kirkerik

So it had not worn through the TC cover by the time you repaired it? Any idea how long the TC can run on the aluminum cover before total failure?

kirkerik

I have heard success storys without removing either the head or the oil pan but i'm thinking of doing the head gasket and oil pan while i,m in the timing cover. I know the oil pan leaks and i suspect that my coolant leak might be in the HG.

It's just where do i stop? I have a 2wd winter ride now to get me by so i have more time to do this fix right...

That front diff is definately in the way. I read on here somewhere about doing the oil pan on a 4wd without removing as much stuff. I'll be sure to check your link, thanks.

If that oil pan is not leaking it might be worth a try, if the pan were to leak then you could always pull it after the TC is done. Am i right about that?

Streetgrinder

I think that makes sense. I'll try to sneak the timing cover in without doing the pan, and then if it starts leaking later, it will still be the same job. There's no incentive to do it as part of the timing cover job, if I don't have to.

JJ'89

Correct, it had not worn through yet, but the grooves were at least 1/8" deep...looked like a couple of parallel cuts with a milling machine. No idea how much longer until it wore through. The aluminum particles/shaving apparently cause no harm, cuz it doesn't smoke or burn oil, and it runs like a top...

lobukbuild

i highly recomend removing the oil pan while doing a t chain! all those plastic shavings from the old guide, that someone said not to worry about, are getting stuck in your oil pick up screen and blocking oil flow and lowering the oil pressure. its not hard to do and ive always been able to get the pan out by lowering the front diff and letting it hang on the cv axles and lower control arms. clean and degrease the surfaces well and use permatec ultra black rtv w/o a gasket for reassembly.tighten per instructions on the back off the package of the rtv. removing the pan can be tricky, i use a few metel putty knives that ive sharpened by firmly but carefully driving them between the block and pan until the pan breaks free. fyi when removing the tc cover dont forget the secret hidden bolt that goes thru the head and into the tc cover.

lobukbuild

i highly recomend removing the oil pan while doing a t chain! all those plastic shavings from the old guide, that someone said not to worry about, are getting stuck in your oil pick up screen and blocking oil flow and lowering the oil pressure. its not hard to do and ive always been able to get the pan out by lowering the front diff and letting it hang on the cv axles and lower control arms. clean and degrease the surfaces well and use permatec ultra black rtv w/o a gasket for reassembly.tighten per instructions on the back off the package of the rtv. removing the pan can be tricky, i use a few metel putty knives that ive sharpened by firmly but carefully driving them between the block and pan until the pan breaks free. fyi when removing the tc cover dont forget the secret hidden bolt that goes thru the head and into the tc cover.

Streetgrinder

My friend who's a mechanic gave me a trick for taking off the timing cover independently. Which is to loosen the bolts on the oil pan, back 3 additional bolts on each side, back from the two front ones you have to remove to get the cover off. That way I tapped downward on a piece of 1x2" pine to loosen the cover. He also suggested spraying the head gasket and oil pan gasket with some brake cleaner, and carefully scraping where you want the gaskets to release, adjacent to the timing cover. The cover was stubborn, but I got it off of there. He also suggested I use a short screwdriver in the bolt holes on the passenger's side of the cover for leverage, when working the cover outward. I used a large tapered drift instead, and it worked well. On the driver's side, you can grip the water outlet, and try not to break it.
Got the cover off, so far.

lobukbuild

at this point its only a few more bolts to take it off and clean the pan and pick up screen. well worth the effort to save your bearings and alot less effort than replacing your motor

aztoyman

If you're going to pull the head and oil pan to do a timing chain you have so much off the engine you're almost at a complete tear down. You may as well just pull the engine and stick it on an engine stand.

You'll have better access and be less likely to screw up and have a leak when your done.

If your head gasket IS leaking, you MAY have to have the block decked anyway.

