scootmonkey

replaced the distributor and the timing is off. the book says how to replace your timing belt which requires removing the rad & fan & belts etc. is there an easier way to get the timing belt in the zero position without having to tear the truck apart first. I get how to put the distributor back in so its aligned, but need the timing belt position to be set properly beforehand. any suggestions?

scope103

Huh?

Ignition timing (set by the distributor) and valve timing (set by the timing belt) are entirely different. If you just removed the distributor you shouldn't even be looking at the timing belt.

So I'm going to guess you removed the distributor without first setting the crank to TDC Compression. (DOH!) TDC is easy (you know how to do that?), but there are two TDCs per cycle. http://personal.utulsa.edu/~nathan-b...13distribu.pdf There a bunch of ways to get the right one, but the one that's easy with the tools you have is to put a compression gauge on #1 as you inch up to TDC. If the gauge doesn't move you're on the exhaust stroke, and you have to turn the crank one turn. If the gauge moves as you move towards TDC, you're in the right place. (You'll need to take the pressure off the gauge to leave the crank at TDC.)

scootmonkey

yes, I unfortunately removed the distributor before setting the TDC and put in the replacement and turned it over to hear various puffs as it wasn't firing right. so the crank has moved a few times and now I have no idea where its set. I have the 4runner manual and read that same page you sent me after the fact. according to it I need to get at the timing belt crank and set it to Zero position. I don't have a compression gauge nor do I know how to turn the crank without first opening up the timing belt cover. so that is what I was wondering... can this be done without accessing the crank & timing belt or do I have to, as it says, remove my rad, fan, belts and the timing belt cover to set that right?

matstaley

pull the valve cover and all the spark plugs and you should be able to rotate the crank fairly easily. Now rotate the crank and line the cam up to TDC of cylinder 1 compression stroke just before the exhaust valve starts to open. Insert distributor, reinstall spark plugs and valve cover, start engine.

scope103

I don't see anywhere where the manual suggests removing your radiator, fan, belts, or the timing belt cover.

At the top of page IG-25 is a drawing showing the mechanic turning the crankshaft by means of a wrench (I believe it's 17mm, maybe 19mm, and you'll want to use a ratchet). (Could that be what you're referring to with "timing belt crank"?)

IF you already have the timing cover off you can easily tell when #1 is on the compression stroke by looking at the cam sprockets. So you can spend a day or two trying to do that, our you can buy the compression gauge you already needed anyway. http://www.harborfreight.com/compres...kit-66216.html (Or you can try to find a gadget called a "whistler," which screws into the spark plug hole and whistles on the compression stroke, but what's the point when the compression gauge will do it?)

And while you're at it, you need to pick up the timing light too. There isn't any way to set timing without one. (Unless you want to risk predetonation, which could blow a hole in a piston.)

Rusto

You just needs to pull the number one spark plug to make it easy to turn the crank with a wrench, if you can't do it already.

No need to take everything apart. It's not that hard to set the timing. yes, a timing gun is needed. Other than that rotating the crank with a wrench (19MM?) on the nut that is holding on the crankshaft pully and using a wooden dowel slid into the number one cylinder to find out where TDC is not that hard.

Find TDC by turning the crank with a wrench, then make sure when the white indicator is at TDC, the number one piston is at TDC (by checking the depth with the dowel) and then slide in the distributor making sure the rotor lines up with the first cylinder's spark plug wire in the cap, and you are 0 degrees with the rotor in the right place.

There's a little more to it than that, but take apart as little as possible.
Absolutely no need to actually see the timing belt to get it the engine to TDC. Just look for the white indicator on the crankshaft pully and make sure you aren't at the bottom of the stroke by checking to make sure the number one piston is all the way to the top of the stroke.

scope103

You're a little confused. If the notch in the harmonic balancer (the pulley attaches to the balancer, and the mark is only white if someone has rubbed some paint into it) is at "0", the piston IS at TDC. The dowel adds nothing. The piston cannot be anywhere but the top of the stroke.

The problem is that the piston moves to TDC TWICE during an ignition cycle, once at the beginning of the power stroke, and once at the beginning of the intake stroke. The plug fires at the beginning of the power stroke, which you can find because the valves are both closed then. So you either take apart the front case (timing cover) to look at the marks on the cam sprockets, or you remove the valve covers to look at the cam itself (don't forget to use a new valve cover gasket and install it per FSM, or it WILL leak), or you do it the easy way as I described.

scootmonkey

thanks everyone. on my 1990 4runner 3ve, where to I find the crankshaft? I thought you had to get to that via the timing belt. but I am guessing its accessible somewhere else... how do I find it?

scootmonkey

Okay so I managed to set the timing re distributor with some help. The truck still won't start. Been doing a lot of research on the site and reading various posts...

