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Old 07-13-2017, 04:45 PM   #1
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No Electricity

I have 88 3vze - 4x4 - 5 speed Manual - Pickup

Yesterday as I was leaving the place, I realized I forgot something. I reversed killed the engine.. grabbed what I needed. and as I turned the key for ignition, I heard a click, simultaneously, everything went dead. No start.. no turning.. nothing. I turned the key back to the off position, and back on... the Hud lights came back on.. but when turning for ignition.. just one click... and the hud lights are out... After this, turning the key to Off and back On... No perceivable power to Hud or anything. I disconnected the battery, and reconnected. Turned Key to On... got lights. .. but.. attempting ignition... I get one click.. and no power.. again I disconnected and reconnected the battery... Turn the key to On... and for One microsecond I see power to hud, before again no perceivable power.

(Possibly related issue) Earlier this year I replaced a portion of the Primary wire with 10 gauge standard Automotive. .. I know.. I know. And I totally forgot about the temporary fix.

Sorry, I don't know the voltage to the battery, yet.
Any guesses??

Last edited by Gregery; 07-13-2017 at 04:51 PM.
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Old 07-13-2017, 05:10 PM   #2
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You who are in front of the truck are in the best position to guess.
However, we don't fix things by guessing.

We fix things by clearly describing the problem.
We fix things by making sure our connections have bare, shiny metal contacting bare shiny metal. Done that?
What is the primary wire?
What is a Hud? What kind of Jedi powers do you have that you can perceive power? We check for power with a multi-meter. Be like us mortals and get a $6 one from Harbor Freight and we'll talk.

Last edited by RAD4Runner; 07-13-2017 at 07:22 PM.
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Old 07-13-2017, 05:16 PM   #3
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You who are in front of the truck is in the best position to guess.
However, we don't fix things by guessing.

We fix things by clearly describing the problem.
We fix things by making sure our connections have bare, shiny metal contacting bare shiny metal. Done that?
What is the primary wire?
What is a Hud? What kind of Jedi powers do you have that you can perceive power? We check for power with a multi-meter. Be like us mortals and get a $6 one from Harbor Freight and we'll talk.
I just love this guy cause he is sooo right?
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Old 07-13-2017, 11:11 PM   #4
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Red face

One is so lost without the multimeter

Now if I could find a OBII code reader and Multi Meter in one unit I could let one live in each vehicle

I gotta wonder at the splice job and just what wire and the condition of the battery terminals and cables in general .

Then my emergency repairs most often last years

Then maybe just a bad ground .

I am curious just what Hud lights are some sort of after market lights ??
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Old 07-14-2017, 05:56 AM   #5
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HUD = Heads Up Display but I don't think that is a feature in an 88.
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Old 07-14-2017, 10:35 AM   #7
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Wasn't expecting such disdain.
OK, so, My Jedi Powers that allow me Perceive the passage of electricity in my truck-- (your disdain met by my slight sarcasm)
Actually, yes... I do posses the ability hear electricity passing through the wires of my truck... before... I start the engine, and so do you actually. It is a very faint hum with both high and low timbres... It is more perceivable when living way out in the desert and sticks, like I currently do... without electricity, or running water. You don't know what True silence is, until you've experienced it... ... go camping for a week with no electricity, when you get back home, you'll notice the hum of your home, starting at the power lines, but also in the wires through the walls. (You'll notice the same thing if you've experienced Black or Brown outs in your city.) ... Well, that's kinda how I'm living. giving me the Jedi ability to hear electricity... LOL. Other than the sound... The HUD has an assortment of indicator lights telling us that the our vehicles are "On" and ready to start. Generally, Engine, Oil, Transmission, Parking Break, all these lights on the hud should turn on, when the Key is in the On position, if the engine is not running, in order to tell us that 1 the engine is ready to start, 2 that those light bulbs are functioning, and 3 that those systems are functioning properly if they turn off, when the engine starts...

When I say no perceivable power, I mean... I perceive no power.. I have not been able to check the voltage.. because My Multimeter is currently in storage (10 miles or so away), and I'm without transportation.
Hole lot of sense that makes right? I KNOW I KNOW!! &#@%ing #&%$!!


The HUD -- as mentioned, is "Heads Up Display." Of course the term is used more often in Aeronautics. and is displayed on a small glass pane... Well, Cars and pickups of the last hundred years, don't tend to travel near the speed of jets, nor do they send missiles and bombs to targeted structures or other vehicles. And therefore don't need project this information before you, as your driving. However, the HUD would relate most closely to the Tachymeter, Speedometer, and the assortment of indicator lights you see Beneath the windshield, also often termed "The Cluster," a term I dislike, for various reasons, but whatever.

