does anyone know the stock gearing on the 4th gen 4runners? i would imagine they are the same in both model years. i could not find this info on toyota's website, nor in the owner's manual (repair manuals are on the way -- $100 on ebay!). and corollary to that question is: w/35s should i consider re-gearing (assuming stock gearing is less than 5.29)? has anyone heard from billy? he could probably answer this better than anyone as i have not heard of another 4th gen w/larger than 33s.

 

also, ahriman, you can pay $10 for 24hours at:
http://techinfo.toyota.com
where you can download any/all parts of the manual.



also ... billy has more lift than just the 3" revtek ... so unless you go crazy on yours, i think you'll find that 33s are hard enough to fit.

do you have your lift, ahriman?

 

The ratio for the V8 diff is pretty tall 3.727. Also 5.29 seems a bit of an overkill if you go from 31" to 35" wheels only 13% bigger. 4.1 would probably be better.

Go here http://pressroom.toyota.com/presstxt...34runner_s.pdf

I believe billy hasn't regeared with the big wheels, and seemed to be fine with it.

 

hmm. this is something i would think would be in the repair manuals, maybe not...

 

yeah, i decided that i would just own the set. i kinda like getting the manual greasy...

i am ordering from wheelersoffroad on monday. i will get the revtek lift in front and a revtek spacer for the rear, the 16" steel wheels and probably shocks (did you keep your stock shocks?). i will also order the downey coilovers for the rear on monday and then get a fab shop in town here to do the spacer mod of billy's. i am going to try for about the 4" he and lance got in front, and play w/35" shoes.

 

well, I had to keep my rear shocks because I have xreas ...

I am thinking of doing what billy did as well, but I dunno yet. timber was asking them about it, and lance and billy were giving him very mixed answers about whether it was okay or dangerous to do that.



you know, my kit came with the shocks even though i didn't want them ... that was from wheeler's ... so i don't think you really have a choice whether you'll get the shocks or not - i think you automatically receive the shocks, as they are part of the price of the kit. but, if for some reason you can get the spacers and not have to pay for the shocks, i'd be more than happy to send you mine for free since i can't use them.

let me know.

you're soooo lucky you can fit those 16" wheels, and i can't wait to see pics so i can live vicariously.

 

ahriman - did you see bulldog's post? he linked to a file that shows the gear info (i think) ... see:

 

Are you guys sure that the 16" wheels that Wheelers Offroad offers will fit? Their backspacing is only 4" so I'm just wondering. I know their 16" wheels will work on the 3rd gen but I'm abit skeptical for the 4th gens (out specs are diff...) It would be nice if they would test it on a 4th gen (both on sr5 and sports) just to ensure. You guys wouldn't want to get screwed after the fact that you have the wheels and it doesn't clear the calipers.

Downey does not have a rear coilover (coilovers are coils + shock combo that are adjustable). Downey does have some rear coils though btw. Lifting beyond the 3" mark is not recommended but if you really want to do it, make sure you extend the brake/ABS lines (Critical). W/o doing that you'll definitely have problems once the lines snap! Safety First.

As for all the craziness on the 35's. All I can stress is that if you plan to do any offroading with 35's (MT) then you will rub if not destroy some of the body parts. With 285's (33's MT/R) rubbing was severe so just be careful. Billy's setup on the 35's was using A/T which is smaller than the M/T's so be very careful. 35's will definitely look sweet but w/o ALOT of cutting (not just trimming) you will have a difficult time driving.

And as for re-gearing, Billy is still running on stock gears. Power loss should be significant as even w/ 285's it is apparent of somw power loss. Also the spedo/trip will be significantly off too If you plan to re-gear you definitely are looking at $$$ which at that point, you might as well add a locker at the sametime since it'll cost the same to install. Expect $$$ for labor alone. I believe the stock gears are 3.71 but I'd have to confirm it by looking at the manual when I get home. 5.29 gears will definitely be too much and should be looking at 4.1 like Bulldog as stated.

Keep in mind that all of these questions are great but we are all in uncharted territories so we all must take great caution before taking the plunge. Document everything btw

GOod luck!

 

Yeah ... Lance makes good points, all the time!

I dunno if those wheels will fit, I'm almost sure that they will not fit on the '03 Sport (because we have the larger brakes) but I'm also worried that they might not fit on ahriman's truck either.

35s ... as I stated in post #3, 35s will be difficult to fit, and require a lot of work to fit them and run them well. even the 33s will be difficult, but 35s ... man, I just don't know if that would work. I know Billy is running big tires, but he also has more than 3" of lift.