Going to finish testing the sparks today and have 3 more wires to replace.

Also have a question about the AFM. I tested the connector with an ohm meter for continuity and it tested in the proper ranges. Is it possible that the switch doesn't work despite this because of some mechanical damage from the truck rolling over?

Other posts suggest the ignition coil, igniter and and there's an ignition switch in the steering column? Also the fuel pump. Where is the fuel pump? Picture of what it looks like?

Then I read something about the EGR valve and that it might be stuck open. Where exactly is the EGR valve?

Is there anything else I should check for given the fact that the truck rolled? It did start when I got towed out, but haven't been able to start it since.

Been at it now for almost 3 weeks trying to get it back on the road.

Scootmonkey

scope103

Now might be a good time to tell us what vehicle you're talking about. Some things are common to most Toyota trucks, but what you're now asking is not.

Damage to the VAF can lead to a start-but-won't-run situation.

If you were able to set the ignition timing your coil, igniter and switch are all working; otherwise the timing light wouldn't flash. While you've got the timing light out, put it on each plug wire to confirm each plug is firing.

The EGR valve is not keeping the truck from starting.

The fuel pump is in the fuel tank. You're not going to be able to tell anything by "looking" at it, but the test procedure in the FSM is quite easy.

Everyone has to start somewhere, but if you don't even know where the crankshaft would be you might be trying to tackle a job that's beyond you. Perhaps you should get some help from someone who does this for a living, and then get started on your own when something easier comes along.

scootmonkey

4Runner 1990 v6 3.0 4WD 3VZE

Re-adjusted the timing and it started! Drove down the driveway and it died. Any idea why it would die? This is good news as it hasn't started in 3 weeks. Another adjustment?

Scootmonkey

scootmonkey

so as mentioned we got it running after turning the crank 360 to see if it was in the wrong stroke position. reset the distributor again and this time it ran. after driving about 2-3 minutes it blew the 15A efi fuse. got it back in the garage and replaced the fuse twice. even putting the truck into the on position blows the fuse now. so there has to be a short leading to the pump. I jumpered the fuel pump at the access port in the back seat with 12V and you can hear the pump come on fine. so the pump is working, but something is blowing the efi fuse whenever power is sent to the pump. fix one problem and another comes along.

any tests I should perform to find out how & where there is a short? even bypassing the Core via the diagnostic jumper for the pump blows the fuse.

matstaley

Never had the efi fuse blow before. You would need to find out what components are fed by that fuse and start eliminating them one at a time by disconnecting them and seeing if the fuse blows or not. Fortunately fuses are pretty cheap.

scope103

Then it's not the fuel pump circuit, because no power is sent to the pump with the key at "ON."

scootmonkey

good point, that is right. only if you bypass it with B+ FP paperclip would the pump get juice with the truck in On position.

The fuel pump was blowing the 15A efi fuse before replacing the distributor until I found I had the plug wires reversed going into the fuel pump from the access port in the back seat. that was the initial problem after the accident... a wire had been crimped leading to the pump and we fixed that and had to re-wire the plug that jacks in. once I had the plug in the right positive & negative wires leading from the engine, the fuse stopped blowing immediately. I put a tester on the wires when the truck was being cranked over and saw at least 8 or 9V going to the pump.

so after finally fixing that and then getting the distributor replaced and the truck running for a couple minutes, now the fuse blows whenever you even switch the truck to On position.

so I wonder where the power is getting to and blowing the fuse. going to take some reading and testing for sure... getting more fuses tomorrow.

spoonist

When my efi fuse was blowing it was O2 sensor wire. Can get damaged by exhaust or driveshaft apparently.

scootmonkey

that sounds like a good place to look. the manual is useless for telling me where that is tho... where do I look for that wire?

spoonist

I can't say exactly where mine was damaged, at the time I had no choice but to get a mechanic to look at it. I would just follow the wire from the O2 sensor till I couldn't follow it anymore. Make sure it's not melted or chewed up.

hambob

My o2 wire fell out of its clip right onto my exhaust and melted causing the same thing. I kept blowing efi fuses until i found it. Check the wiring diagram to see whats on the efi circuit. It should help norrowing it down a little. good luck

scootmonkey

just went under truck and found a bundle of 4 wires that was definitely touching the exhaust at different times. some melting in two places on wire bundle. have to check closer with a light, but a good chance that is at the very least a problem to fix. I have a spare parts truck so will cut off a section of the same wires on it and splice it in. tomorrow I get more fuses so I can check the burnout issue then as well. I really hope this is the culprit... bugger has been down for over 3 weeks!

thanks so much again for the tips everyone... lets hope we have a winner.