John James

I am wanting to get a little smarter about Supercharging a 3RZ. I did a little searching and found that you guys are not really excited about the concept. Please allow me to explain what I want to accomplish then you can let me have it.

I have a tube chassis rock crawler that I use for trail riding and I race it once a year in an off road race called King of the Hammers. I removed the 22r last year and installed a 3rz. It has an SDS fuel management system that I had tuned by the nice guys at LC Engineering. Other than that it is totally stock. I am REALLY impressed with the performance but I would like to get a little more out of it. If I remember right, it put down 120RWHP with 37" tires. I don't want to go big because I am limited by the Toyota 8" ring and pinion I am running. If I get too crazy, I'll just start breaking R&P (everything is relative).

I also am not interested in doing another engine swap. The packaging of the 3rz works for me and I don't want to rebuild the whole front again.

My question is, what should I do to the stock 3rz befor I put the S/C on it (If anything). I would like to increase the valve spring pressure because it will only pull to 5500 and it acts like it will easily take more.

Keep in mind, I'm a poor racer that cannot even afford a new supercharger right now. Anyone know of a used one?

Flame on!

Oh, here's a picture

BigSwole

You used poor. Racing. Lcengineering. Fuel management system. Rock crawler. In the same relative sentence.

Our def. Of poor is completely different lol. I understand you want more power but would your system run cool enough at slow speeds?

I know almost nothing about superchargers but it seems to me it take a lot more money than just slapping on a supercharger and riding out.

Either way. Nice truck. And I like the idea if you can do it!

John James

THANKS! Any more opinions out there? I herd there was a lot of smart guys on this board.

sebastianholmes

in all honestly i think you would have better luck on pirate 4x4. not many people here have the type of rig you do.

TylerH

I think there are better options for what your planning on doing then a supercharger.

Looks like you got bolt ons. I would get a cam and see how much that opens it up before taking the step of a supercharger.

The MAN

probably won't have to do much to the internals considering the 2TZ-FZE just had lower compression pistons pretty much.... the 2TZ engine is basically a modified 2RZ engine installed in a 75 degree slant (to fit under the previa)... sump is on the side of the block basically!

you might be able to get the 2TZ's supercharger cheap if you care to make it work

vital22re

iTrader: (2)

A Sc will mainly benefit you down low. If you plan on constant high rpms over 3000 a turbo would be a better fit for you.

dropzone

iTrader: (6)

Link to build thread on pirate:
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=895959
edit-2011 KOH results thread:
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showt...982&highlight=

Sounds to me like you would know a bit more that 99.999% of us

xxxtreme22r

x2, you won't like the SC running ultra4 races. Turbo it, your gonna need top end as well for the high speed sections for KOH.

Greg_Canada

You should be good to 6000-6250rpm stock... then you worry about the rods...
IF you want some 3rz performance tech head over to customtacos.com performance section... lots of knowledgeable people over there...

Might want to look into a turbo kit, would be cheaper than a new S/C, since you already have the SDS system...

John James

Ya, I know alot about Rock Crawlers but i don't don't know much about a 3RZ. The Pirate4x4 guys are great if you have an LS motor.
I just though I would ask the Toyota hobiest guys with real world experience. You guys have been helpfull. I appreciate it.
One more question. What about studding the head? Is the 3rz head gasket/Head bolts pretty good from the factory?

I'll check out Custom Tacos.com also.

does anyone have pictures of a 3rz with a turbo installed? I am wondering if it would fit without having to cut off shock mounts etc.

Thanks again.

BigMike

Hiya John! We gotta throw a M90 on that puppy for some instant throttle response and amazing bottom end power!!

Or maybe a unit like this Autorotor/Lysholm (not sure what it is):






Check out how nice and compact that is! This is a K20 2-liter Honda engine being installed into a Lotus Elise.

I strongly recommend against the TRD Supercharger since they are using a very small supercharger that you'd more commonly find on a sub-2 liter engine. You'd benefit from using a larger displacement blower that is turned at a lower RPM because it will develop less heat (very important since you're not likely to use an aftercooler) and have comparable or less parasitic losses.

