Texas_Ace

Ok, After about a year of leaving my truck pretty much as is I finally have the funds (or will within the next few months) to start working on it again.

First off is to remove some of the stufff that was on there before. and clean it up some (should make quite a few of ya'll happy) And overall just get it ready for some real work and Build-up Stage 2.

Here is where my problems start, i can't decide what to do!

I know that i am doing the engine first, the problem is what to do with it. I am going to Supercharge it but should i also do some head work (aka, Port & polish, cams and possibly valves/springs) and do the bottom end (aka, pistons, rings, rods ect.) or just do one or the other? or none of them?

Basically my long term plan is to turn my 2000 4runner into a fun to drive DD that can both go off-road when i want and be pretty quick on road, an all around truck basically.

I plan to get either a 1st gen or an old bronco (yeah i know, so someone sell me a 1st gen for cheap so i can have that, otherwise the bronco is cheaper) and turn that into a real trail rig.

So back to the 4runner, I want relibilty first and formost. next is power, i would like to be able to get 300 RWHP at the wheels but i know that is a bit of a dream without a lot of $$$ and loss of relibilty.

So tell me, what should i get that will net me the best relibilty with the most power?

infiltrator

I like the idea of getting a 1st gen for a trail rig. I've seen your truck, your engine is immaculate, you got some great stereo equip, and you have cool offroading lights.

The rest is totally up to you. I mean you could black out some stuff like the front grill and the rims..

But I think your 4runner now is set. Superchargers are pretty expensive... Go for the older one!

mastacox

That is a lot of power, about 370-400 at the crank I would estimate, and that won't come easy even from a supercharged 3.4l. The problem with the TRD supercharger is it's roots based, so you can't use an intercooler. IMO, you'll definitely want an intercooler for the kind of boost you need to reach to get to your power goal (between 15 an 20psi I think).

Midiwall has been working for 300rwhp for a long time, he's supercharged with cams and top end work, water/methanol injection, and a 2.0" pulley IIRC, and he's still not there. I don't really think you can get to 300rwhp with the TRD supercharger and retain any kind of reliability. To get there correctly you would probably need an engine internals reworking (pistons, head, cams, maybe rods), and a custom intercooled turbo setup. As long as your engine management is done right, you'll probably be able to push 300+whp reliably with less work than trying to massage it out of a supercharged setup.

With that kind of power, I hope you have a manual tranny. An automatic transmission will need some heavy duty upgrades to handle that kind of power, like a full rebuild with new clutches, a new T/C, and modified VB. About $4000-$5000 in work on the transmission alone...

mastacox

Another possible option would be a 2JZGTE swap, and sell your 3.4l...

cackalak han

I hope by "I finally have the funds", you mean you've got $20,000 set aside, because that's what it will take.

mastacox

Yeah, between transmission upgrades, engine work, and other random drivetrain and suspension mods, I can see how $15k would be a realistic estimate.

Engine Work- Perhaps $6000, maybe up to $10,000 depeding on how much you can do yourself.

Tranny $4000

Suspension and tires/wheels- $2000

Texas_Ace

I have thought about that but didn't really want to go that far. plus agter reading up on it the work it takes to fit it in the 4runner is a LOT.

Yeah i pretty much figure that, just tought i would trough it out there to see what people thought.

I guess 250RWHP is a more reasonable goal, i know that can be done with the TRD SC and some rather minor work and tuning. I really don't want ot get into the bottom end. I will save that for another day. But since i have to rip the top of the engine off anyways to do the SC i figure doing some head work is not that much of a strech.

So with a new goal in mind 250+ whp and staying heads or above, what would be the best things to do?

Yeah, that is out of my price range. I figure about $5000 for parts i can do over the next year fairly easy. And i do all my own work (except maybe things like P&P). The tranny is the real killer, if all else fails i will do the engine first and just go real easy on it until i can afford to do the tranny.

Whitey13

IMO opinion, you're still looking at a gigantic waste of money. If your looking to spend that kind of $$ maybe look into getting a 4th gen instead.

mastacox

You will be able to attain 250-260rwhp (about 320hp at the crank) with a TRD Supercharger, URD kit, and a 2.2" pulley. URD's 7th injector kit is relatively cheap and comes with everything you need to safely run the boost of a 2.2" pulley (~8-9psi at sea level). For the transmission, I would recommend looking into "shimming your accumulators" or a valve body upgrade, depending on what you're brave enough to do. Shimming the accumulators is essentially free, valve body upgrade would be about $800.

You could probably get a supercharger, URD kit, and modified valve body done for about $4500, or without the VB upgrade you could probably come in under $3500 depending on the deal you get on the S/C.

Don't forget that you will need some measurement equipment to go with the supercharger as well. At very least you will need an aftermarket wideband oxygen sensor for tuning ($300-400), an OBD-II reader ($100-200), and a laptop to handle the tuning software.

EDIT- oh and don't forget, you will want a BIG aftermarket transmission cooler, and just to be safe a tranny temp gauge and synthetic fluids.

mastacox

Perhaps, but I have a supercharger and URD kit and love it. I prefer the look of a 3rd gen anyway, and have exactly what I wanted- Supercharged Auto 3rd gen with an E-locker and sunroof.

