!!!

I'll let you know what I decide on - but I'll probably have a shop do the work. Another guy on this forum stated he got a 3.4L PLUS installation for $2800 "out the door"! If I could find someone to do it for any less than $5000 I'd be pretty ecstatic about it - but all of the estimates I've received so far are MUCH higher than that

I'd love some more pointers to a central thread that lists what will fit in my 87 4-Runner 22RE/5-Speed and the associated drivelines and modifications that are required, but I don't believe such a thread exists - but I'll keep surfing "on the clock" until I can make sense of it Hope I don't get fired for surfing so much at work I'll know more than I could ever care to know about a broad range of Toyota Trucks by the time I can make up my mind!

Rock on

xxxtreme22r

personally if it were me, I'd be doing the 302 swap myself. Even though I give some unmentioned person on here crap about his ford. Funny thing is I grew up a chevy nut. but have also owned several fords as well. One reason why I like the ford over the chevy is the fact the fords have the distributor stuff up front whereas the chevies are in the back. Which makes it a PITA to tune etc etc.

Randyman...

Yep - I recall the front-mounted distributor being a plus on the 302 back from my initial research in the late 90's. I'd probably prefer a newer OBD-II motor that would have distributor-less ingition (AKA coil per plug) - would that make any difference in your preference?

I'm more of a Chevy fan myself - but my first preference is to go Toyota/Lexus as my 5VZ-FE in my Taco has realy impressed me over the past 9 years! 215K and going strong as new! The 1982 Chevy Z28 305 4-Speed we had when I was a younger was burning oil and running like a dog well before it hit 100K!

If I'm going to drop $5K plus on my 4Runner - I want it to last AT LEAST another 200K (already has 250K on it!)...

Thanks for your very helpful input - it means a lot to this re-claimed noob

xxxtreme22r

see my sig for an answer to that question

Randyman...

Your sig says you run the 22R - correct? Or are you talking about the other quote "the use of computers and other electronics that might compromise the vehicles reliability"? If that's the case then I'd counter with my 99 Taco's 5VZ-FE with 215K on it that runs like new vs the Z28 we had with a carbureted 305 that ran like crap at 80K and burned oil like crazy!

Clarification please?

Thanks

toyotanube89

thank you for the help im tryin to get some photos up of the 4runner but my computer dosent like my camera :/

xxxtreme22r

nope 22r with weber carb, no electronics here. and I would like to recounter with this not one thing on this thing is mechanical 250,000 miles. :

https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f188...ssue-s-222008/

Randyman...

So you'd say a carbureted 302 would be a better option than a distributorless OBD-II 305/350? And there's no way to avoid a body lift with either of those - correct?

I'd really prefer to avoid a body lift - but I'm not even sure what engine swaps will fit w/o one. So much research to do and I'm not getting any younger! I just want to find a good shop and let them have at it w/o selling a kidney - or find a confirmed swap that I can do w/o welding and w/o pulling my hair out.

I'm fairly mechanically inclined as I've rebuilt the 22RE twice (ran GREAT for a 4-Banger!), did the 3rd member with 4.88's, and done tons of other mods to my 4Runner (including electrical) - but welding and heavy-metal fabrication just isn't in the cards for me at this juncture. I'm also strapped for space to get this done. The 4Runner is currently in storage (costing me $109/mo to store it!) and I don't think things would work out to well at home with another vehicle hogging the entire garage during the swap (why I initially had to put it into storage)

I know I'll have to ultimately make up my own mind - but please keep the suggestions coming.

A good shop reccomendation familiar with such swaps in Houston would be greatly appreciated. The 2 or 3 places I have lined up haven't done an 87 4Runner (one of them has done Toyota engine swaps, but not my exact model - the other 2 haven't done any Toyota swaps - and all 3 are more than I'd like to spend and will only give very open-ended estimates - which is understandable if they've never dealt with my exact scenario).

Thanks so much!!!

theMonch

Being a 22RE and not 3VZE I am pretty sure everything you would swap in there is going to require welding. I personally have never found bolt in engine mounts for domestics, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they don't exist.

I just performed a 5VZ-FE with supercharger swap into my '88 and it was a fairly straight-forward swap with a little bit of fabrication for accessories, battery, etc.

