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Timing belt queation

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Old Sep 15, 2020 | 07:18 AM
  #1  
wadester33's Avatar
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From: Portland OR
Timing belt queation

I've got a question about doing the timing belt what happens if one camshaft gets knocked out of whack do I just turn it a complete revolution clockwise until the Marks line back up or what do you have to do there to get it back towards correct because although it shows that the timing is correct I can hear the valves ticking in there and that did the camshaft did get knocked off on me but I never heard them before how do I correct it

Last edited by wadester33; Sep 15, 2020 at 09:02 AM.
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Old Sep 15, 2020 | 10:01 AM
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Year/model/engine? You say "one of the camshafts" so I assume you have the V6? If it's running & showing timing is correct, the ticking may not be because one of the cams "is a tooth off". Did you check ALL of your valves (valve lash) when you replaced the timing belt? A valve (or more than one) out of adjustment can easily cause the ticking sound. On the V6 there are shims that the cam lobes ride on, and those shims can get worn down over time, which can cause the ticking. Replacing the shims with new ones might solve it, but you'll need some special tools to do it yourself. "Google Schley Products 88250" for the tools. You'll also need a magnetic pickup tool to get the old shims out; those are available at almost any parts store.

Here's a video showing how the tools are used to change the shims:

That video is from LCE, who also sell the tools, but their price for them is high.
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Old Sep 15, 2020 | 10:37 AM
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From: Portland OR
Originally Posted by 13Swords
Year/model/engine? You say "one of the camshafts" so I assume you have the V6? If it's running & showing timing is correct, the ticking may not be because one of the cams "is a tooth off". Did you check ALL of your valves (valve lash) when you replaced the timing belt? A valve (or more than one) out of adjustment can easily cause the ticking sound. On the V6 there are shims that the cam lobes ride on, and those shims can get worn down over time, which can cause the ticking. Replacing the shims with new ones might solve it, but you'll need some special tools to do it yourself. "Google Schley Products 88250" for the tools. You'll also need a magnetic pickup tool to get the old shims out; those are available at almost any parts store.

Here's a video showing how the tools are used to change the shims: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wI4LznrDzcg

That video is from LCE, who also sell the tools, but their price for them is high.
I didn't check any of that I just know I didn't hear it prior to doing the work..maybe I just need to tweak the dist.a little.its most noticable when you accelerate
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Old Sep 15, 2020 | 12:51 PM
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So to answer your first question. Just grab the cam with a pair of pump pliers and rotate it back into position. (Just don't grab a cam lobe. Grab the main body of the camshaft.) You want to go back the way it came. Not on around as you will most likely have a piston at the top and possibly bend a valve. As for your "tick" noise, that could be anything from an exhaust leak, to a stuck lifter to an out of adjustment lifter to broken internal bits. You'll need to get a mechanics stethoscope and find exactly where the noise is coming from. You can also use a screwdriver with the handle held to your ear, but the stethoscope is way easier to use. They're cheap at auto parts stores.
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Old Sep 15, 2020 | 03:16 PM
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wadester33's Avatar
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From: Portland OR
Originally Posted by 13Swords
Year/model/engine? You say "one of the camshafts" so I assume you have the V6? If it's running & showing timing is correct, the ticking may not be because one of the cams "is a tooth off". Did you check ALL of your valves (valve lash) when you replaced the timing belt? A valve (or more than one) out of adjustment can easily cause the ticking sound. On the V6 there are shims that the cam lobes ride on, and those shims can get worn down over time, which can cause the ticking. Replacing the shims with new ones might solve it, but you'll need some special tools to do it yourself. "Google Schley Products 88250" for the tools. You'll also need a magnetic pickup tool to get the old shims out; those are available at almost any parts store.

