I have a 1982 22R 5 speed that won't start unless I spray starter fluid in the carb...BUT...once it starts (and it starts fairly fast with starter fluid), it idles smooth and runs like a champ with lots of power. Then I can drive enough to warm it up and turn off the engine and come back later and it will start just fine (even an hour later) without having to spray anything into the carb. Any idea what could be the problem please?

I am a non-mechanic so please try to give an answer like you would to a 10 year old.

Thank you very much!

 

Where to you live? Cold climate?

How often do you start it? In my truck, it seems like after a few days, the fuel drains back towards the tank, so it takes a long time cranking to get the fuel up to the carb.

 

And of course you know to pump the gas a couple times before starting it...sorry, but you just never know.

My truck takes two pumps in the morning. After that, same deal- it can sit for hours during the day, and all I need to do is turn the key and it starts right up.

 

Its a Toyota motorhome I bought a couple days ago. The previous owner rarely used it but would start it maybe once a month. I'm in the San Diego area and its been a really cold wet winter for San Diego, plus I live near the ocean so don't know if the higher humidity would effect starting or not??

And for "83"... I usually do two to three quick pumps with the accelerator before starting a vehicle with a carb.

I just called and left the previous owner a voice mail message asking him if he had to spray the carb since the day he bought it 4 years ago or if that problem developed over time he owned it.

Thanks

 

Cold, wet weather could have an effect. I'm not an expert on carbs. Probably with some carb cleaner and making sure the carb is tuned, you'd be good. Could be as bad as the carb needing a rebuild, which isn't too big of a deal.

A tuneup on a new vehicle like this is always a good idea. New plugs, wires, distributer cap and rotor, check the timing etc.

What kind of motorhome?

 

The previous owner called and said it started every time when he bought it 4 years ago. Then his wife got sick and passed away and sometimes he didn't start it for as long as 4 months. At one point he installed a solenoid (see attached photo) that is located inside of the drivers side fender.

I just installed new plugs, wires, distributor cap and rotor and will install a new fuel filter and new fuel lines to and from the fuel filter next. I'm also going to clean the battery terminals and put some fresh gas in it. I'll let you know how that goes.

What is the best and simplest for non-mechanics manual to get for this? I think I remember one of them between the Haynes and the Chiltons always seemed much clearer and more newb friendly to me. Do you know which ones are that way, or does someone make better owners manuals now besides Chilton and Haynes?

BTW: Its a 18' Toyota Sunrader with 60,000 miles on it like the one in the attached photo. It runs like a champ (except for this starting issue), and has a rebuilt 5 speed tranny, great clutch, and brand new tires. I need to replace the rear 1/2 ton axle with a 1 ton and totally re-do the interior to suit me for long distance traveling and install solar, etc.

 

That thing's great. I'm jealous. That's like the newer and improved Chinook. I'm sticking with single axle...only because I don't have the skills for a conversion (or money to pay to have it done). I think I can get by with the non-dually, though. Dually would be better, but mine have held up for 35 years, so...as long as I take care of them, I think I'll be ok.

If it sat for a long time, the carb could be gummed up, and definitely fresh gas is in order. The old gas is worthless.

I don't use Haynes or Chilton, I use the Factory Service Manual. At least for my 83. Haven't found one yet for the Chinook. The best thing is to get whatever manual you can, and ask questions on sites like this, or find a more mechanically minded friend.

The first time I changed my oil was after college, and it scared the crap out of me. 3 months later I was taking out my transmission...unless you're fabricating new and better parts, this stuff isn't too bad. Just take the bad part out, put the new part in. Trouble shooting gets a little harder and requires more of an understanding of how things works. But you bought an old vehicle, so there's always going to be something a little goofy, and it will need attention. It's a pretty basic vehicle, so slowly but surely, you'll start understanding how things work and how to fix it.

That basic maintanence stuff you did is really about all you should have to do. Maybe replacing the starter or alternator and stuff like that. If it gets into timing chains and headgaskets and all that, you'll want to pay, or have a mechanical friend help. But hopefully most stuff it needs now is pretty basic.

Maybe a water or oil pump. Still easy, but you'd want someone with you with more experience for that, probably.

 

I've seen some really cool bad ass 4WD conversion done with the Chinooks, but I'm pretty sure you don't need duallys for the Chinook or a 1 ton axle because they can easily handle the weight. The problem with the bigger motorhomes like mine with the 1/2 ton axle is that those axles have been known to break catastrophically with no warning. Sadly, that same 1/2 ton axle on my Sunrader was THE reason why Toyota and Nissan stopped selling their chasiss's to US motorhome companies because of all the class action suits filed by slimy lawyers.

