It's been a while since I've been to his shop but let me know how they work out.

 

I've been following this since around the beginning of the year. I'm thinking about buying these after I get back from vacation in two weeks, I planned on using some of those fiberglass reinforced cutoff wheels for my dremel, those things cut pretty good but don't last long and are expensive (6$ - 4 or 5 wheels). I would imagine they would be more accurate though.

Elripster: About how long does it take to install these? Have you tested them offroad yet? Do you plan on posting installation instructions on your website? I would like to get an idea of what I'm going to need, time, etc. Hows the brace coming along?

 

I installed these in about 2 hours taking notes and pictures. I'd say it should take a person less time than that assuming they have some sort of cuttoff tool. For the price of those wheels you might look into the Harborfrieght of equivalent. I get the 4" wheels at HomeDepot for like 90 cents or something like that.

I haven't had them off road yet. My truck hasn't fully "recovered" from being stolen last Labor day. She still needs a spare, some ugly rims for my old mudders(swore to myself I wouldn't take these new tires off road), bumpers, sliders, and a jack.

I do plan on some installation instructions. I have tests and projects due throughout next week so it will take a week or two. It's pretty easy though, I can give a quick run down if anyone needs.

I haven't started the brace yet. I'm trying to take care of the details with this, like instructions, etc... then I'm going to look into the brace.

Frank.

 

What brace is everyone talking about? An IFS truss? Spill it!!

 

If you mean by truss, something to go inbetween the rear LCA mounts, then yes that's the spillage.

I thought it would make for more of a "kit" if it included that.

Frank.

 

Elripster--I think you need to come out to the run we are planning in Anza Borrego the weekend of the 19th. I really want to compare apples to apples and see those things in action.

 

Man I would love to but I can't. My truck is still missing too much stuff. It got stolen over last Labor Day and came back with a lot less parts than when it left. I mean I have no spare, jack, bumpers, little stuff like that. That week is my spring break and I plan to spend some time making bumpers. I also need some ugly rock crawler rimsto mount my old mudders on for wheeling. (trying to keep these tires in good shape) Oh, I also need a roll bar. :pat:

I'm working on it though. Some of the profits from these spacers will go towards the resurection of my truck.

You guys have cool emoticons.

Frank.

 

what happens to the LCA arm does it bind? what happens to the c.v. at full drop does it bind? does it put more load on the ball joint? and I understand that removing a little metal is ok but the toyota but it there for a reason.

 

hmmm ive been thinking about the spacers....

I'm sure you've noticed a difference in overall suspension travel with stock bump stops, but have you replaced them with the low profiles?

As far as drop, I gained a bunch just swapping out the bump stops that impact the underside of the UCA. However there was NO gain in "stuffability" of the tire and in fact I could not get the LCA to impact its bumpstop. In otherwords, stuffability is limited by the torsion bars not the bump stops when using low profiles. Therefore the upper control arm limits all movement both full drop and full "stuff" (as long as the shocks don't limit.)

So if suddenly the UCA is 1.5" higher, the tire can drop an extra 1.5", but should loose ~1.5" of stuffability with the stock torsion settings...

Now if I backed off the torsions enough to bring it back to stock height, I would definately have more movement - I think? What would that do to my 99% on road ride? Mainly I'd love to have a softer suspension up front - speed bumps suck right now...

 

As far as binding is concerned, you need to use stock extension bumpstops or, if you have the shorties, shim them .5" with some washers. (I did that with my shorties.) You should then have no binding whatsoever. I tested this on my truck and another, both have no problems.

As far as cranked t-bars and stuffability, you have touched on an interesting subject. I'm not sure of your geometry background, but when you crank the torsion bars, the a-arm angle increases, and the effective radius decreases. The result is less torque. Less torque means less flex and you get a stiff ride.

What makes the spacers different is that the actual a-arm angle becomes more level. Now if you draw a line from the a-arm pivot to the ball joint to compare say a 1.5" t-bar crank to 1.5" spacers, the angle will be the same. However, the radius is actually longer and the line of action has moved farther away from the a-arm pivot. The result is more torque and therefore more flex.

What I noticed when I put on the spacers, (MikeSoCal noticed this as well) is that the ride got softer. This fits with theory. Should theory continue to hold, the suspension should articulate better on the trail as well.

Another part of what you noticed is that stock t-bars are pretty darn stiff. With that said, as you have probably also noticed when your ride height was stock, the more level UCA made for more overall useable travel on the trail. (plus it rode better) Normally that means you lose so much clearance under the crossmember you hit it on stuff a lot. With the spacers you can keep it level and still have decent clearance between the front wheels.

To address the cutting, one thing to remember, cutting metal costs money, usually more than the metal. So, if metal can stay put, it usually will in the interests of keeping costs down even if it contributes no function. The upper a-arm doesn't see near the beating the lower one does. The material removed is superficial and non-critical to function. Believe me, I cut my UCA's and I certianly don't want them to fail either. I wouldn't have done it had I thought there would be any problems.

Frank.

 

I'm sold on them, I just got to figure out how I'm going to level it out. Not only that got to see what my finances look like after my vacation in two weeks. Probably be a month or two before I buy just to see how everyone else is doing with them and maybe you'll have that truss made up. Hopefully a little cheaper than downey's. I think it runs about 60-75$ but its been a while since I looked at their catalog.

 

Any bells ringing ??? Same thing as my Frankenstein Front End.

 

I've seen pics of your truck, very impressive.

Ultimately I think coil springs are a better setup than torsion bars as far as slow speed flex is concerned.

Frank.

 

I don't suppose you have a picture of their truss?

Frank.

 

I can scan the one from the catalog. NWOR has one too and Rockstoomper used to.

 

42186: $39.95
42189: $39.95

You would probably be best off just buying the Downey one and re-selling it.

 

Looks like the Downey one is alot better than the Rockstomper one, which I believe he does not even make anymore. Your gonna get vibes from the tube hitting the diff, hence the bend in the Downey.

http://www.4x4wire.com/toyota/reviews/frame_brace/

 

NWOR Part #90005-1 and fits '89-95 trucks. $47.95

https://www.yotatech.com/forums/show...highlight=NWOR

https://www.yotatech.com/forums/show...highlight=NWOR

 

Wow, thanks for the info, it's very helpfull. My idea is a combination of those. I guess it will come down to, can I add functionality, and if so for what price. They are pretty competitive from a price standpoint. However, I'll still see what I can do. If I make one, part of the requirements are that it be rock worthy. Looks like there's some room for improvement there.

Frank.

 

Is the truss a surprise gift coming with my order? You'll at least cut us pioneers a break, right?

EDIT: High clearance design as much as possible, it needs to fit under my bellypan.