930's aren't that expensive (28 spline).
You can get them for $60.00 ~ $65.00 each.





Fred

 

Remember guys, the reason for the cost is that they need to be modified or adapted to fit. I'm not sure what's involved, but it would be cool if we could figure it out cheaper than the companies doing it now.

 

I had heard ~$1000 a pair before too ... that represents a big chunk of a SAS...

 

Downey list the inner Prosche 930 CV's, with boots, for $229.80 per pair.






Fred

 

Don't forget this:

930 Porsche Adapters, pair $153.90

I'd be curious to try them for that price if they work with stock axles. If/when I break one, that could be an option. But, I'd like to find out first the difference between the Downey set and the 1,000 set I see from other places.

Oh yeah, here a reason I always question Downey's scientific evaluation of parts. They aren't very accurate, which leads me to believe that they don't actually test. Quotes such as this:

"Downeys Porsche inner CV joints not only withstand a zillion horsepower"

That's taken straight from the site.

 

Because I'm an internet tough guy...

My understanding is the Porsche 930's are INNER joints.

Using them is beneficial because they are a true CV not a tripod like the stocker. This offers more angularity for long travel.

Tundras for sure and maybe T-100's have a true CV stock. This too allows more angle.

What joint are you breaking?

For me, it was always outers and stubs. The outers were often because of too much droop and fragging the cage because it bound.

I know of one set of Cryo'd stockers. They seem to hold. The other upgrade is from Longfield.

 

You've been look'n in all the wrong places...
Crap, I'll sell 'em to you for half that price:

A simply search turned up a "zillion" suppliers:

How 'bout ca $59.00 each:

http://www.dansperformanceparts.com/...susp%20IRS.htm


How 'bout $55.00 each:

http://www.desertkarts.com/item80957.ctlg



They're WIDELY used in the offroad buggy world.
Any buggy supply shop should have them.
Heck I can get the locally here in Tucson for around those prices )


Obviously a "tongue in cheek" statement to emphasize their strength.
I use statements like that commonly.

Yuu surely don't think that they really mean a "zillion horsepower", do you ?
BTW, how much is a zillion.



What don't you like about Downeys stuff, specifically ?

Here's a little comparison of some of the commonly seen (used) CV joints:

http://www.blindchickenracing.com/Ho...joints_101.htm




Fred

 

Allright Tough Guy, hahaha

Maybe that is why the packages are usually so pricey because we'd be changing from the tripod to the cv. I guess this isn't a common enough mod, since there is never clear enough info about what is involved.

 

Fred, I have seen VW cv's for those prices too, but I think there is a little more involved, such as those adapters. I think the cv's we had been seeing for 500-1,000 were custom machined to allow fitting on a yota without an adapter. It seems like the adapter was bypassed possibly due to strength or spacing issues. I imagine Downey used the adapter to take advantage of the cheaper cv's. This is just my guess.

As far as my skepticism with Downey, I guess it comes from the way they go about business. They are constantly mud slining, in thier damn product descriptions. To me, if your product is so great, you don't have to put down your competitior to point that out. The products that I think are superior don't do anything except describe the features of thier products.

Downey jsut seems out of touch, over priced, and full of disclaimers (Slip yoke axles?).

But hey, if they can strengthen my cv's reliably for a good price, they could win me back.

Oh yeah, Fred, those adapters for 153.00 are a part Downey requires to fit thier 250.00 cv's onto a Toyota. I think you might be missing that point. The VW cv's are not plug and play, they are just the closest thing to adapt to a yota.

 

this one is about $700

 

The reason I posted up those likes for the Porsche 930 CV's is because I've never seen Porsche CV's for Toyotos anywhere close to the $500.00 ~ $1000.00 price range.

I knew that. So for a pair (from Downey) one is looking at $153.00 + $250.00. That comes out to ca $200.00 per axle. No where close to those high price ranges that have been mentioned.


First, a couple of points.

I'm not "pro Downey", nor am I "anti Downey", nor pro or anti any other major vendor for yota products.
I'm relatively new to yota's, but come for over 8 years of heavy rock crawling, on some of the toughest trails in the west. So, while I new to 'yotas, I'm not new to 4 wheeling and I know what works and doesn't work out here anyway.

Now regarding Downeys ads (remember, I'm really neutral here, not pro nor anti), I don't see anything wrong with them (the ads).
They are touting the advantages of their products (or so they believe or want us to believe) and they are comparing the advantages of their products over some of their competitor's.
Pretty common marketing.

Some things that I do know at least for the type of 4wheeling that we do out here in the west.
Heims (rod ends) simply don't have the durability of TRE's/ball joints, etc., whatever they are replacing.