Whitey13

If I had a factory locker in my truck along with my highlander package, I wouldn't think about selling either. At this point, again IMO, I'd rather put $$ into a newer truck. There are some amazing 4th gens on Toyota120, and I like that they are slightly larger (and more powerful). In the grand scheme of things, if I told someone I put $4000 into engine work which netted me 250 ponies, they'd think I was nuts.

mastacox

That's 250hp at the wheels... At the crank its more like 320hp, a 78% increase over stock which is pretty healthy for 185hp to start with.

cackalak han

I also prefer the looks of the 3rd Gen, but as far as reliability, the 1GR-FE will be better than an FI'ed 3.4L, IMO. It's also just as powerful (compared to 3.4L w/ supercharger only). I would love to swap in a 1GR 6-speed in a 3rd Gen body. How sweet would that be?

Texas_Ace

Thats pretty much what i was thinking, about $5k and get a fairly nice truck to mess around with. I never plan on selling this truck EVER so i want something that i will be relible and later in year i can convert to a trail rig.

I already have the biggest tranny cooler i could find installed and a tranny temp gauge. So that is taken care of. The trick is finding a good deal on the SC and if i get lucky a URD kit (i saw one on ebay a few months ago that went for $500, i am still kicking myself for not grabbing that).

Pretty much my thinking, i love my 3rd gen. The looks are IMO much better than stock 4th gens (i will give that any truck can look good modded). My 3rd gen is perfect for what i need.

Now that is what i WOULD like to see, the 4.0 in a 3rd gen body WITH a Supercharger! NOW THAT WOULD BE NICE!


But for me, my 3rd gen is going to be my DD for the forseeable future. No way i could talk my way into a 4th gen anytime soon of any nice car/truck so i am pretty well "stuck" with this 3rd gen. Also i can't stand my dads 2006 Corola. EVERYTHING on it is a computer, there is not a single switch that goes directly to whatever it is supposed to do. I don't know about other people but i just can't stand that.




At this point i am totally open to suggestions. In about the $5k price range and a fairly skilled mechanic that is not afriad to try something new. and can't/won't get a newer truck. What would you do to get some more power out of this? Engine swaps are an option as long as it is close to drop in and not a lot of custom work (seeing as it would be my first swap). Something that has been done before.

OR, should i just get another truck altogether and mess with that (older truck, something i can pay cash for, no way i could talk my way into another payment each month). TOTALLY open to suggestions.

Lets hear it.

mastacox

If your 3.4l is well maintained and running nicely, an engine swap doesn't seem like a very good option. Still, you could look into a 1UZ swap, or even a 1GR swap if you're ready to blaze a trail.

For more power on your already proven powerplant, I think supercharging is a pretty good option. It is also in theory reversible, which is probably a good thing.

Texas_Ace

That has been my thinking all along. Mine has 135k miles on it BUT was well taken care of and a resent compression test gave it 185psi across all of them with only about 5 psi differnce. so it is still in good condition.

Another thing i like about keeping the 3.4l is that if it WAS ever to go out i can just get another block and swap it in without much hassel and be on the road again (since i live in the south the frame and such will last virtually forever). Plus SC'ing the 3.4l adds value to the truck IF i was ever to sell it (HIGHLY HIGHLY unlikely).

Any actual work is still a month or 2 away so i am still open to any suggestions, though SC'ing it looks to be the best option.

mastacox

For an unbiased way of comparing options, you might look at it from a dollar/hp comparison.

Supercharge your 3.4l- $25 / hp (assuming $3500 and 145hp gain)

1GR swap- Pricey, could be about $85 / hp not including a supercharger if the engine is newish (60hp gain at about $5000 for the swap, estimating engine price and parts / installation)

1UZ swap- Could be cheaper than a 1GR swap, bragging rights for an all-alloy V-8 are nice. Maybe $65-$85 / hp depending on how much the engine you get costs.

2JZ swap- similar to a 1UZ swap I would think.

Whitey13

Here is what netted QSVeilside 246 (I believe) at the wheels:
Power:
TRD Supercharger
TRD 7th injector
TRD Headers - Stainless Steel Ceramic Coated
TRD 160 Degree Thermostat
URD AIC
URD 2.0" Supercharger Pulley
URD Lightweight Crankshaft Pulley - Reduction of 8 lbs rotational weight
IK22 plugs
Walbro 190 LPH Fuel Pump
Aluminum intake pipe w/ AFE cone filter
Magnaflow 28" w/ stainless 2.5" mandrel bent pipes
Throttle Body coolant bypass
Vented hood scoop
QSVeilside vented intake mod

Precautionary:
Shims placed in valve body
Hayden 679 trans cooler

cackalak han

Ok, I would vote to just do some basics, like a lift and tires. Then focus on an older truck--1st Gen 4Runner, PU, etc. Then you've got a reliable 3rd Gen and a play toy. You could even pick up a shell and stuff a small block 350, solid axles, etc. etc. That would be sweet.

Texas_Ace

Good points, and from that SC'ing the 3.4 looks like the best bet, it is not like i am going to be racing in it but all my friends have jeeps with that 4.0. I just want something that has a more power then that really. The side benifit is that i will get a truck that is more fun to drive.

Yeah, i remember his truck though i am pretty sure his sig said 25X hp no tune. so i am sure with some tuning he could get some more out of it. That is also more or less what i am wanting to do to my truck.

I have/am thinking about this. As i said in the first post i am activly looking for a 1st gen or a bronco to make a trail rig out of, leaving this as a DD street Queen with some minor off-roading from time to time. (aka, nothing so bad that i would worry about breaking anything).

But since this would be on the street 99% of the time a lift and bigger tires don't make much sense (though i will most likely get them anyways down the line lol).

Plus another reason i am so for SC'ing my truck is that i have never had a FI car before, i want to get my feet wet with FI and this seems like a great way since this is the first truck i am sure i will never sell.