 

lance, last i spoke to downey (about 3 weeks ago), they had the coils and were deciding on doetsch tech or another for the shocks for the rear, do you know if they have no shock yet?!?! i will be calling them tomorrow, i will find out then. and i am depending on billy's setup here for the amount of lift. i think he mentions that the angle he has put the cv joint at stress is around 10 degrees w/his current lift. i will probably not be much beyond 3" in back anyway, the lift in front will determine this -- i will see where the revtek + billy larger spacer gets me first.

as for the 16" wheels, the guy at wheelers (cannot remember his name right now...) told me they would fit a 4th gen sr5. if they do not, hopefully he will be standup about it since he made the statement. and believe me, i will be working the people at the tire store for all the experimenting they can handle before they kick me out and tell me not to come back...

yeah, 5.29 gearing would probably be extreme since stock is at 3.7. guess i was assuming already that stock would be at 4.1. i am already thinking about lockers btw...and so i would do it all at once, depending on how the power is after lift/tires.

4route/tracy (you still have not told me if this is your name, maybe you want to be mysterious about it...)- bulldog's link did not work for me, but i will trust what he said is true about stock gearing. thanks for the kind offer of the shocks, i will talk w/wheelers and see if they can swing me a good deal on shocks first though since i am going to be buying a bundle from them. thinking abbout ranchos at the moment, but i will talk it out w/them.

 

coils and coilovers are different (that's what I was trying to get at).

Coils = coils
coilovers = suspension component which includes coils and shocks in which the height is adjustable.

Downey should have the rear kit available and for sale. The rear kit will include shocks (Doestsch Tech 10"), coil, stainless steel brake lines. You can just ask for the coil and just get whatever shock you want if you don't like the DT's. Just have to order the right type (housing top/bottom)

Becareful on how much lift you want as the higher you go, the higher your cog gets. Also the higher you go, the more problems you run into. I can't stress how lifting an extreme amount can cause severe problems. GOod luck in your adventures.

Re-gearing: There are no front lockers btw. Just the rear (which is the RD23 - same ol lockers from 3rd gens etc etc). If you plan to re-gear, you'll have to do the front and rear together if you have the v8 model. Also keep in mind that if you plan to get a front locker later, installation will cost the same amount as just installing the new gears.

As for the guys at wheelers. I have not personally done business with them so I can't comment except they have some great stuff I would not take their word on the wheel working for the 4th gen. Our wheels are almost 5" backspacing along w/ the 25mm offset (i think it's 25mm... read it somewhere). Their 16" states 4" BS so caution is key. If they have told ya that if it doesn't fit, they'll take it back, make sure you get your shipping fees back too. I would get that documented so they don't screw you over after the fact (just watching out for ya).

Lastly, if you thinking about 35's with the MT tires. Expecting rubbing the front and rear bumpers. Also expect cladding rubbage as well. With my 285's I was rubbing like no tomorrow with my stock bumpers. I'm assuming that with 35's rubbing will be more like ripping

Also you might want to look into getting some new upper a-arms from inland trucks. They're the only company that has em right now so until some other mfg's make em you're kinda stuck with them.

 

oh, wow, glad you persisted w/that distinction because i was assuming that if i got the coils and the shocks from them that they would be adjustable -- so there is a third component that i was not aware of (the "adjuster"). you are correct downey does have both coils and shocks and they come w/the brake lines and mounting hardware -- just got off the phone w/them. so that makes the current setup they have a static one until they gear up for a full production run. i assume that they will have the adjustability built in at that time?

arb's website has a .pdf which confirms what you say about the lockers -- drag -- so i will probably hold off until they have front and rear, we will see.

i talked w/inland arms about a week ago and told them they need to produce the same setup they have for the tacomas for the 4runners (the complete a-arm uniball w/upper and lower w/coilovers). he kind of chuckled and said yeah. but i will probably mooch off your setup and hard work and just set it up similar to yours.

one question i have for you: you are using the daystar spacer in the rear in addition to the downey coils, do you think a rev-tek spacer will be ok for the extra lift? i want to get everything at once through wheelers and since i will be getting the rev-tek kit from them i want to get an extra set of spacers at the same time.

and hey, thanx for watching out for me!

 

Most members don't have adjustable lift. The cost is soo great that most people settle for just a coil and shock combo setup or even for the less expensive spacer setup.

Coilovers are available for the front (to adjust the height) but are only beneficial for those with added weight (i.e. bumpers/winches etc etc) as the more weight added, the greater the sag. Thus coilovers are useful. Ofcourse coilovers are a step up in the coil/shock combo though in terms of performance but for the most of us, we really won't notice the difference.

The rears are not adjustable and won't be unless you really start fabbing up crap to incorporate coilovers (good luck here... you'll be a rare breed). Everyone's rear (no pun intended ) are shock/coil combo or spacers. Some combination of something like that. Downey should have a full production version available as the rear kit is for sale. Like I said before, if you want their coils only, then you can order them w/o the shock but if you want the shock too, then you can do that as well. Plan on getting the kit though as it'll include the brake line extension. (important).

ARB is abit slow on their lockers so I doubt we'll see front lockers for awhile. I'm waiting until the front is available .... expecting to wait for a year atleast. o well.