Now, Despite the fact that the 88 manual v6 did not have a Tach, I would still call it a HUD, Because That version is definitely not "A Cluster" LOL.. well, the Automatic did have "A Cluster" Tachymeter And Speedometer, and other gauges.. My Pickup does not have a dashboard, And the HUD was pulled from an Automatic, Giving me the Awesome benefit of a Tachymeter... but That is neither here nor there.

Either way, Tach/Spedo, and indicator lights, (Engine, Transmision, Parking Break, battery light, Head Lights) -- The Cluster, otherwise known as HUD, shows no power for more than a microsecond, when the key is turned from Off to On. .. Instead I get One Solid click... And then nothing.

Now, no where did I ask anyone to Fix My problem. Instead I'm looking for guesses as to What can go wrong.. .. When the following temporary "repair.." .. is not done properly.

I was hoping you guys would get the hint that I placed near at the end. Basically, I'm pretty--nearly-almost sure, that the problem was the Primary Wire "fix".

Primary Wire -- defined as - The White Wire that leads from the Positive Battery terminal to the Fuse box.
Primary Wire replacement Backstory -- (Full story --> https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f123...fuse-298723/??)
( Shorter version )-- It seems that the previous owner replaced the Primary (Fuse Type Wire) with a regular wire of much smaller gauge, 20 or 22 gauge I'm sure.
The insulation on that wire burned and melted away, later the remaining bare copper wire itself just fell apart. I replaced that with 12 gauge wire (same gauge as the White portion.)
This apparently is a Bad fix, as it's supposed to be a "Fusible Link Wire."

I figured The Primary 80amp Fuse, -- The first Fuse in the Fuse box -- The black one which locks in place, should be enough to protect the system...
Well... I'm now concluding that I was wrong...
And I'm asking for help.

Last edited by Gregery; 07-14-2017 at 11:36 AM.
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Old 07-14-2017, 12:20 PM   #8
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Wasn't expecting such disdain.
I figured The Primary 80amp Fuse, -- The first Fuse in the Fuse box -- The black one which locks in place, should be enough to protect the system...
Well... I'm now concluding that I was wrong...
And I'm asking for help.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gregery View Post
Now, no where did I ask anyone to Fix My problem. Instead I'm looking for guesses as to What can go wrong...
So..... what do you want us to do....

It looks like you found a great place to start, which is at the "repair" that you KNOW needs fixing.

The thread you posted has good advice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RAD4Runner View Post
Restore to stock.
Find schematic for you're truck,
find out what current Fusible Link wire is rated at, Need to know what size.
Summit Racing has Fusible Link wire . People there should be able to help.
Philbert has thread on FL wire.
And to clear up any confusion, Toyota trucks do not have Heads Up Displays. They have "Combination meters" (as Toyota refers to them in the Factory Service Manual) or "gauge clusters" (the more generic term). Very few cars have heads up displays. At first, I thought you misspelled "head" as in "head lights".

Blue box is a Heads up Display which reflects a projected image off of the windshield; Red box is a gauge cluster where you look at the display directly (no reflection).



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Old 07-14-2017, 03:19 PM   #9
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Old 87, LOL... That last part literally made me laugh.
Yeah... Technically, you are completely correct. No HUD on the older Toyota Pickups..

By the way, Sorry about my previous, frustrated, snarky and sarcastic post. I really thought this was common terminology. "HUD and Primary wire."

But... whoa... that's an actual HUD in a car!! .. .. .. Yes, I live under a rock...
In My Day I tell you, we used to call the regular old basic instrument Cluster a HUD... .. Or maybe it's just a local thing, being that we got the Air Force base right here?? I don't know eh whatever.
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Old 07-14-2017, 04:16 PM   #10
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Ok, first I need to say this thread is surprisingly entertaining!

With that out of the way, yeah of course you could've damaged the main 80a fuse. Is your temporary wire fix burned anywhere or it's insulation harder than it was when you installed it? The wire might be bad or you could have a short somewhere and you'll really need a multimeter to find it rather than Jedi powers, unless you actually have Jedi powers for real. In that case, you can just float the vehicle down the road without any electrical power at all!