I know I know.........where do you stop. If you got a ton of miles and have to do a head gasket and timing chain your going to be thinking I may as well do my rear seal and my water pump etc. etc. You're almost at a complete rebuild at that point anyway.

Why do all that work on an almost worn out bottom end? It would SUCK to do all that and then start burning oil because of bad rings or guides. Or spin a bearing.

Streetgrinder

The old mission creep/project expansion problem. I just ended up isolating the work to removing the timing cover, replacing guides, sprockets, chain and tensioner, new oil and water pumps, and re-sealing everything. I didn't want to get into the cylinder head, since I had just replaced intake and exhaust gaskets. The oil pan seal, I can do later if need be. Truck seems to be running well for now, and is pretty well sealed up. I did the rear main seal when I recently replaced the clutch, which is when I really should have sealed the oil pan.

kirkerik

I've got less than 100k on it now but:
my oil pan leaks
need TC and guides
front main seal leaks
I discovered the head was replaced (integrity?)
my compression is 165, 155, 165, 150
my coolant is going somewhere ~ liter per week

I guess a coolant pressure test is in order. If i pull the motor then i can paint the engine bay and frame, which is nice.

But then do i re-ring if the bore mic's out ok? It's only got 99k on it. And the lower end?

I got to stop somewhere but the compression is kinda low...
I'm glad i have my 2wd winter ride now, anyway.

kirkerik

glad to hear ot's running well for you!

aztoyman

kirkerik, You're right. Less than 100k is unlikely to have high wear.

Just sayin IF you pull the head, you may as well LOOK at it all. Easier to do when on a stand.

Take a look at your spark plugs and see if any are real clean from coolant steam cleaning them.

If you do have a bad head gasket or any leak that puts coolant in your oil it could cause more problems. Coolant will attack your main, rod and thrust bearings.

A proper head gasket fix would involve head work and possibly decking the block. If you have to deck the block, it's coming completely apart anyway. Make sure the TC cover is on if you get it decked.

If it doesn't need to be decked, you're probably fine to leave it in the truck and fix it. I have done it this way myself. And then I looked at what was left of the engine and wondered why I didn't just pull it.

kirkerik

i'm leaning towards pullng it out for all the reasons mentioned in my posts and yours but how do i know if the block needs to be decked? I would have to take it apart to tell and then it's either out of or in the truck?

My plugs all looked normal and tan. No steam cleaning. I can't seem to tell if it needs a HG or not but where is the coolant going? I'm thinking it's going out the exhaust. It's slow, a liter per week or two of driving. I have looked all over and behind that motor and found no leaks. I smell nothing in the cab and it's dry under the rug. There is no oil in the coolant either.

My oil and cap look good. No choco shake. I'm hoping my lower end is good but does it need to come apart too, to do a re-ring job?

How does my compression sound for 99k?

aztoyman

If you had a bad head gasket you SHOULD have the chocolate froth or white smoke and low comp on at least one cylinder. Unless it is barely starting to happen.

External leak should leave at least a drip and/or noticeable smell.

Do your cooling system pressure test and go from there. I personally wouldn't tear anything apart until I was sure. Especially since you said it is running so well.

Any chance you have a practical joker friend messing with you?

kirkerik

will do the pressure test.

Are all factory TC guides just plastic or did toyota start upgrading them anytime?? If so, what years?

I understand that enginebuilder sells the metal driver side guide

kirkerik

Yes, this is perplexing. I'm pretty sure that no one is messing. Good thought though.

Maybe it is just starting?? How does the coolant pressure test determine if its a HG? A regular leak i may be able to see under the hood during the test?

So let me get something straight.

If the coolant is getting in to the exhaust, then that has to happen in the combustion chamber, correct? All plugs look the same, no steam cleaning.

kirkerik

Hmmm, on second thought, maybe #2 cylinder plug is a little different. It's a slow leak. Numbers 1, 2 , 3 in that order

kirkerik

here is number 4