what axel to use
10-10-2009, 04:24 PM
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what axel to use
hello i have a 1990 toyota 4runner and i what to sas it but i dont know what axel would be easy to build and out off what? and what would the easy to do 4bar, leaf? 
10-11-2009, 12:15 AM
#2
Leaf spring would be the easiest conversion to do. It is a bit of work to get it done.
Do you really need to do an SA conversion? Ask yourself what kind of wheeling you are going to do. Etc.
A lot of times getting yourself some decent tires, a rear locker and some armor are great ways to start out.
AxleIke came up with a great thread a couple of years ago with recommendations for Newbie to avoid some of the costly mistakes some of us have made of the years, read his thread and learn from it
mine was paying for gears 2x's in one year because i changed my mind about tire size, 33's and 4.88's, 6 month later went to 35's and 5.29's BIG Mistake!
and I am sure you all have read how TC can wheel the you know what out of IFS:
As far as axles, A Toy mini truck axles, 79-85 is the easiest to use. 84-85 is the great choice as it is integral trusses built in, but they will all work.
here are some pics of what to look for:
Toyota Mini Truck Front Axle Identification
79-80 no gusset
81-83 short gusset (to u-bolts)
84-85 long gusset (past u-bolts)
ID Toyota Mini Truck axles
79-80 no gusset
81-83 short gusset (to u-bolts)
84-85 long gusset (past u-bolts)
Do you really need to do an SA conversion? Ask yourself what kind of wheeling you are going to do. Etc.
A lot of times getting yourself some decent tires, a rear locker and some armor are great ways to start out.
AxleIke came up with a great thread a couple of years ago with recommendations for Newbie to avoid some of the costly mistakes some of us have made of the years, read his thread and learn from it
mine was paying for gears 2x's in one year because i changed my mind about tire size, 33's and 4.88's, 6 month later went to 35's and 5.29's BIG Mistake!
After seeing a great many threads on here, I've decided to pitch in a thread that will hopefully help some of you newer guys out when you first start modifying your trucks.
Hopefully it will help you keep from making the same mistakes I did.
First of all, this is a post to try to help guys who want to modify their truck?s off-road performance, not so much for street cool looks. Don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with looking good, but looking good doesn't equal trail capability.
So, you've bought a 4x4 and you?d like to get some more off-road performance out of it. Awesome. Probably, you are thinking about a lift, right? Please forget about it.
Here is a saying that has been around the net for quite a while: What is cool on the internet or on the street is seldom what is cool on the trail.
The order of importance for different modifications on your truck is as follows.
1. Drivetrain
2. Armor
3. Tires
4. Suspension
Yes, suspension is the least important part of a truck. Why? Because they all accomplish the same thing, which is moving your tires over the terrain. They will get you about as far down the trail as stock. Granted, an otherwise stock truck that has been solid axle swapped with good flex will go farther than a stock IFS truck, but not a ton.
Sooooo, what I?m getting at here is hardware. Hardware makes your truck go. If you are looking to spend some money on a truck, your first consideration should be lockers. Perhaps you can only afford one for the rear, that is fine, get it. Gears are usually recommended when installing lockers, but it isn?t mandatory. If you decide to gear lower in the future, it will cost you an extra 200 for installation that you won?t have to pay if you have them done first off. But that is personal choice. It really depends on what size tire you want to run.
Gears are the next important step, as lower gearing means slower going on the trail. This gives you better control, better torque, and saves clutches. It also involves less ?slamming? up stuff by having to give the truck a lot of skinny pedal. This involves usually two important parts of the vehicle. Differential gearing involves replacing your ring and pinion gears in the differential itself, and is usually a balance of your on road performance with bigger tires. Larger tires will slow a truck down considerably. Regearing the diffs will allow you to keep a more stock feel while running a larger tire. The second step is regearing and/or doubling the transfer case. This provides a much greater ability to crawl or go slow on the trail. For example, a stock drive train (stock transfer case with a reduction of 2.28:1, manual transmission with a 3.95:1 first gear ration, and stock diff gears of 4.1:1) has a crawl ratio of 37:1. With doubled cases and gearing, trucks can get down to 225:1. It is a big difference. Again, benefits are control and less damage by being able to keep the speed down.
