ehuesman

Hi All,

Since I just became a 4Runner owner two days ago, I'm brand new to the forum. I've already done some searching on this forum and Toyota-4Runner.org for answers, but I'm not even sure what my problem is, so searching for an answer is kind of difficult at this point.

Also, I apologize in advance for the long post. I try to be as descriptive as possible to help those who are helping me. If you don't want to read the long story, it boils down to these three questions:

(1) Without the use of the indicator lights in the dash, or the position of the 4WD push button, or the "feel" of the driving, how can I determine if my 4Runner is in 2H or 4H?

(2) Without the use of the indicator lights in the dash, or the position of the Center Differential Lock button, or the "feel" of the driving, how can I determine if the center differential is locked?

(3) With the transmission in neutral, and shifting the 4WD shifter from the "4L" position, past the "N" position, and into the "H" position, is it normal to hear gears grinding and have to somewhat force the shifter into the "H" position?

Here is the detailed story that has led me to those two questions. I promise I'm not usually as stupid as these next few paragraphs are going to make me appear (I hope).

I've spent the last few weeks searching for my son's first car. Two days ago, I came across an '01 4Runner Limited 4WD with low mileage. Since I already own an '02 Tacoma Double-Cab 4WD, and I am a fan of the 3.4 V6 (and Toyota's in general), I decided to go check it out. While test driving the 4Runner, I saw the 4WD system appeared to be identical to the one in my Tacoma, at least in regards to the "4WD shifter" (is that the proper name?) next to the auto transmission shifter. I did notice the 4Runner had a center differential lock, versus my Tacoma having the rear diff lock.

While driving the 4Runner at about 20 mph, I pushed the 4WD button, but nothing happened. Nothing at all, no lights, no buzzing, and no difference in the feel of the driving. I then stopped the truck, put the transmission in neutral, then shifted the 4WD shifter up into the "4L" position. I put the transmission back into drive, and could immediately feel and hear the difference. It felt and sounded just like when I have my Tacoma in 4L 4WD. I pushed the center differential lock button, but again nothing happened. No lights, no sound. I stopped the truck, put the transmission in neutral, then shifted the 4WD shifter down to the "H" position. I had to push it into position, and I could hear gears grinding as I did so. I couldn't remember if that was what it sounded like in my Tacoma or not, because I don't really use 4WD that often.

The above set of circumstances led me to believe that since the push button 4WD and the push button center differential lock did not appear to be working, but the truck went into "4L", that the problem was something electrical, maybe even simple like a fuse (I now realize that was faulty logic and an utter display of stupidity). Everything else seemed good on the truck, so I went ahead and purchased it and drove it home.

After I got off work the next day, I went to the 4Runner and did a visual inspection of all the fuses. I did locate the 4WD fuse in the panel next to the steering wheel, but it looked fine when I took it out and inspected it. I also checked all the fuses in the box in the engine compartment. They all appeared to be in working order. A little disappointed that my fix wasn't going to be so easy, I got under the 4Runner and tried to rotate the front driveshaft, but it wouldn't turn. Believing that meant the 4Runner was in 4WD, I went over to my Tacoma and tried to rotate the front driveshaft. It turned very easily. Even though none of the 4WD indicator lights on the dash of the 4Runner were working, I still pushed the 4WD button in and out, trying to turn the front driveshaft with the 4WD button in both positions. I was never able to turn it.

At that point, I started fuming because I believed that since I could not turn the 4Runner's front driveshaft, but I could turn the Tacoma's front driveshaft, that meant the problem with the 4Runner's wasn't that it wouldn't go into 4H 4WD, but that it was actually STUCK in 4H 4WD. I began to suspect the seller's must have disabled the 4WD indicator light in the dash in order to hide the problem.

I called a buddy, who is not very familiar with Toyotas, but does have more automotive knowledge than me. He explained to me that when I was test driving the 4Runner, and put it into "4L", that even though I thought it was in 4L 4WD due to the change in feel and sound, that it was probably just in 2L. He said the sound and feel of 4L and 2L would be pretty similar. We then jacked up the front left wheel and was able to free spin it, which leads us to believe the 4Runner is NOT stuck in 4WD. My buddy stated the front driveshaft in his Dodge Ram is always engaged and turning, and engaging the gears inside the front axle, so he can never get under his truck and rotate the front driveshaft by hand. When he puts his Dodge into 4WD the wheels lock into the gears in the axle. He suggested maybe my 4Runner operates the same way.

Someone else told me this afternoon that jacking up one wheel and being able to spin it didn't necessarily mean the truck wasn't in 4WD. He said it could be a limited slip differential, which would enable me to spin one of the wheels, even in 4WD. He did qualify that opinion by stating he didn't know a lot about 4WD.

Another issue, that I'm guessing is related to all of the above, is the "VSC OFF" and "VSC TRAC" lights do not come on when the ignition is turned on. While searching the internet for solutions to my problems, I learned those two lights are supposed to come on, and then go off, after the ignition is turned on. The "VSC OFF" is also supposed to come on when the center differential is locked.

At this point, I'm not sure if the sellers disabled any of the dash indicator lights or not. My understanding is the 4WD indicator light would be blinking if there was a problem with the 4WD system that prevented it from engaging. I didn't see anything in my research that would explain why that indicator light would not come on at all. I also don't know if it is possible to lock the center differential if the truck is only in 2WD.

My primary concern is determining what state the truck is in right now, and since I can't rely on the dash indicator lights, I need to learn how to determine that by other means. Is the truck in 2H or 4H? Is the center differential locked or not? Honestly, I could go without a working 4WD system, but my understanding is that I don't want the opposite. Meaning, I think it's a bad idea to have a truck stuck in 4H all the time and/or have the center differential locked all the time. Of course, if fixing the 4WD is somewhat simple and inexpensive, then all the better.

If you read this far, thank you very much for your time. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

- Eric

toyota4x4907

'01-'02 4Runners are full-time 4wd ( AWD). You wouldn't feel a difference when locking the center diff until you're in a situation where either the front or rear wheels are slipping or stuck. As for the grinding and tough shifting, it sounds like you have a little drive-line binding because you drove on a high traction surface (the road) with the center diff locked.

ehuesman

They are AWD, or they can be driven in 4H full-time if you want? If AWD, what is the purpose of the "4WD" button on the shifter?

My concern is I might still be driving on a high traction surface (the road) with the center diff locked, which is why I am trying to figure out how to tell if the center diff is locked. I know the little circle in the middle of the 4WD dash indicator light is supposed to illuminate when the center diff is locked, but what if those lights aren't working for some reason or another? Is there no other way to tell?

Also, is there a way to "unbind" a drive-line?

Thanks!

toyota4x4907

I had to look it up. I swore I had read multiple times they were AWD.
They have the capability of being driven as though they have AWD since they have a center differential.
Sorry, I have no answer now.

Road Bull

This might help.>>> http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-ge...tml#post706219