I decided to try replacing the fuel pump (it's definitely pumping but I"m out of stuff to replace) and adding a fuel pressure regulator. I was getting ready to replace the pump and started looking at how the lines were run. There is a small simple plastic in line Fuel filter under the hood. The lines don't seem like they are run right. I"m curious whether this could be causing my problem.
I have 2 lines going to that aftermarket fuel filter. One is coming from the gas tank, the other runs to the TOP FITTING of the mechanical fuel pump (the one that is supposed to go back to the tank). The fuel line running into the "IN" line of the fuel pump comes directly from the gas tank. The out line runs direct to the carburetor (no filter on it). And as I mentioned before, the 3rd line on the fuel pump (the top one) runs to the OUT line of the fuel filter. DOES THAT SEEM RIGHT TO YOU? My pump is working and car runs very good. only issues are the 1 second delay/stumble when giving it full throttle and the very strong gas smell. I also notice a lot of air bubbles in the clear fuel filter when I'm running it, particularly when I turn off the motor.
ANY IDEAS? This is an early 80's 22r with a just rebuilt weber 32/36. Thank you for your time.

 

You are probably pumping gas into the charcoal filter. Get the FSM and check it before you burn the truck down.

 

There is no charcoal filter on this car. It was removed at some point .

 

By the description you're giving (a picture would be nice) you are filtering the return fuel line to the tank and a consequence of this is un-filtered fuel is going into the pump and then to the carb. Its entirely possible dirt has got into your just rebuilt carb and messed it up. Seems to me that the gassy smell is a result of the missing charcoal canister. Hopefully whomever did that had the inspiration to route a vent hose some where dirt couldn't get into the gas tank and thus into your carb! First route all the fuel lines properly and filter the fuel before the inlet of the pump or a very least before the carb. Second find out how the tank is being vented and vent it properly with a filter at the end of it. Thirdly you may have to rebuild that carb again if dirt's got somewhere bad, likely in the acceleration pump circuit from your description. Was the carb rebuilt by a competent individual? Seems that's where your problem started. Now you say "car". If in fact it is a passenger car as opposed to a truck the open fuel vent is possibly letting fumes directly into the passenger compartment. Remember that the canister and EVAP system not only captures emissions but also prevents that gassy smell. I grew up with pick-ups that had gas tanks behind the seat with vented caps beside the drivers door...believe me those weren't the "good old days"! Oh yah it was leaded gas too...might explain the eye twitch


Oh and why the fuel pressure regulator with a stock mechanical fuel pump. The fuel return line is there to prevent fuel bowl flooding and needle and seat damage.

 

Hello Old 83 and thank you for your time. A few things....
Yes, I've gotten some gunk the carb and I cleaned it out but that isn't the problem. It ran the exact same way right after i rebuilt it and exactly the same today. I switched the lines around today (the way I think it's supposed to be...supply line to in port on inline filter, out of filter to the in port on Fuel pump, and return line from pump to tank. It ran EXACTLY the same. That seems crazy to me but I'm not a mechanic so I don't understand how switching it all around didn't change a thing.
I think the fuel tank is aftermarket. It has a vent right near the fuel sender and the vent line goes right into the fuel fill.
I"m the one that rebuilt the 32/36. I didn't soak it parts cleaner though, but did the rebuild and I went through it very well and everything seemed ok.
Yes, it is a car. It is well known that the 32/36 doesnt like more than 4psi or so. All the forums and LCE/Redline/Weber all highly recommend and even say it's mandatory to have the fuel pressure regulator to dial back the pressure to 3 psi or so. I have a gauge on mine and even with the return line, the stock mechanical pump puts out 4-6+ psi at the carb. I still have'nt installed it yet since I wanted to get the lines right. NOw that I feel they are right, I can try the regulator. I can also try a new fuel pump since I have one.

 

one that says IN comes from plastic filter on fender well out to carb. middle one is for fuel vapor to return to tank. if no charcoal you can just send it straight back to tank.



Sound like the 2 lines from the tank maybe crisscrossed cause I was thinking evap line should just hit tank, and not be submerged in fuel. that being the case how could input on pump bring up fuel @ all from that line. might be wrong about that though.


If the line connected to IN has been working I would send it through plastic filter then back into input on pump. your line hooked to filter into middle tit on pump or plugged. tit closest too water neck is output to carb


also I'm running 32/36 with oem mechanical pump no regulator, and no issues. Factory pump is a low pressure pump.

 

Msane99,
Yesterday, I rerouted them that way and it changed nothing. Still have the same problem with the 1-2 second delay/bog/stutter when giving it full throttle and still have very heavy gas smell.
The only parts I haven't replaced yet is the fuel pump and the carb (i did rebuild it though). I guess those are my next moves.

