Joey Link

After selling my 2000 4Runner I've been searching for a cheap ($1k-$2k) 1st gen 4Runner for some time now with little success. I've been reading about the 3vze and it seems like maybe the common thoughts about it are misconceptions. I've been told before to avoid it at all costs, but it seems like many people have them and they do just fine. Since now I'm considering the 3.0, I'm thinking of expanding my search to include 2nd gen 4Runners as well. This would greatly expand my search, from the 22re 1st gen to the 22re or 3vze 1st or 2nd gen. I've heard the 2nd gen is extremely slow no matter which engine it's equipped with, is this true? Are we talking dangerously slow when getting on the freeway, or it'd-be-nice-to-have-more-power-but-its-ok slow? How about the 1st gen, is it the same?

I'd like to hear from you guys who own or have owned 2nd gen 4Runners as to what you think of this. Maybe we could talk a little about the 1st gen vs the 2nd gen in terms of ruggedness and reliability? My main use for this vehicle will be commuting 30 miles round trip 3-4 days per week and playing in the mud, snow, and sand on the weekends. I love the fact that the 1st gen has a removable top, but I think the 2nd gen looks better and they can be found with lower miles and more options for around the same price. What mileage are you 3vze guys averaging with 31" tires? How about 33's (please specify if you've regeared)?

Thanks guys!

toyota4x4907

Well I have never owned a 3vze, but have owned both a 1st and 2nd gen 4runner, both 22re 5spds. I dont see how/why people think either engine is slow. I can easily accelerate to 70+ with a 116 crank-from-the-factory (maybe 95 at the wheels now) 4500lb+ vehicle with 31x10.5w and 4.10 gears, you just cant be scared to rev her. I hit 4.5K-5K rpm daily, mainly because I love hearing my engine ..uh.."meow"... I get about 12-14 mpg city doing this. I can get 16-18 if I tried. Last 500 mile trip i went, I averaged 23mpg doing average of 65mph. The 3vze, AFAIK, is pretty much a gas hog, especially if its not in tune and taken care of. I love the 1st gens, but a 2nd gen was more practical for me, having 4 doors and being somewhat more safe. I haul my nephew(s) pretty often and getting a car seat into the back of a 1st gen is a PITA. Plus, 2nd gens are more comfortable. Like I said before, I dont see why people think they are slow. I have no trouble merging into traffic, holding 70+miles per hour or pulling steep grades at a reasonable constant speed. 1st gen 3vzes ('88 and '89) are pretty good, head gasket wise. I think its only like 7-10% failure rate compared to probably 40%+ of second gen ('90-'95). Either engine is best with a 5spd manual behind it. Autos are pretty slow. 5spds let you rev to where they like to go

2DoorRunner

My 22re 2nd gen is great. I can cruise at about 65 easily, and its not as bad getting 0-60 as some people say. It just takes some getting used to. IMO mine pulls pretty hard through 1st and 2nd. I rarely get it over 4k rpm too, im trying to make this thing last. It has 353,xxx km (about 206,000 miles i think) and its still running strong.

I have never even driven a v6 though so im not sure how much of a difference there is. But the 22re is a good little motor.

BTW i can win races against some pos hondas somehow. But i will take it!

-Jack

malteserunner

iTrader: (1)

I have a 1st gen, 4 cyl, 5 speed, with 33's and 4.88's. I get 20+ mpg consistently in the mountains. It has enough power to stay out of people's way.

I've owned 2 2nd gens with 3.0's and manual tranny's. Both had fresh motors and had plenty of power. One had 4.56's w/33's, and the other had 4.56's and 31's. I got anywhere between 15-19 mpg in either one.

I love the removable top on my first gen, but I liked the power of my second gens.

I think either way you will be very happy. Just be careful buying a 3.0 with 160-200k without any head work done yet. They like to suck valves about then. Listen for excessive valvetrain noise.

abecedarian

Can't say much about the 3VZE since I don't own one but my 88 4Runner with 22re on 30's and stock gears holds it own rather nicely. I'm not going to be pulling a Rodney King and outrunning cops in it any time soon though. Our 91 2wd truck/ 22re / auto holds its own rather well too and is easily as quick as my 4Runner and would probably out run it.

The V6 is another 40 or so HP above the 22re and when taken care of is a respectable engine but that doesn't mean they don't have their issues. It's that maintenance that makes the difference though. Catch problems before they become a problem and things are relatively straight-forward to repair but let it go bad and you will be behind the curve from then on. On the upside of the 3VZE/V6, if it does go, it's rather straightforward to swap in the 5VZE and get more power without sacrificing durability.

When the bottom-dragging ricers with their mega-horsepower spoilers rev their engines and want to race, I blip the throttle, point towards the hills and say "first one to the top without touching asphault is the winner."

modlite

The 22RE 4runner has plenty of power. If you want something with lots of power go get an Eclipse or something.

85excab

ive owned 3 1990 4runners with the 3.slow, all 3 were blown up with rods throught the side of the block. my first one got a 22re swap, the second one got a 3rz swap and the third one is getting a 7mge or 1uz swap.

pb4ugotobed

the 3vz isn't as bad of a motor as people make it out to be. However, kind of the running joke at work is "v8 fuel mileage, 4 cyl power... averages out to be a V6". And it's kinde of true. Even when running right, it feels like it really, really wants to get out of its own way, but can't quite do it. Personally, I don't have a problem with that. I drive like grandpa anyways... I'm really not in a hurry to get anywhere and the truck works fine for me. If you drive like speed racer, then it's probably not for you. Then again mine is an automatic, the manual tranny's are a little better. I don't beat on it either. I know it ain't fast, I don't try to pretend it is. The only time I really step into it is when I have to... and 99% of the time that will not be on pavement, and it'll be dropped in 4LO

My biggest bitch about the 3vz... It's a motherer to work on. Compared to the 5vz or pretty much any other toyota motor ever made, it ranks up there with the worst. Most of the stuff is a pain in the ass to get to, and the 14 million vacuum lines on the back side of the intake plenum don't make it any easier.