Now I don't know (haven't run them and don't know of anyone who has), but, for instance the Downey's ad is comparing their "mega travel balljoints" against the "uni balls".
Again, I don't know for sure, however the uni-balls look an awful bit like heims and, if that's the case, I would suspect that they wouldn't be as durable as a regular type ball joint.
Downey seems to be pointing that out in their marketing for their "mega travel ball joints".
Please remember, I'm not pro Downey, nor anti, I'm just in a neutral stance, but with enought experience to maybe make sense of some of the marketing.

Regarding their "slip yoke axles".. Some have mentioned, especially on other boards, that they've broken CV's (I believe outers) because they've basically pulled apart. The "slip youk axles" sound like a novel way to perhaps prevent this. It's enough to grab my attention for a bit.
Also the u-joint conversion that they offer (I believe it's part of the slip yoke axles), this is basically the same as a solid axle now. The '760 u-joints that they use (according to their ad) is a D44 u-joint and I'm *VERY* familar with those.....

Anyway, I don't see anything wrong with their marketing, they are pointing out the (supposed) advantage of some of their products and comparing them with others on the markey.

Over priced.. I can't say for sure. I know, coming from my other (Jeeps) years of 4wheeling experience is that you normally get what you paid for.
I don't know about the quality of Downy's parts compared to other vendors, but I certainly wouldn't let price alone scare me off.
Looking at some of the other types of IFS "lifts", Downey doesn't seem to far out in left field, price wise (look at TC, All-Pro, etc).




Now this begs the question. It seems from that statement that you've broken CV's. I posted a thread a little while back and no one responded saying that they've broken 'em.
So which ones (inners, outers) do you normally break, how ofter, what are you running (lift, tire, gears, etc) ??
I'm truely interested...



Best,
Fred

 

Well,

As far as uniballs versus ball joints, Uniballs can wear out and get sloppy (I'v enever seen this), but ball joints can seperate, causing the spindle to hang (I have seen this). I'll take a Uniball. The Mega travel joint makes it weaker as thier is less cup hol;ding in the ball joint, thus allowing it to move a greater distance.

As far as the slip yoke axle, the problem with that is the fact that the axle is 2 pieces that slip in and out of each other, I believe this causes vibration and can actually tear apart, hence Downey's disclaimer for not exceeding 35 or something ridiculous like that.

I have not broken cv's yet, though I realize this is a weak point. I have done my best to avoid breakage. I only have a 4 cylinder and wish for nothing more. I am not locked up front, try to take obstacles as straight as possible, and don't have too much lift cranked in.

However, I like to go out exploring pretty far, and I would like the peace of mind of drivetrain strength, therefore cv upgrades tickle my interest. I have an IFS fetish and woudl like to make a relatively strong system.

 

A few notes for people that may not be familiar with the parts being discussed.

The stock IFS Toyota fron 4WD axle uses
-- a tripod tulip type inner CV
-- a rezeppa ball type outer CV

The outer CV ball cage is machined as one peice with the axle stub.

In general - a tripod tulip type of joint has less frictional drag than a rezeppa ball type. It also has more inherent "plunge" (aka axle shaft lenght change) than a rezeppa type.

The bolt on long travel manufs use a T100 axle becuase they are readily avail and thus "cost effective" compared to a custom axle and CV adapters.

I had *heard* that the 930 joint has the same bolt circle as the Toyota and thus the adapter plate is a spacer plate (think wheel spacer) to get the "space" behind the CV for "plunge" room. I have a rezeppa CV on my desk as a paperweight - its from a MKII VW golf. Its too small for use on a Toyota, but it helps me understand how they work.

Many "race" CV are machined stock 930s. Typically the cage is modified etc for more plunge. Then there are custom treatments for improved strenght.

 

the expensive part would be the custom axle shaft made to mate these two
cv joints. Esp. since different setups would require small differences in axle
length, (i.e. stock arms, stock arms with BJ spacer, rancho uppers with BJ spacers, LT kits etc.etc.)

 

Wish I had known about the T100 drive axles when i put in 4crawlers 1.5" balljoint spacers. My stock axles bind at full drop with stock upper bumpstops so I had to fab out some custom upper bumpstops to keep the wheel from dropping (in the scenario of articulated and one wheel dropping its full potential) otherwise the axle binds and would most likely cause a quick loud death =)

So let me get this right, the stock T100 front cv axles fit into 86 - 95 IFS yotas?

I'm SAS'ing this truck and scrapp'n the IFS but still good to know for friends and future trucks!

 

No, they will not. They only work with LT kits designed for them.
Goin' to the dark side eh' :')