 

So that fuel pressure regulator may be the way to go now that I've looked things up. Only used on my old and gone Celica when it was running 40 DCOE's and an electric pump...guess an old dog can learn a new trick! Now that vent line on your gas tank sounds to me like the overfill shut off line for when you're filling it up at the gas station. If its about a 5/8 to 1 inch hose its not a vent, its the overfill shut off. The tank should have three 1/4 inch or so hoses on top around the sender unit, fuel out, fuel return and the EVAP/vent line. Make sure the tank is vented to the atmosphere in some way, that's old school auto mechanics. Doubt it has a vented gas cap, they did away with those when smog stuff came in. Don't start throwing parts at it and hope you hit it. You got the regulator so put it in and try it. Does it bog with a half throttle or just when you mat it? Does it stutter if you just rev it up in the driveway? Sounds as if you got the previous owners mess, if they had the wrong jets, mixture tubes (DCOE's have them maybe 32/36's don't?) power valves etc., your going to have to go step by step, one thing at a time till you have it. Keep a record of what you did, and to repeat do only one change at a time. When you have it, write down what worked...don't trust your memory!

 

Yes, you are right about the hose. It's probably more of an overflow . It's definitely a vented cap. There are only 3 connections on this tank ....the pickup/main line, the return line, and the overflow line that is on the fuel fill neck.
I could test run it without the gas cap and just see what happens.
I will try the regulator by tomorrow.
It only bog when I floor it. You can tell it does it a bit when I"m sitting still and flooring it but it's obviously more pronounced when I"m driving and therefore under a load.
I've rebuilt the carb and tried all kinds of diff jets, a/c, diff timing, etc.
Yes, I did get his mess but have slowly corrected it all too. Most of the stuff I've done needed to be done anyways. For ex: the timing advance on the dizzy didn't work and the dizzy itself looked questionable so I replaced it. I had a plug wire with hole in the boot so replaced the wires. The motor was hardly ever run so the carb was gummed up and the linkage was so that the secondary side wasn't even opening when I floored it. etc etc. So it needed a lot of maintenance. The rest of the car...body and interior had been completely restored (frame off). So it was worth the investment.
I'll let you know tomorrow if the FPR made a difference.
Thank you!

 

The FPR made no difference. I tried it on different settings from 2.5 to 4psi and it didn't change anything or solve my bog/stumble issue. Ditto with running with and without the gas cap.
The only thing out of the ordinary that I noticed is when I was doing a visual inspection after a test drive, I opened up the barrels by giving it full throttle (car not running of course) and smoke came up out of the secondary side. Is that normal?
Any other suggestions?

 

Did you do the whole Webber tune? where you run the air fuel screw all the way in and back it off 1.5 turns, and back idle out till its just touching. then playing with air fuel screw till smoothest result then setting idle? There is a write up, but its just the Webber instructions, there is a pdf on their site I think. I know theres a great writeup here somewhere about setting up Webber.


Sounds like its too rich. Id go back too factory jets do the tune the way Webber instructs and go from there. I think you'll find your running rich. I think stock jets are rich out of the box for our trucks.


Think that Webber document says if you are over 1.5 turns out to smooth up idle different jets are in order. (go leaner first)

 

it'll barely run while you are setting it up. you might have to give it a little more idle than factory document says just to keep it running. you'll listen for a sweet spot with minimal stumble.

 

don't need that regulator factory pump does the job. when its right it'll crank on the first lick every time.


The Webber instruction I just gave you are from memory, I'd confirm what I'm saying. Pretty sure I'm close but I'd still confirm.


Smoke from secondary was prolly just hot gas vapor.

 

Yes, did the rebuild myself and followed weber/redline instructions to the T on setting up the carb. As a matter of fact, I've done it multiple times since I've changed jets, a/c, idle jets, carb adapter plate, had carb off twice, etc. Smaller jets made no difference.
I can get it to bog while in neutral too by flooring it real fast from idle. So I think I'll put some fuel in a bulb and see if squeezing fuel into the barrels while it's bogging makes it better or worse. that should help narrow it down

 

Have you checked valve clearances? Worn cam and/or bad valve adjustments could cause similar symptoms. Just a thought, sounds like you've thrown about everything you could @ it.

 

I suspected it could be a valve so adjusted the valves 2 weeks ago. A few of the valves were a little off but it didn't run any different afterwards.
I"m working with Weber/redline on any other possibilities and then I'll be down to just getting a new carb. Then the question willl be whether I should get a 38 or another 32/36. Its a stock 22r, so I think the 32/36 is fine, but I might want to do some upgrades later so I might just have to get the 38. I'm not quite ready to give up yet.

 

Well, it's not the fuel pump either. arghhh