Next is armor. Usually, it is recommended that this be done fairly quickly after lockers and gears are installed, as increasing the difficulty of the trails you can drive up will increase the likelihood of body damage. Sliders, bumpers, and underbelly skid plates are all highly recommended. Get what fits your budget, but remember, with all things, you get what you pay for.
Tires are the next thing to look to. There are many threads about brands, sizes, etc. You can choose what you like best. Really, it?s about traction here. What type of wheeling do you see the most? Mud, sand, rocks? I recommend getting the largest size you can get with none, or minor rubbing. Minor rubbing usually occurs on the pinch welds in the fender, and can be easily pounded flat to gain the necessary clearance to eliminate rubbing, and does not affect the cosmetic look of the truck. Tires are the only real way to get ground clearance under your differentials. Lift will leave the axles in the same place as they were. Tires will get your diffs over rocks. In addition, it is important to get a tire that is going to take some abuse. Again, I refer you to the search function on that, so you can make your own decision on brand and genre of tire, as I?m as biased as the rest when it comes to tire choice.
Lastly, look to the suspension.
Here is the deal. If you have put in gearing, lockers, armor, and good tires on a truck, you will be able to drive most of the trails in your area, especially if you?ve ponied up for two lockers. If you have IFS, a suspension lift will get you bigger tires if you really start working your fenders with a sawzall and hammer, and a body lift will get you tires without the need for fender modification, but you?ll still have the crappy flex, and the other issues associated with IFS. Believe it or not, but IFS, especially the early (86-95) IFS, works best stock. No lift, no nothing. In fact, early IFS usually starts to puke steering parts with any sort of lift that changes the steering angles.
In invite you to look up TC, who is a member here. He has a 2nd gen 4runner, and simply has two ARB lockers, and a bunch of armor. No lift, and he runs a 33x1050 tire on it. Minor pinch weld modification and he runs these tires with little or no rubbing. With this set up, he is able to tackle the most difficult trails Colorado has to offer. Check out some of his videos. Now, TC is an AMAZING driver, but even a novice would be able to tackle most trails with the same set up.
If this has all been a jumble of words to you, here are the take home points.
If all you are looking for is to be able to go out and wheel trails with confidence and get up harder obstacles, DO NOT look to your suspension to help you there. Look to the stuff you can?t see.
If you want to look cool driving around town, and aren?t really concerned about getting any farther up the trail than you did before, you just want to look cool while doing it, then look to a lift and monster tires.
Questions are appreciated, post if you have em. Good luck with your builds.
Hopefully it will help you keep from making the same mistakes I did.
First of all, this is a post to try to help guys who want to modify their truck?s off-road performance, not so much for street cool looks. Don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with looking good, but looking good doesn't equal trail capability.
So, you've bought a 4x4 and you?d like to get some more off-road performance out of it. Awesome. Probably, you are thinking about a lift, right? Please forget about it.
Here is a saying that has been around the net for quite a while: What is cool on the internet or on the street is seldom what is cool on the trail.
The order of importance for different modifications on your truck is as follows.
1. Drivetrain
2. Armor
3. Tires
4. Suspension
Yes, suspension is the least important part of a truck. Why? Because they all accomplish the same thing, which is moving your tires over the terrain. They will get you about as far down the trail as stock. Granted, an otherwise stock truck that has been solid axle swapped with good flex will go farther than a stock IFS truck, but not a ton.
Sooooo, what I?m getting at here is hardware. Hardware makes your truck go. If you are looking to spend some money on a truck, your first consideration should be lockers. Perhaps you can only afford one for the rear, that is fine, get it. Gears are usually recommended when installing lockers, but it isn?t mandatory. If you decide to gear lower in the future, it will cost you an extra 200 for installation that you won?t have to pay if you have them done first off. But that is personal choice. It really depends on what size tire you want to run.