The M90 is a 90 cubic inch displacement, or 1.47 liters. For comparison, Toyota used the 1.2-liter displacement SC12 blower on a 1.6-liter engine (4A-GZE), and I've ran the 1.4-liter displacement (Toyota SC14) on this little 1.6-liter engine as well (pictures of this can be found here http://bigmike.marlincrawler.com/stage2/stage2_1.html and here http://bigmike.marlincrawler.com/stage2_5/index.html).

The TRD Supercharger for the 3RZ I believe is a M62, which is ONLY 1.02 liter displacement, EVEN SMALLER than the Supercharger Toyota used on the 1.6-liter 4A-GZE engine. So WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD TRD PUT SUCH A SMALL SUPERCHARGER ON A HUGE BIG-BLOCK 4CYL 2.7-liter 3RZ ENGINE IS ABSURD TO ME!!! Technically speaking, the saving grace for the Eaton units is their corkscrew design which makes them more efficient at higher RPMs. So they are able to turn faster than the old Toyota SC12 & SC14 units ----- which means TRD used a very small SC unit on the 3RZ with the full intent of spinning it at very high RPMs 12,000 to 15,000 probably).

This is why I say find a M90 1.47-liter displacement Supercharger, which is 45% larger than the TRD unit, and then spin it 45% slower. Now you can have the same 6 or 8 PSI of boost you are looking for without all the excess heat and high parasitic loss.

Sorry I am pretty much rambling here. I originally figured I'd only reply with a short post and then this happened. hahahaha John knows that I am a die hard Supercharger fan, so my opinion will be biased. One thing for certain is that Turbos can not compete with the throttle response of a Supercharger (the SC is mechanically connected, the Turbo will always have some lag), so for Rock Crawling and low speed desert racing, in my opinion, the Supercharger is the way to go. If you want more top end out of a Supercharger, that is easy, just add water injection.

My opinionated 2 cents ,
BigMike

BigMike

How about an Ogura clutched Supercharger? See: http://www.oguraclutch.co.jp/english...c/sc_siyou.htm



They make a 1.46-liter blower that would work great. I like the clutched setup because like the Toyota SC12/SC14 units, you can disable the blower when you don't want all that added torque.

BigMike

BigMike

John,

I looked through my old M90 pictures and found some more info on doing a custom setup on your 3RZ. Find a used M90 Supercharger from the 4-liter AJ16 engine of a 1995-97 Jaguar XJR or X300. The pulleys on these are not clutched.

This Jag M90 is good because of how short the snout is on it:




BigMike

The MAN

looks pretty similar to the stock 2TZ-FZE supercharger from the previa:


no clue on the specs

BigMike

The MAN,

That is the SC14 I was referring to above, also found on the 1G-GZE JDM engine. Back in 2002, I got almost 18 PSI out of this S/C even while using huge 25% larger 2.5" intake piping.




I still have the SC14, and am planning on swapping it onto my USDM 4A-GZE hopefully sometime this summer.

Good times
BigMike

jeetS

Fyi. The sc12 and sc14 are made by Ogura.
Cool to see another gze guy on this site

I think an eaton style blower would suit your needs better than a roots style(ogura)
The eaton(screw) style are much more efficient... Although I really like the benifits of the clutched blower.

I get 30mpg and can shred the tires at will

^not my truck tho lol.

BigMike

jeetS,

Awesome, what car do you have? AW11 or transplanted AE86? I've got my '87 AW11 sitting right outside my office window with a 1989 4A-GZE state-approved swap My AE92 JDM 4A-GZE is still intact with the SC14. It's in storage at the moment. Love these old lil motors! 4A FOR LIFE!

BigMike

knobs

Big Mike are you just a walkin yota encyclopedia? Haha your the man dude, I follow the 3rz swap thread on Marlin and pirate religiously, and im in the in the process of getting things together for a 3rz swap into my '87 sas runner, keep it comin

BigMike

If I represented an encyclopedia of any kind, then we'd all be in really big trouble lol Honestly, my specialties are very limited to but a few areas.... they just happen to be of interest in these types of forums I wish I knew more about domestic trucks, carburetors, and be experienced in rebuilding automatic transmissions. Then I'd feel better

I love the 3RZ. It's like having a really strong overboosted Turbo 22R-TE, except it's reliable, practical, and has more bottom end power

Ha!

BigMike