The difference is night and day. If it were me and I was dead set on using the truck you have now, I would go with the 1UZ-FE V8 out of the lexus. I say this because if I am going through all of the trouble of fabricated mounts, trans cross member, etc. I would want the V8 as payoff in the end. And being a Lexus (Toyota) v8 and not a domestic, it will have the same Toyota reliability we all are used to.

Any which way you slice it, the swap will be a bad financial investment unless you do the majority of the work yourself. Even then don't expect to get your money back.

Randyman...

Yeah - I know I'm not going to get my money's worth if I sold it - and that is the least of my worries . I kept my beloved 4Runner parked for 10 years so I could bring it back to life once I had the budget to do so - and my 99 Taco is getting up there in the miles. I was offered like $2K as a trade in - and my 4Runner has MUCH more sentimental value that that to me. It actually looks really sweet - fresh cherry red paint & matching top (smooth as glass - no orange peel!) - no decals - black fender flares, hoop chrome bumper, 32"s on 15x9" 5-spoke wheels, etc. It was my baby and I spent every last dollar I had fixing her up in the 90's.

I never look at a car as an investment to resell - I've kept every vehicle I've owned (minus a B2200 that was stolen and totaled) so re-sale is of no importance to me . I'll be keeping her until she falls apart beyond repair...

I've been eying the Lexus V8 swaps - and I might go that route. But again I can't weld and don't own any welders (I probably *could* weld - but again I don't want to do this twice ) and I'm just not sure how well this would turn out the first time if I did it myself.

I'd be satisfied with a low-mileage or re-built 5VZ-FE as I know what they can do. With new cams and a header I'm sure I'd have a perma-grin everytime I fire her up. But if the end-cost would only be $1000 between a Toyota V6 and a Lexus V8 - then that is certainly food for thought.

It took me two tries to get my 22RE pumping like it should (LC Engineering EFI Head is the BOMB!), and that was in my 20's. Now, I'm not too far away from my 40's, and I just don't have the time, the space, or the tools (welder, grinding wheels, cutting torches, motor stands, cherry pickers, etc) to get it done correctly and efficiently.

My concerns are that if I dish out the cash and let a shop do it - will they be able to nail it the first time? Exactly why I'd prefer to go with a shop that is intimately familiar with whatever swap I go with.

My TOTAL budget for EVERYTHING I want to do (including interior, light body work, fixing my rusted-in gas tank bolts and a cross-threaded A-Arm mount , and misc other "fix-ups") is $15K. I'm fine with doing the other stuff myself - but the motor swap itself and fixing the crossthreaded A-Arm bolt will likely demand more experience and tools than I have at my disposal - at least if I want it done right the first time.

Where does the time go?

Any further advice? Thanks for taking the time to reply - I appreciate all of the helpful advice I've gotten so far

blake.nemitz

how about a cummins 3.3 liter doesnt weigh much more than a 3.0 like 50 lbs and would be way cool, i am biased though this is my engine swap in progress

Suprunner

What about a Supra 7M-GTE? the only thing needing welding on mine was the motor mounts needed to be relocated. More than likely that will have to be done on any motor swap.
- I still have the 4cyl t-cases (duals)
- still have the W-56 trans. uses the naturally aspirated 7M-GE bellhousing and clutch
to mate the trans and the engine with no special adaptors
- still have the 4.10 gears and with 35" tires i still get around 19 mpg driving with a lead
foot
- no body lift. but i do have the solid axle swap. the hood sticks up slightly to allow for
the supra radiator.
- check out some of my pics

motorhead

A 7m swap is a bolt-in if you have a 22re, just need 5m mounts, oil pan, dipstick and pump...crank centerline goes up around 1.5" (according to 4rnrRick), so I went to a 2" body lift. This will allow me to use a 1.5" lifted trans crossmember (budbuilt, when cash allows), and also lets you lift the fuel tank the same amount...I bolted it to the top of the horse-collar and made a rear bracket from angle and grade 8 bolts...good trade-off for the higher COG to me...No welding yet, at least until I get to the y-pipe off the manifold.

CamTom12

Here's all the options I've looked at (haven't started gathering parts yet):

1) 5m-ge - hard to find
2) 7m-ge - easier to find, good power for a DD
3) 7m-gte - fairly easy to find, great power for a DD, more thirsty than option 2
4) VW TDI - this seems to be a very involved swap, seems like everyone that does it loves it though. and 30+ mpg... nice.
5) I'm going to look into the Cummins B 3.3. I hadn't heard of that one before. Seems like a good option.

Hope that helps!