Gears are the next important step, as lower gearing means slower going on the trail. This gives you better control, better torque, and saves clutches. It also involves less ?slamming? up stuff by having to give the truck a lot of skinny pedal. This involves usually two important parts of the vehicle. Differential gearing involves replacing your ring and pinion gears in the differential itself, and is usually a balance of your on road performance with bigger tires. Larger tires will slow a truck down considerably. Regearing the diffs will allow you to keep a more stock feel while running a larger tire. The second step is regearing and/or doubling the transfer case. This provides a much greater ability to crawl or go slow on the trail. For example, a stock drive train (stock transfer case with a reduction of 2.28:1, manual transmission with a 3.95:1 first gear ration, and stock diff gears of 4.1:1) has a crawl ratio of 37:1. With doubled cases and gearing, trucks can get down to 225:1. It is a big difference. Again, benefits are control and less damage by being able to keep the speed down.
Next is armor. Usually, it is recommended that this be done fairly quickly after lockers and gears are installed, as increasing the difficulty of the trails you can drive up will increase the likelihood of body damage. Sliders, bumpers, and underbelly skid plates are all highly recommended. Get what fits your budget, but remember, with all things, you get what you pay for.
Tires are the next thing to look to. There are many threads about brands, sizes, etc. You can choose what you like best. Really, it?s about traction here. What type of wheeling do you see the most? Mud, sand, rocks? I recommend getting the largest size you can get with none, or minor rubbing. Minor rubbing usually occurs on the pinch welds in the fender, and can be easily pounded flat to gain the necessary clearance to eliminate rubbing, and does not affect the cosmetic look of the truck. Tires are the only real way to get ground clearance under your differentials. Lift will leave the axles in the same place as they were. Tires will get your diffs over rocks. In addition, it is important to get a tire that is going to take some abuse. Again, I refer you to the search function on that, so you can make your own decision on brand and genre of tire, as I?m as biased as the rest when it comes to tire choice.
Lastly, look to the suspension.
Here is the deal. If you have put in gearing, lockers, armor, and good tires on a truck, you will be able to drive most of the trails in your area, especially if you?ve ponied up for two lockers. If you have IFS, a suspension lift will get you bigger tires if you really start working your fenders with a sawzall and hammer, and a body lift will get you tires without the need for fender modification, but you?ll still have the crappy flex, and the other issues associated with IFS. Believe it or not, but IFS, especially the early (86-95) IFS, works best stock. No lift, no nothing. In fact, early IFS usually starts to puke steering parts with any sort of lift that changes the steering angles.
In invite you to look up TC, who is a member here. He has a 2nd gen 4runner, and simply has two ARB lockers, and a bunch of armor. No lift, and he runs a 33x1050 tire on it. Minor pinch weld modification and he runs these tires with little or no rubbing. With this set up, he is able to tackle the most difficult trails Colorado has to offer. Check out some of his videos. Now, TC is an AMAZING driver, but even a novice would be able to tackle most trails with the same set up.
If this has all been a jumble of words to you, here are the take home points.
If all you are looking for is to be able to go out and wheel trails with confidence and get up harder obstacles, DO NOT look to your suspension to help you there. Look to the stuff you can?t see.
If you want to look cool driving around town, and aren?t really concerned about getting any farther up the trail than you did before, you just want to look cool while doing it, then look to a lift and monster tires.
Questions are appreciated, post if you have em. Good luck with your builds.
Personally, I would do sliders/skids before gears lockers, but AxleIke's thought process is dead on.
Here's what lockers will do for you - no way you make this obstacle with open diffs.
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGt2ZwFZKPU[/YOUTUBE]
Here's what lockers will do for you - no way you make this obstacle with open diffs.
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGt2ZwFZKPU[/YOUTUBE]
here are some pics of what to look for:
Toyota Mini Truck Front Axle Identification
79-80 no gusset
81-83 short gusset (to u-bolts)
84-85 long gusset (past u-bolts)
ID Toyota Mini Truck axles
79-80 no gusset
81-83 short gusset (to u-bolts)
84-85 long gusset (past u-bolts)
Last edited by rworegon; 08-14-2014 at 06:04 PM.
10-11-2009, 09:35 PM
#3
op: here is another thread to read:
https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f120...as-kit-191985/
https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f120...as-kit-191985/
Last edited by rworegon; 08-14-2014 at 06:04 PM.
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