Oh, one more question. I assume you intend on replacing at least the main wire with a fusible link to see if you get power back. How do intend to do this if you can't travel anywhere even to get a multimeter to test things out? I hope it doesn't sound like I'm being a dick, but I really want to know how you're going to be able to fix this if you're stranded and can't leave your house...
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Old 07-15-2017, 07:24 AM   #11
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I walked.

Although I am fairly far from most anything, and my storage unit is actually half way on the other side of the city I was able to walk and get my voltage.

I check the voltage on the battery, 12.45 volts. - As I suspected and boost or a jump should not be necessary. I also disconnected the battery and checked the current for any shorts or circuit leaks, 2mA. So thats good as well.
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Old 07-15-2017, 08:07 AM   #12
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Red face

Sorry to hear you have no one that can help you out to give you a ride.

The HUD thing most have been a local thing I also thought it was a miss spelling of head light.

I would look at where you spliced the wire to be your problem.
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Old 07-15-2017, 09:00 AM   #13
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Any measure of battery voltage without loading the battery, is misleading, to worthless.

Even the deadest batteries are likely to show 12+ volts while standing idle.

As to hearing electricity, Sure, anybody can hear 60 cycle hum. DC???, I don't believe it.

Last edited by millball; 07-15-2017 at 09:02 AM.
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Old 07-15-2017, 09:12 AM   #14
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Any measure of battery voltage without loading the battery, is misleading, to worthless.

Even the deadest batteries are likely to show 12+ volts while standing idle.
Good point. My old battery showed 12.4 volts with the truck off and could be charged up to 12.7 volts on a trickle charger. However, i wouldn't fire up most of the time but one day I got it to start with my meter on hand. I don't remember the number anymore, but at idle it was much lower than it was supposed to be and a new battery solved the problem.

​​While you're at it, make sure all the ground wires look good at both ends. That was another issue that stumped me for awhile.
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Old 07-15-2017, 09:14 AM   #15
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Ah right I should have clarified. Battery is 12.45v disconnected. And still 12.45 when connected. And 12.44v connected with key in the on position.
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Old 07-15-2017, 09:16 AM   #16
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Any measure of battery voltage without loading the battery, is misleading, to worthless...
Exactly.

Quote:
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I check the voltage on the battery, 12.45 volts. - As I suspected and boost or a jump should not be necessary...
Now that we're clearly working on the same type of vehicle , AND we now have a multimeter, let's get cranking...

Gregery,
Let's start with a step that will not cost a penny, only a little time:
Make sure all connections to battery and body ground are bare, shiny metal tightly touching bare, shiny metal. Follow all the cables from the battery and see where they connect.

Then please help us see what you have in front of you, so we know what we are working with. A picture paints a thousand words. When you post a picture of the fuses in the fuse block next to the battery, we can show you how and where to check for power.

That wire you repaired is a fusible link wire. It should looks like this:


It should be connected to the fuse block this way (Does it look like that on yours?):
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Old 07-15-2017, 09:17 AM   #17
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Not that you can know right now, but I wonder what's the voltage while it's running?
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Old 07-15-2017, 10:04 AM   #18
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The grounds as far as I can tell are... Descent. Most everything has a protective layer of oil and grease.
(I Need to replace the oil pan gasket) but disconnecting the few grounds do reveal nice shiny Circles.

And the question previously not answered, yes the fusible link wire replacement does seem to be a bit more hard then when I installed it. However the line seems to be in good condition as well as the solder at the connection.

Last edited by Gregery; 07-15-2017 at 10:07 AM.
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Old 07-15-2017, 11:35 AM   #19
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...Most everything has a protective layer of oil and grease....disconnecting the few grounds do reveal nice shiny Circles.
Any coating may hide bad connections. Pls disconnect ALL and check for bare, shiny metal.

Quote:
And the question previously not answered, yes the fusible link wire replacement does seem to be a bit more hard then when I installed it. However the line seems to be in good condition as well as the solder at the connection.
"Seems" is not a guaranty.
Repeat: Please post picture of your fuses so we can show you where and how to probe for voltages.
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Old 07-15-2017, 02:44 PM   #20
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So my phone died on me while trying to diagnose... went to town to charge up, as well as allowing me to do more research, on an actual computer.
But it also started raining.
So.. when I get back out there, I'll take some (more) photographs. (including those ground points also.)
but I did get this image before the rain.
That Fusible link replacement. (I removed the electrical tape to show the condition of soldered connection.)

Last edited by Gregery; 07-15-2017 at 02:47 PM.
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