That being said, I'm totally fine with it. I got no issues, and especially considering the price, it's a great truck.

1st gen vs 2nd gen... If youre looking for something primarily to wheel hard and drive on the side, then I'd go with a 1st gen. If you have a considerable commute a good bit, and plan on driving it daily first, and wheel it as a weekend warrior, I'd go with a 2nd gen. It's a LOT more comfortable ride for a DD. Honestly I prefer driving my 91 4runner over my 03 nissan frontier. It's just a more comfortable ride. I only get about 16-17mpg in the 4runner, but get about 28 or so in the nissan, but I'd still rather drive the yota. When you drive them, they feel very solid. They're tanks (and weigh almost as much as one as well).

I also ahve kids, so the 4 doors is a huge advantage. As said above, I couldn't deal with a carseat in the back of a 2 door truck.

BigBluePile

iTrader: (3)

OP,

Do you have kids?? lol! I have two. Fortunately they're old enough(2 and 5) that they can buckle themselves in their car seats just fine so having two vs. four doors is irrellavent in my eyes. I DD my '86 30 miles round trip for YEARS in misc configurations of tires and lifts and the best was with 4" lift and 4.88's spinnin' 35's. Like was posted, I'm not scared to hit high RPMs 'cause I love the sound of my truck and it pulls hard(well, as to be expected). Yes, the original drivers seat was uncomfortableish, but I did TWO cross country trips in that seat and ne'er a complaint. I did break the seat eventually and swapped in a second gen 4Runner seat and it was a wee little more comfortable.

I have never been in a second gen(except to get parts) or driven a 3.0. Honestly, I would probably not own one unless it had a 22R-E in it. Besides, I bought the 4th gen for the doors! LOL!! Whaaat, I wanted a cool station wagon(oh and before someone starts cryin about that comment, I've run that truck hard on and offroad...besides it's the wifes and I don't drive it much anymore...)!!

toyota4x4907

Oh. About the ruggedness of a 1st gen vs 2nd. there really isnt must difference between the two between the bodies. They have the same engines, drivetrains and front suspension. The engine and drive train is what really matters the most on a Yota. Once you take out the engine, its not a Yota anymore, IMO. The 1st gens seem to rust more on the body. I like the rear leafs of the 1st gen opposed to the coils in the 2nd gen due to simplicity. I dont really like the torque rods and bars on the second gens, they hang down too low.

g_cali

I own two 1st gen 4runners (85 and 86). The 86 is stock and gets about 19mpg, it used two run 32's an got more like 16-17. The 85 has 4.88's and 35's and gets about 17mpg. Both trucks have plenty of power. Ive never owned a 3.0 4runner, but i have driven a few and they also are plenty powerful (at least 5 spd). However everyone i know with one has had to do either a head job or a full engine rebuild, so i would never buy one myself...

Joey Link

Thanks for all the info guys. After all this I think I'd really like to find a 22re 5spd 2nd gen, since I'm shooting for around 20mpg, but if a 1st gen comes up I'll probably buy it.

Curious, what do 5vzfe's go for now days?

peapicker

I have a 1990 runner 5 speed with the 3vze, its no powerhouse but it has enough. Also I have all the service records on this ride. At 259000 miles the only major service was a timing belt and both idler pully's. Other than that its only been oil changes, and air filters, o2 sensors, and some egr work, wich is coming off in the near future!

MaK92-4RnR

i have a 1992 5 speed with the 3vz-e as well. I've owned it since 107k miles and all I have done to the motor is regular oil changes every 3k. im at 130k now. its never let me down. and everyone is right, its no power house but all in all, it does just fine. avoid any hills, thats the only advice I have to offer. lol

Joey Link

Crap, I live on a hill

Justinlhc

An Eclipse?? Lots of power?? lol definitely not talking about a stock Eclipse


The 3VZE is underpowered for a V6, but still PLENTY reliable. Before I changed tire sizes it didn't seem so bad, but with 32's and stock gears, it's a turd. Not so bad around town, but once you get on the highway you need to move to the slow lane because that's where you belong. The 3VZE is weak(~150hp) and the 2gen 4runner is right around 2 tons in stock form. You're not going to be winning any races with that combo, but it's still fun in 4lo out in the hills. When I'm on the highway I hate my Toyota. When I'm in the hills I love it.

Joey Link

So it sounds like I should definitely look for a 5-speed no matter which engine I go with.

Justinlhc

I have never driven an auto 4Runner with a 3.0 but I can imagine how slow and annoying it would be. I wouldn't even consider an auto unless you had to.

1989toy4wd

Yeah 5-speed only...my truck on 37s, isnt that much worse than stock at lower gears...its noticable in 3rd gear and up... but are you really going to try and race people in an suv ?? I have heard mixed reviews about the 3.0...I drove my buddies automatic ext cab 4wd, and its slow!! MY truck on 37s beat him in a race!!!!

The 3.0s sport a cramped engine bay though, the combination of that and the head gasket problems just pushes me away from them...I do all my own work on my trucks, and cant even imagine doing head gaskets on that thing!!

Justinlhc

It sucks, but it's not "that" bad. Headers are a must for several reasons on the 3vze.