Here's a video showing how the tools are used to change the shims: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wI4LznrDzcg

That video is from LCE, who also sell the tools, but their price for them is high.
Originally Posted by rattlecanpaint
So to answer your first question. Just grab the cam with a pair of pump pliers and rotate it back into position. (Just don't grab a cam lobe. Grab the main body of the camshaft.) You want to go back the way it came. Not on around as you will most likely have a piston at the top and possibly bend a valve. As for your "tick" noise, that could be anything from an exhaust leak, to a stuck lifter to an out of adjustment lifter to broken internal bits. You'll need to get a mechanics stethoscope and find exactly where the noise is coming from. You can also use a screwdriver with the handle held to your ear, but the stethoscope is way easier to use. They're cheap at auto parts stores.
I thought it was a no no to turn cams and crank counter clockwise but what you say makes sense but to late..now I know.i don't think it bent anything.the ticking is so faint I'm almost leaning toward exhaust leak as I didn't have new ones I ordered them but ten
days out.i appreciate you guys answering
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Old Sep 15, 2020 | 06:46 PM
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One of the good points of the 3.0 is that it's a non-interference engine. The valves will not contact the pistons, no matter which direction you rotate the cam. A bent valve would manifest itself with a compression check, also.
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Old Sep 17, 2020 | 11:17 AM
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From: Winston Salem, NC
It's a no no to turn the engine as a whole backwards due to the timing components. But you can turn the crank any direction you want when it's not attached to the cams. the same goes for cams as long as they're not attached to the crank.
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Old Sep 20, 2020 | 12:57 PM
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From: Mission Viejo, CA, USA
The 3.0 L 3VZ-E is a non interference engine so you can do what the hell you like with the crank and cams. You have a 94 so the timing belt has a dynamic tensioner. But to make getting the timing marks aligned and the belt set properly the best trick is to remove the belt the cam bolts and pulleys and then slide the pins out that key the cams to the pulleys. Then replace pulleys and the bolts so they are loose but keep the pulleys on the CAMs so they can rotate freely. Set the marks on the belt and pulleys and rotate the crank twice through and be sure everything re-aligns. Once that is done remove the bolts, turn the crank till the pins can be slid back into the CAM/s and pulley/s and then install and torque the CAM bolt/s.

This technique works a real charm on the static tensioner models that don't have the dynamic one.

Last edited by Andrew Parker; Sep 20, 2020 at 01:05 PM.
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Old Sep 20, 2020 | 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by rattlecanpaint
It's a no no to turn the engine as a whole backwards due to the timing components. But you can turn the crank any direction you want when it's not attached to the cams. the same goes for cams as long as they're not attached to the crank.
hard to say. rotating it at the speed you can use a breaker bar/socket isn't terrible (it's very slow). in fact, for the 22re, when installing a new timing chain, it's a good idea to rotate the crank backwards a bit to create slack in the chain in order to get the cam sprocket onto the camshaft mounting point. just did this today as part of a headgasket replacement.

once i had the gasket off, i noted that the driver side guide was broken at the top bolt, but not worn through the guide itself. so, i decided to replace the chain and guides/tensioner (because i had a complete set in my parts bin). that new chain is tight, and the tensioner doesn't allow much slack. rotating backwards made it easy to get the sprocket onto the shaft. no leveraging on the valve towers and risking a break in that cast piece.
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Old Sep 23, 2020 | 06:55 AM
  #10  
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From: Winston Salem, NC
Originally Posted by wallytoo
hard to say. rotating it at the speed you can use a breaker bar/socket isn't terrible (it's very slow). in fact, for the 22re, when installing a new timing chain, it's a good idea to rotate the crank backwards a bit to create slack in the chain in order to get the cam sprocket onto the camshaft mounting point. just did this today as part of a headgasket replacement.

once i had the gasket off, i noted that the driver side guide was broken at the top bolt, but not worn through the guide itself. so, i decided to replace the chain and guides/tensioner (because i had a complete set in my parts bin). that new chain is tight, and the tensioner doesn't allow much slack. rotating backwards made it easy to get the sprocket onto the shaft. no leveraging on the valve towers and risking a break in that cast piece.
This is definitely a good point. Reversing rotation a bit isn't going to hurt anything in this instance. Reversing rotation for full revolutions could mess up timing belt tensioners or jam the belt against the guide or something. (I'm guessing that's the reason they say not to rotate one backwards.)
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