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Ok to some advice from you wise Toyota pick up owners out there. I used to modify and drive Suzuki Samurai's back when I was into Rock Crawling. I got out of that, but still had a Samurai. I decided I wanted a clean daily driver so I removed the lift went back stock mnus a few performance uprades. I guess I am getting old but after a few years the cold weather, noise, and uncomfortableness of the Samurai began to weigh on me. So I sold it, but I still wanted a simple little tough as nails 4wd to drive around. So I stared looking for a Toyota single cab pick up. After looking at about 25 trashed out over priced trucks, I found a pretty clean 94 single cab, 22re 5 speed 4wd with AC.The owner claimed that the motor had been rebuilt which I tried to be diligent about, even calling the shop that did the rebuild. The guy also told me that he had replaced the radiator, alternator, and water pump. That should have been a red flag, that he had been throwing parts at this thing, but the truck drove well and was super clean so I bought it. The next morning I started it and it smoked for about 5 minutes at idle, well so much for the rebuilt motor. A couple days later the AC quit, a month later the starter went out, it uses about a half a quart of oil a week, and last week the engine began to miss on cyl #3 and it smokes pretty good at idle, the IFS pops when you reverse with the wheels cranked. So I'm pretty bummed, but you get what you pay for and I still think I made out okay, it's still a clean truck and has yet to completely quit me. And hell, its a 22 year old truck with 300,000 miles on it what do I expect.
But here is the deal. If I am going to have to work on something, I wanna enjoy working on it. The little Samurai was a joy to tinker with, everything was light, simple, and easy to get to. A few months back the Toyota started cutting out a bit so I changed the fuel filter. What a stupid place to put a consumable part, never wanting to do that again I relocated it to the inner fender. The IFS and AC parts make removing the starter a real PIA and I still cant figure out why the battery and brake light wont go off. The alternator charges fine and he brake reserviour is full.
I also have had a few vehicles in my life that are just never right, we used to say they must have been built on a friday. Perhaps this truck has had parts slung at it its whole life and the PO just got tired of it. So I was thinking about selling the Toyota and buying a pre 1985 with a solid front axle and a carburetor. But after researching for the past few days on forums like this it seems to say that EFI is a hundred times better than a carb, and the IFS will be fine on small tire truck. Plus if I start shopping for another Toyota I will most likely not find a truck as clean as this one on my budget.
What do yall think? I want easy to work on, tough as nails, warm in the winter, and can keep up with traffic.
I love the carbed trucks over all the efi garbage. I just rebuilt the top end of my 89 and almost went to carb. A buddy plumbed the vac lines or I would have thrown the efi away. On my 86 I removed the efi cause I continued to have issues and don't throw parts at something I know nothing about. I threw an old intake, Weber, put a fuel pump eccentric in and the truck has gone another 400k in my sons care. Finding any of these old trucks that haven't been band aided together like we live in Cuba or something is a task. Then the cream puff that someone has, they're asking a million bucks.
I say carb All the way if you just enjoy simplicity as I do. My .02
Last edited by flg8r22; 08-13-2017 at 09:07 AM.
Reason: Correction
Yeah, that is the issue with looking for another truck. It is amazing the abuse these things endure yet still hold their value. I looked at one for $3500 that just seemed off, I kept looking at it and realized that the gap between the bed and cab was uneven. I crawled underneath and the frame was bent in half. I stopped to look at a 91 4wd that was super clean he wanted $6500 for it and all he had done was paint it. The good deals are on the 2wd trucks. You can get a low mileage 22re 2wd for less than $2000. I wonder if the best way to buy a new motor is to buy a low mileage 2wd.
Most folks who wheel more than just forest roads and such prefer EFI over carb. Carbs give problems at high angles and while bouncing that EFI does not.
That's why you see so many carbed crawlers converted to propane.
I'll never again buy any carbed motor vehicle, if I can help it. Well except for old motorcycles, and maybe a Model T Ford.
22RE EFI is not so complicated. You just have to set them up as the engineers intended. It's a mistake to try to delete stuff, or 'do it my way'.
I have owned over 30 of these trucks in some shape or form. They are all loaded with problems. The 22 motor is really simple once you learn the tricks to them. If you start at the front and work your way to the rear on all of the systems and use factory parts in most cases, you can have a solid truck. It is not just Toyotas but any 20-30 year old truck. These trucks seem to get a lot more neglect as they were a good truck in their day and can still be but it takes some work to get them back into shape.
As far as carb (22r) or EFI (22re) it can be a matter of preference. I like the ease of a 22r to work on but favor the EFI for everyday use in most cases. A new to me EFI truck requires a few hundred dollars and a good 4-5 hours of work to get everything cleaned up from the carbon build up, new sensors in most cases, and hoses replaced. Not all the sensors need replaced but I would bet the TPS and O2 sensor will need replaced.
