hosh

i was given a 93 toyota pickup with a 22re that was just rebuild at one of the assembly line places here in tulsa.

It start using a qt oil in 30 miles. We figured they just removed the head and put it back on without rebuilding it and that the valve guide/seals were worn.
I have another head i can just swap on.

But when i pulled the valve cover thier seemed to be alot of oil still on the head. The truck hasn't been started in a week and a half.

could their be a drainback problem? or is this just normal?

don't want to swap heads and have the same poblem. Thanks

MMA_Alex

Thats a lot of oil to be burning. I would expect a major leak, but i'm assuming you would have noticed a quart of oil on your driveway. Is the exhaust really dark black?

hosh

No dark black exhaust. and no oil leak. except we my father in law lost the oil filler cap. it blew alot of oil out of the hole before he could shut it off.

Robrt32

That much oil should show up in the exaust or on the ground

misterzee

If you pull the valve cover, no oil should run out, but there will be puddles of oil on top. Hopefully you have obtained a replacement filler cap. ;-)

hosh

it smokes on start up. i've only drove it one time to where i parked it. the oil estimate is from him. it may be more miles.

i did have to put the proper oil filler cap on it. the one that was there was from a nissian and was held down with a bungie.

i suppose that could account for oil usage and the fact that it started to burn oil after the waranty was up. he didn't lose the oil filler cap imediatly.

but how much oil sould stay under the valve cover after the engine is shut off?

the last 22r i pulled apart was not a good candidate for comparision.

hosh

i just looked at the FSM and noticed the drain back location (i didn't have it available last night) its at the back and the truck is slightly nose down. hence oil amount.

I also noticed where the oil come up and would hit the oil filler cap. I bet thats where most of the oil is going.

I'll drive it tonight and find out. If thats it my father in law will either get a good laugh or be upset.

hosh

i drove it 21 miles last night. it was almost half way down the checkered part of the dipstick after letting it set for a while before i checked it.

It smoked real bad on start up and was noticeable @ 30 mph and below. especially when down shifting or lifting the throttle.

Oh well, I'll just change the head tonight.

MMA_Alex

when you have the head off you might as well take a glance at the cylinders, and look for scoring etc. also its probably worth crawling under, and looking for oil on the block indicating a leak

hosh

Their is oil all over everything at the moment from the missing cap.

although if i find scored cylinders or external block leak i bet i get a new motor out of the deal warranty up or not.

MMA_Alex

get the cap on, and degrease the engine so you can tell where the leak is coming from.

ps. if you're leaking massive ammounts out of the filler hole, and its all over the engine, thats probably where all the oil is going...

hosh

i replaced the cap as soon as i got the truck (i had a spare on another valve cover that i have laying around. i just haven't completely cleaned the engine. I'm positive its not an external leak. particularly after my drive last night

hosh

Ok. I changed the head last night but think that might not be the problem.

My intake was caked with oil on the inside. I haven't checked the air tube from the filter yet. It got dark on me and my work space is outside.

Could this be a failed PCV valve?

dcg9381

Caked with liquid oil? If it's a high mileage motor, having a bunch of nasty crap in the intake is normal.. it builds up after years and years.

I still suspect bottom end, maybe incorrect oil ring assembly..

hosh

It was black liquid worse than i've ever seen before.

SEAIRESCUE

Was the head part of the 22r rebuild? If not, it should be done.

I suspect block problems. If none of the cylinders are bad, you could
have a serious assembly problem with the rings. It would not be too hard to put standard rings on an oversize piston. Incorrect assembly as well.

Bottom line, if the head is not a plugged mess, its the block. Take it back for a warranty claim based on mileage.

When big oil forces us into electric cars, this problem will go away.

hosh

how does that get lots of oil into my intake?

dcg9381

That's a good question.. Again, is it liquid oil or some crusty stuff that looks like old oil / carbon?

My 22RE had about 200k on it, still ran strong, good compression. We're talking about 20 years of stuff coming into the intake. Stuff builds up... Probably PCV stuff, stuff from a foam oil filter... Look at most high mileage motors and they'll have some build up... Honestly, I don't know where it all comes from!
It was a major cluster to get it all out. I had to sit it in a parts washer for 3-4 days, scrub it, cans of carb cleaner.. save yourself and just have it hot tanked.

If it's recent oil, it'll be liquid...



I had a 22R where the rings were improperly installed. Very little smoke a start up, some smoke under heavy accel. It's so easy to install an oil scraper ring upside down.. Unless you got a receipt for the rebuild, it's really hard to judge the quality of the work that's been done.. Even with a receipt, the shop that did the work has to have experience.

hosh

Its heavy liquid over some of the usual buildup.

If I remove the intake completly it will be easy for me to clean.

dcg9381

Hmm.. I don't have a photo of what my intake looked like, but it was a very sludge like stuff, not very liquid - more a combination of liquid and carbon.. I don't know how else to describe it.

You're pretty sure you're burning the oil off?
It's burning evenly across all 4? IE - one spark plug doesn't look particularly worse than another?

Here's what I'd suggest - and I've been through it before:
1) Confirm you're not leaking external.
2) Compression and/or leak down test if you suspect a single cylinder is to blame. (based on the plugs). This also helps to narrow down if you've got bad rings and associated massive blow by that would feed the intake a lot of oil.
3) Pull the head. You're going to pretty much have to do this regardless. Inspect the valve seals. If you're concerned or don't know what to look for, take it to a machine shop. I'd be very suprised if the valve seals were causing this magnitude of oil consumption.
4) After pulling the head, if the seals on the head, pull out a single piston... Pull the piston that looks like it's eating the most oil, if there is an indication. You need to inspect the way the oil scraper ring is installed. Verify that the other rings are properly sized for the bore..