Inland truck only has the upper a-arm (uniball) for our 4runner. They DO NOT have any lower arms nor do they have any coilovers. Our 4th gen is not the same as the previous 3rd gen 4runner or the current tacoma. They do have the upper a-arms available so ask them for that one piece only. They will laugh at you if you ask for anything else. This item is an option is not necessarily required but good if you plan to do alot of offroading. But for the average joe, I think it's not really cost effective. This item itself is over $500 so (i think 650 or something like that) so its alot to ask for... yikes!

I added the daystar rear as the weight of the rear bumper and tire carrier along w/ the hilift was soo great that even with the Downey coil I lost 2"!!! Adding the rear spacer gave me back 2" but it looks like I'm starting to sag in the rear again

I'm not sure how much lift you want in the back as the rear isn't the limitation factor here. The front is your limitation so if you up the rear too much you'll be riding a$$ high... (which looks pretty ugly). I think the revtek kit should be fine as everyone is running those with out any problems. The revtek kit will give you abit more lift than the Daystar so I'd say go that route since you're wanting to lift it alot...

Some side comments:
Both Revtek and Daystar kits are great! I've seen both kits on the 4th gen and have installed both of them and can say both kicks a$$. The only difference will be the technology used behind both mfg's.

Personally speaking I like Daystar's setup over Revtek as the spacer is placed outside of the coil and shock so your feel and the physics will stay stock. Revtek's setup uses spacers in the shock with the coil which means more compression on the coil. I feel that this will give you a harsher ride but since you're lifted you're expected some harshness in any lift.

If you're looking to do the Billy lift, then you'll definitely want to go with the Revtek setup. This is because Revtek's kit has a 2 piece spacer where you add the primary spacer in the shock with the coil and a smaller spacer on top of the top plate. This is where Billy changed the size of the top plate by making a taller piece. When you do this you gain more lift. Ofcourse the sky is the limit but keep in mind the limitation on the cv's below.

I'd say start slow and upgrade slowly. Go with the Revtek kit since you want a full 3" lift. Then get the 285's. You won't have to re-gear asap as you should be fine. Do the necessary trimming (if you get the MT tires vs the AT tires) and drive it on the trails and learn your 4runner. Learn the limitation on your truck before you really take it places where you're not comfortable. You will be utterly surprised how far you can go in the stock trim. Ofcourse if you take it too far you'll encounter body damages like I have... (stupid me!)

Once you master your 4runner on the trails using the 3" lift and 285's and feel the necessity to upgrade so you can push the limits even more, then look into 35" wheels along w/ more lift or something (not sure exactly what it'll take to get 35" yet... still learning...) Until then, I'd say enjoy your 4runner and just have fun!

GOod luck

 

Great post, Lance

 

Lance ... I have the Revtek, ya know, and it actually doesn't make the ride any stiffer than it was before. The ride feels stock to me, well, other than the fact that the tires are no longer over-inflated to 54psi.

 

well the fact that the downey rear kit is not adjustable now changes my thinking. this whole time, i was under the impression it is adjustable, and i could go up or down as needed to keep the ride level. i will be adding a bumper shortly, and so do need the extra lift in front, at least i will soon. hmm. it looks like i will need to do manual adjustments w/fabbed spacers when i add the bumper. dilemma dilemma, thought i had it figgered out! and btw: downey said that they have finally gotten an agreement w/bilstein and the kits will not be available until at least beginning of summer.

i know that there is no upper/lower and coilover from inland trucks, that is why i said he just chuckled. you are right the upper a-arms are about $650.

so given all this, specifically the lack of adjustability on the downey rear kit, it seems that going w/the full rev-tek (i like rev-tek's technology, in theory, more than daystar's) kit and fabbing some top spacers might be the way to go initially.

[sigh] i miss the days of my '69 bronco ... no lift, all stock, and could run over any mountain, hill, mudbog or bump! (but i gotta admit: love my 4runner...)

thanx for your candor and input lance

 

Michael, I'm just here to help everyone especially the 4th genners We're getting way too much crap for our stock low rider appearance. There is more than meets the eye on our rigs that people just don't understand. If only they sat in a stock 4th gen and went on some crazy trails, they'll be surprised at how well it handles. Most definitely can do alot more than it is currently recognized. Also, alot of the 4th gens are rather hesitant to take it to it's upper limits

Good luck in your adventures and next time I'm up in your neck of the woods, I'll make sure you drop you a line Now hurry up and build your 4runner so we can all drool!

 

Sorry to bring this thread back up, but have any of you heard of anyone with the Protech lift on the 4th gen? Talked to a guy there tonight about getting some to try... Kit for 3" front and rear is around $300. Any thoughts?

 

Haven't heard anything from them on the 4th Gens. What is included in the lift kit?

 

Haven't heard anything either ... but, in case someone has!