 

Yeah, that's what I've heard. My Chinook is a Newport model. 1978 only. Not as good for 4x4 conversion...a little top heavy, I'd think.

 

If its been wet and humid, you should put fresh gas in it. Throw some seafoam in the tank, it helps to take out some of the moisture. Also do the seafoam treatment, directions are on the back of the can. Helps!
My truck usually takes three pumps and a little feathering of the gas when it has sat for a long time and cold out.

 

Sweet! Those Newport Chinooks are extremely rare. Apparently Sunrader made a few 4x4's out of the 18'er and some have converted their 18'ers to 4x4 so it could probably be done with your Newport.

What do you use the white PVC pipe in the back for?

 

It won't start it at all now! It turns over but won't start now even with a squirt of starter fluid in the carb. I jumped it and almost had it going but then it would just turn over like before. Any ideas? Keep in mind that it started quickly last Monday when I went I first checked it out and that was apparently the first time it had been started in two to three weeks prior. And again, once it was started it would run super smooth with no hesitation or stalling and you could turn it off and it would quickly restart like normal. I also got it started the next day with starter fluid.

This is what I've done so far...

I put in new plugs, wires, dist cap, rotor, fuel filter (and lines), and 2 gallons of new gas because it was almost empty. I also cleaned and scratched the battery terminals.

What do you think I should check next?

Thanks again.

 

Do you have a helper?

You're on the right track. You need fuel, spark and compression to start and run (and air, I guess). So..make sure air filter is not completely clogged.

Anyways, one at a time.

Does the 20R carb have a sight glass? If so, can you see the fuel level in it? If it's empty, it's not getting gas. If it's completely full, it might be flooding. Somewhere in the middle is ideal. If it checks out, move on...

Pull one spark plug. Reconnect it to the wire. Only holding the rubber part, not standing in a puddle of water or gasoline, in a somewhat dark area, hold the end of the plug really close to something metal in the engine, on the exhaust side, and have someone crank the engine. See if you see a spark. If you do, and you've got fuel, and your air filter is good, then you've got more complicated problems.

No fuel in the carb could mean bad fuel pump. Sounds like you replaced the filter so it shouldn't be that. Fuel pump is pretty darn easy to remove and test, if it's a manual pump.

No spark is a little tougher...could be a bad coil, bad ignitor aka ignition module (most expensive), or a bad distributer.

If it's neither of those, you'll definitely need some help. Not complicated stuff, people here could probably walk you through it, but definitely more involved. A simple compression test is a good idea. It's just a little air pump you screw into each spark plug hole (have to do it four times; one for each cylinder), pump the pump and see what psi the cylinder is holding. I thought this was complicated until I saw it done once...super simple and not an expensive tool, either. Clogged emissions stuff could cause your engine not to start, and gets more complicated. EGR valve could be stuck open.

Anyways, first off check that the engine can pull air ie air filter, and that you're getting fuel, and spark.

And we take it from there...



On a brighter note...Yeah, I like the Chinook. I saw one like mine, really liked it, and so I thought maybe I'd buy one. The one in town doesn't move much (normal for a motorhome, but I could still dream), so I put a note on the windshield asking them to call me if they ever considered selling it.

I realized I had no idea what I would offer, having no experience with them...so I got on craigslist to see what the went for. Long story short, there were two for sale in the entire non-rust areas of the US...One was in Arizona, one Washington. I saw the price, and figured "that's not bad at all". Then I thought about it more...Seattle isn't so far away...I called, and before I knew it I was on a plane to Seattle, and drove the thing back.

I joined a Yahoo group - Toyota Chinook -, and soon found that even though Toyota Chinooks were made through most of the 70's, they were all the smaller pop-top version everyone's more familiar with. The Newport and Omega, like mine, were only made for one year, 1978. No idea how many of them there are. Rare, yes, but they do come up on craigslist here and there.

I only bought it in September. Only used it...4 or 5 times. I don't know what the tube is for. Fishing poles? Something like that? Not sure. Not sure if I'll keep it or not.

 

Hey thanks for all the great information!

No I don't have a helper. I doubt there are compression issues because the engine ran GREAT on Tuesday on the freeway and around town. Runs cool, smooth and lots of power...when I can get it started, and again, it will start right up all day long even after turning it off once its been warmed up.

I'll do the stuff you listed tomorrow (Sunday). I Googled it but can't find an image anywhere showing where the sight glass is located on the carb. Is it on the front of carb (closest to radiator) or back of carb? Drivers side or passenger side?

I've never seen the Newport Chinook out there in the real world. Only photos.

