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Newb looking to do an ENTIRE drivetrain conversion on 2gen 4Runner
This is my first post and looking for some info as the title states. I'm pretty new to off roading and had an FJ Cruiser as my first off road vehicle but didn't get into any modding before I needed to sell it. I picked up a 94 4runner 5 speed that already had a 7.5 inch lift and front and rear Spartan lockers and some other goodies and had a blast in Moab. The headgasket is now toast and I have no intention of putting any money into the weak 3.0. I've been doing lots of research in preparation to put in a 350 and the consensus is to keep it under 300hp to reliably use the stock transmission and tcase. But I'm thinking I want more. I have a Titan with standard bolt on mods and programmer that I'm going to sell once I get the Runner back on the road, and I'm going to miss all the power. I'm looking at a budget of $10-15k. I know I can just buy a newer vehicle but I'm a welder/fabricator and have been dabbling in CF laminating, and these older vehicles have a much simpler construction and I plan on tearing out the entire interior including the dash and putting in a new gauge cluster the same time as the engine and making a tube frame/CF dash. I've replaced my own heads on a V6 DOHC transverse mounted twin turbo engine, pulled thr tranny and tcase a few times to replace clutches, but my drivetrain knowledge stops there. Its been pretty overwhelming trying to look through all the different parts individually so I figured I need to ask people who know the stuff directly.
I basically need to know what options I have for parts that all work together to be able to handle some power with some 34" or better tires. Oh, and manual transmission. I absolutely do not want an auto. I think I would prefer selectable lockers, as the Spartans I have really screwed me when I'm trying to make parking lot turns even in 2wd. But I know squat about lockers. Solid axle front is another given and would like long travel suspension. I would prefer to just go aftermarket on both axels and would like to go with a disc brake set up in the rear. I think my biggest concern is what tranny and tcase set up to use with the 350. I would prefer to avoid a body lift and plan on modifying the firewall for the header room, or may consider modifying the front and pushing the radiator forward to mount the engine a little more forward. (Going to make a new hood anyway)
If any people knowledgeable on the subject could give me some advice, that would be greatly appreciated! Oh, and sorry for the long post!
Last edited by Terrys87; 09-27-2015 at 04:41 PM.
Reason: Language
Why bother, for that kind of a budget shop around and buy a rig. If all you want is an engineering project, that's cool too.
Fix your current truck & sell it. Then buy what will work for you. I bet you can get a roller tube chassis rig for that kind of money, spare yourself all the blood shed of learning in the school of hard knocks.
The thing is I am looking forward to doing the work. I've been a welder fabricator for fancy handrails, cranes, tractor trailers, boilers, but I want to build stuff for cars. I'd like to do it as a hobby to turn into a side business and off road is where all the good fabricating is at. I started making some body panels and case covers for my motorcycle awhile back but haven't had a good project vehicle to try out some major carbon fiber and Kevlar parts. I figure an old crappy 94 I wouldn't mind tearing down. The interior panels are very basic and easier to fab up new ones than on newer vehicles, especially the dash. Another thing is with all this work I want to put in it, I want it to last and would prefer to use new parts on the drive train and essentially make it a like-new vehicle as far as the operating parts. Even considering rewiring the entire vehicle when I have the interior tore out. New window regulators too since these are feeling their age.
The thing with projects like what you are describing and envisioning are that they are custom.
You could go to a Toy 3.4 and a SC and be happy. Stock off the shelf Toyota parts. Or maybe you want the wireless idea and go carbed 350 and any number of GM trans. Likewise a 351 and a ford box.
You can shoot low on power and use reduction to your advantage with a Marlin crawl box.
There are many suspension kits out there if you need to square up your lift. Most of those consist of new tube control arms and shock hoops that you weld in yourself.
You could SAS and there again the sky is the limit to what you use. Here again, a custom build. There is not "kit". You get a donor axle, some brackets and hardware, and measure and build to suit.
So long story short, build whatever you want. Search, maybe somebody already did it.
I know I can build what I want, I just don't know what I want. I know enough that I could name off components, or if someone named some I know exactly what they are talking about. People swap out axles on vehicles all the time. I can name a few like dana 30, 44 or 1 ton axles. There are Atlas and marlin tcases, or the factory ones like n205. Just like anyone with above average knowledge could name off a few different helicopters and even explain the basic mechanics of how they work. But I can tell you nearly all of the differences of the models of the H-60 like the B, F and H and the benefits of each one in the different mission areas and the different systems and components onboard each. I'm looking for that kind of knowledge on the drive train.
I'm not looking for any how-tos. Just info on components I should be looking at. For instance, just looking at transmissions, it looks like I might want an NV4500 and the N205 tcase. But that tranny is originally for a diesel engine. But I've seen adapters to mount it to a 350 and N205. I have no idea how big it is though and if it would even remotely fit. Then what off the shelf axles I could mate to the tcase, given there are different spline counts. I've heard putting 1 tons, but having to shorten the axle because of the width. But that's if I'm aquiring parts on my own. If there are aftermarket axles that would already have the strength and have workable dimensions without modifications, I'd rather go with that.
This is also going to be a daily driver. It's already been geared for the 34s that were on it and it did awesome on Poison Spider in Moab. I live in Colorado and did a little bit of wheeling in the mountains here but I can't even do the speed limit on the highway getting up there. I don't want that. I don't want to bandaid a weak-ass engine with gearing. I want the power for everyday driving with the ability to have the selectable gearing for when I go crawling.
First you are asking about religion where it comes to driveline components. Go watch powerblocktv extreme4x4. I would also suggest a trip to see Ian in TN, you might find answers to questions you did not ask over a few beers.
With your skills, you throw darts and come up with good choices. Once again religion plays into it. Do you worship at the alter of GM or Toyota / gas or diesel / Lockheed or Sikorsky?
You need to pick a mission / sport you wish to participate in, then build a rig to do that mission. I'm very happy with my 1988 4runners and stick to the stock factory stuff / outline but modified for snow wheeling. You cannot beat a 22re / W56 combo for a small narrow track rig, but its not the only 4 banger out there by any means, its just the one that has worked for me for 27 years, and yes its religion.
There is no best; only what others have built and been voted on in the market place to be profitable. I promise you every one of them is a compromise.
My suggestion is to fix up your truck with stock type Toyota stuff to do something you want to do & go places you want to go, without getting crazy. Trust me it will be a good rig and fun, but it will never be a Pikes peak race car.
Go to off road events, Drag strips, and watch / learn. Also practice "radio listening silence" to help you throw darts effectively.
If you want drop me a line and we can talk over a virtual beer.
09-27-2015, 03:10 PM