I bought my '85 4Runner dlx for similar reasons. It's such a rugged, bare-bones suv with a well-designed EFI system. The computer and engine harness haven't given me any trouble, but many other things needed attention.
In the last 5 years I've replaced most of the sensors, the battery, starter and alternator, many original rubber parts, shocks and steering stabilizer, cooling system, full exhaust, clutch and hydraulics, and did a full top-to-bottom engine rebuild with a new head.
It's 32 years old so it's not an unusual amount of work for it to need, but it's something to think about when buying a high-mileage old truck.
If I were to do it all over, I'd consider a later model with IFS for better road manners. But even with leaf springs and solid axles, it's still a more comfortable ride than a Samurai.
To be honest, it is difficult to give a recommendation on what vehicle to buy. The older (1995 or older) 22R and 22R-E were known to be very reliable and easy to work on. I only say these trucks WERE known to be very reliable because these trucks are OLD now and need attention, either from neglect or just age. They can be very reliable if some work is put back into them. I am not knocking on these trucks. I absolutely LOVE them, but that is the reality of any vehicle this age.
I do not think that carburetors are better than EFI or EFI systems are better than carburetors. BOTH have been proven to work very well. I like carburetors, but I am studying mechanical engineering and carburetors are mechanical. It really comes down to what you are most comfortable with working on when something goes wrong.
The bare bones, base model 2WD trucks are the easiest to work on, but are not very comfortable, especially with the bench seats. Newer trucks will typically be more reliable, and more comfortable but the engine bay has more "stuff" that could be in the way during repairs.
What type of truck are you looking for?
Do you want/need 4WD?
Do you want simplicity or comfort? A compromise of both?
I am sorry to hear about your current truck. That must be an awful feeling.
I'm an "old guy" who has driven and raced carburetor cars since the 70s (1970s). I had to learn how to fix a Rochester 2 BBL on my first car and it was fairly easy. So I did them for friends and converted an old Chevy to a 3 x 2 drag car and could do the 2BBLs with my eyes closed. I eventually did similar with the Weber 32/36. Many people don't invest the time to learn and tune carbs properly - they just want to bolt it on and expect magic. You see that as complaints about the carb and poor MPGs.
I should/could learn EFI similarly but I am quite comfortable with carbs. From what I've read there are guys here who know/understand EFI very well so I'm picking up on it. I just don't have an EFI vehicle . . . YET.
Im looking for simple, 4wd, easy to work on, relatively comfortable. I dont need lots of gadgets(power windows,cruise blah blah). I dont need a super flexy rock crawler on 38"s . I dont need to pull heavy loads or run 80 down the freeway. I do want to commute 10 miles to work everyday, haul my kayak to the river and my mountain bikes to the trail. I want to take my wife garage saleing with out putting her in a bad mood. And every once in a while hook up my 10 ft utility trailer to pick up that lawnmower I bought on craigslist, or those cute little goats my daughter had to have. Yet still be cool enough to make me feel juvenile every once in a while. 😁
If you look from 79-94, the trucks frame all look very similar and for the most part all built the same other then the front axle on the 79-83. I like the 84-88 trucks the best but in my opinion I feel the 89-94 trucks tend to ride better. I have owned two different 3rd gen trucks and the extended cab rode completely different and a much better ride or the standard cab. I liked my 89 standard cab but the 91 extended cab was the comfy mobile.
The newer you go the more the emissions they added to them. Mostly just more vacuum lines and Vacuum Switches.
You can gain a little more info if you give each cylinder a good shot of oil and test a second time. If it's notably higher it's probably rings/cylinder walls. If about the same, it's valves.
I had a dead cylinder that held only 100 lbs dry, but up to 130 lbs wet. Sure enough, on tear-down not only was the top ring broke in 3, it was missing an inch-long piece that chewed up the piston before it shot out the exhaust valve.
You will have to look around but I prefer to have my alternators rebuilt at my local mom and pops shop. The rebuilt alternators at your local parts stores are not rebuilt the best at all and I have had them bad out of the box.
Low compression on cylinder #3 hopefully is just in the head and not in the block issue.
Funny, Ok Ill stay away. I told myself on my way to look at the truck that if this deal didnt work out that its a sign and Ill just keep my 94. Guess Ill just learn to work with the IFS and EFI. al
Glad you want to keep your 94, I think it'll suit your needs well. It'll cost more money than you hoped, but if you rebuild that engine (and might get away with top end rebuild) and replace a few suspension parts, you'll wind up with a truck you love for many years.
08-13-2017, 08:14 AM