 

If you take off the air filter housing, you'll be able to see. The carb is on the passenger side; exhaust on the drivers side. Carb is what the air filter housing is attached to. The sight glass would be in the front of the carb (towards radiator).
http://www.google.com/imgres?q=22r+c...2&tx=108&ty=88
http://www.google.com/imgres?q=22r+c...9,r:3,s:0,i:93

 

Here is the latest...

Before trying to start it I looked at the sight glass and could see gas at the bottom of it. After trying to start it with starting fluid sprayed into the carb side only and pumping it 3 to 4 times quickly and then hitting the ignition the gas was up high in the sight glass but it still won't start. See the funky images below.

I don't have anyone around to turn the ignition while I check for spark but I'm sure its getting spark because it started right up a week ago after spraying starter fluid. The gas tank was low when I bought this last week and had been sitting a for while so I'm thinking in the short time I spent driving it to my home and trying to start it after that that some crap at the bottom of the gas tank went into the carb. (I added 2 gallons of new gas but that was after many attempts of trying to start it.)

I'm thinking its a carburator issue. What do you think about rebuilding the carburator? I can buy a kit on eBay for only $20.

 

Glad you're still here and not electrocuted...

Rebuilding a carb is almost never a bad idea on a vehicle this old. I'd go to Napa. There should be a metal tag, somewhere on your carb, with a number/model. You need that. There were a lot of variations throughout the years and what I've always heard (could be wrong!) is that if someone is selling a "22R carb rebuild kit", one size fits all, RUN.

There are a lot of variations. So...see if you can find that tag. I remember threads a while back on where to find it (probably back when I was having carb issues), but I don't remember now, because mine didn't have a tag, so it didn't stick in my memory. Hopefully yours does have a tag.

Alternatively, you can try to find a used carb in better shape, or have someone local rebuild it. I sent mine in to a place...I can find out who if you care. It was under $200, from what I remember, and you don't need to mess around too much with trying to tune it.

Don't let it discourage you, but carbs have a lot of little pieces to keep track of, and take a lot of fine-tuning to get right. But if you do it, you'll have a skill not too many of us have, even those who tinker with their trucks quite a bit. Something about the carb is just really frustrating...

Personally, I don't buy cheap, crap parts. I buy Toyota or equivalent. There is absolutely a difference. I would only go with ebay if I knew the brand being sold, that it was good quality, and just happened to be cheap on ebay. I wouldn't just buy something because it's cheap. You're putting too much work into it to use parts that suck.

 

[quote=magentawave;52025192]. At one point he installed a solenoid (see attached photo) that is located inside of the drivers side fender.

Whats the deal with that solenoid? I wounder if that is the issue. Sounds like the thing runs fine when it runs. Starting has gotten worse. How is that solenoid wired? Look at all the grounds, clean? Sounds like your getting fuel.
You could have sucked up some crap out of the tank, check your fuel filter. Is the new one have any color in it.

My 81 would flood time to time, starting fluid did nothing, I was getting fuel and spark. Had to let it sit for a while then it would start. Then I got mad and kept flooring the gas and cranking this blew it out and started. I ended up replacing the carb with a weber.

You need to check for spark, check that solenoid. let us know!
Good luck!!!

 

I missed the solenoid thing...I have no idea about that.

If you do rebuild or replace the carb, drain the gas tank. On my 83 there is a drain plug in the bottom. If you see a bunch of crap in the filter, there's definitely a bunch of crap in the tank, and you're rebuild/replacement will be no good to you if it just clogs up again.

If it's a nice mostly rust free truck, the tank shouldn't be rust. But you never know what kind of crap may have built up in there over the years.

 

Yes it ran great last week once it started with lots of power and zero stalling or hesitation. Here is the other thing... I only had to keep my foot on the accelerator for maybe the first 30 seconds after starting cold and then it idled smoothly...and that was in cold weather and after not being started for several weeks prior to that.

Yes there is a tag on the front of the carburator with numbers.

I don't know about the solenoid except that it was replaced about three years ago and rarely started after that. I'll check to see if there is junk in the fuel filter and poke at those solenoid connections tomorrow...and I'm going to hustle up a human to turn the key while I check spark.

I spoke to someone today that rebuilds carbs ($500 to rebuilt it - aaargh!) and he said to pull off the air filter housing and tap on some 1/2" round protruding thing above the sight glass with a hammer. He said if it starts after that then that means I need a new "needle and seat." He explained why but all I remember is that the needle might be getting stuck.

Two questions please...

1) What are the symptoms of a bad solenoid?

2) Dumb question but before I detach lots of stuff I don't need to, how do I remove the air filter housing (the bottom part)? There are the two bolts attaching it to the valve cover but what else is holding it in place?

Thanks again guys!