Squeeking and tapping noise from engine
05-09-2006, 11:42 AM
#1
Contributing Member
Thread Starter
Squeeking and tapping noise from engine
I finished up my hg rebuild yesterday and cranked the engine over. There was a loud tapping and squeeking coming from the engine. Thinking it was the rockers we adjusted them and tried again. Again, loud squeek, then tapping again (sounds like metal on metal) so we tried taking a belt of to see if that was the cause. Again, same thing. I took a video of it, and put it on photobucket, but there's no sound for some reason. If anyone would care to listen to this and take a educated guess, that would be appreciated, and I can email it to you.
05-09-2006, 12:12 PM
#4
Contributing Member
Thread Starter
heres a sound clip, hopefully this one works, last one wouldn't open anymore.
Sound Clip
Sound Clip
Last edited by EWAYota; 05-10-2006 at 10:18 AM.
05-09-2006, 01:07 PM
#5
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 333
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
kind of hard to tell, but spray some WD-40 on your idler pulley bearing. If it goes away then replace bearing.
I'd also pop your valve cover off and take a look and make sure your valve guides aren't broken, another thing, it could also be your oil tensioner too. Not taking up the slack like it should, and causing a loud racket.
I'd also pop your valve cover off and take a look and make sure your valve guides aren't broken, another thing, it could also be your oil tensioner too. Not taking up the slack like it should, and causing a loud racket.
05-09-2006, 01:39 PM
#6
Contributing Member
Thread Starter
idler pulley is fine, as we took the belt off that and started it up, still made the squeeking noise.
valve guides are good, we checked everything in there when we adjusted the valves.
We think its coming from the back of the engine, at first thinking it was the valves hitting the valve cover, but after adjusting it, and things being fine in that aspect we ruled that out. We're just not sure if the squeeking and tapping is coming from the same thing or not, so we're looking for possibilities of what it could be.
Wouldn't be a timing issue would it?
valve guides are good, we checked everything in there when we adjusted the valves.
We think its coming from the back of the engine, at first thinking it was the valves hitting the valve cover, but after adjusting it, and things being fine in that aspect we ruled that out. We're just not sure if the squeeking and tapping is coming from the same thing or not, so we're looking for possibilities of what it could be.
Wouldn't be a timing issue would it?
05-09-2006, 08:47 PM
#7
Registered User
Join Date: May 2003
Location: benton city wa
Posts: 1,320
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
hopefully we get this sorted out, sounds horrible,
In better news though, i got the timing chain cover back on and the lower intake on, didnt get back till 7 tonight, thats why no call.
and if i didnt thank you, thanks for the gaskets to dude, I owe you a huge one.
wade
In better news though, i got the timing chain cover back on and the lower intake on, didnt get back till 7 tonight, thats why no call.
and if i didnt thank you, thanks for the gaskets to dude, I owe you a huge one.
wade
Trending Topics
05-10-2006, 11:50 AM
#9
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 333
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
What about your timing chain guides, are they broken? What about your oil tensioner is it any good?
If its coming from the rear, hows your clutch adjustment? Hows the throwout bearing? Hows the Pilot Bearing?
Does it go away when you push in the clutch? Adjust the pedal or open the slave cylinder release, and manually push the fork to get the throwout away from the clutch, see if that stops it.
Hope it helps any.
If its coming from the rear, hows your clutch adjustment? Hows the throwout bearing? Hows the Pilot Bearing?
Does it go away when you push in the clutch? Adjust the pedal or open the slave cylinder release, and manually push the fork to get the throwout away from the clutch, see if that stops it.
Hope it helps any.
05-11-2006, 02:59 AM
#10
Contributing Member
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: TENN Native Languishing in Virginia
Posts: 4,787
Likes: 0
Received 34 Likes
on
14 Posts
Are we talking about a 22r or 3v engine?
Nevermind, I see TIMING CHAIN and that answers the question!
Nevermind, I see TIMING CHAIN and that answers the question!
Last edited by TNRabbit; 05-11-2006 at 04:13 AM. Reason: Add text
05-11-2006, 04:42 AM
#11
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 392
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You can try using a stethescope (or screwdriver to you ear) and check to see exactly where the noise is coming from. Check EVERYWHERE. The noise can reverberate quite a ways. Mine had a lot of lifter noise after my rebuild and I was able to finally adjust it out. It took several tries though.
Did you allow the engine to get up to full operating temperature before adjusting the vlave clearance? It does make quite a difference.
I couldn't hear the squeaking part good enough to make a good guess as to what it is. Take a look at your crank pulley while it is running and make sure the keyway is doing its job.
Good luck.
Did you allow the engine to get up to full operating temperature before adjusting the vlave clearance? It does make quite a difference.
I couldn't hear the squeaking part good enough to make a good guess as to what it is. Take a look at your crank pulley while it is running and make sure the keyway is doing its job.
Good luck.
05-25-2006, 03:33 PM
#12
Contributing Member
Thread Starter
well, i'm just left with the squeeking and ticking. had an exhaust leak and took care of that, and am now chasing down the others:
What could cause the chain be off like this?
and when the timing chain is on, will it move like so: CLICKY
I understand that it is a chain, and just like a bike chain, there will be some play, just not sure if this is normal or too much.
there was also this on the underside of the valve cover, right above the chain:
pulled off a couple small pieces and yet it still squeeled during start up and shut down
I know the VC isn't torqued down to far, since I barely put it on last time, thinking it would leak a little, but it didn't.
So that could be the reasoning behind the squeel and ticking, but i think the ticking it still something else. Wont mess with the valves till I get the chain problem fixed first.
What could cause the chain be off like this?
and when the timing chain is on, will it move like so: CLICKY
I understand that it is a chain, and just like a bike chain, there will be some play, just not sure if this is normal or too much.
there was also this on the underside of the valve cover, right above the chain:
pulled off a couple small pieces and yet it still squeeled during start up and shut down
I know the VC isn't torqued down to far, since I barely put it on last time, thinking it would leak a little, but it didn't.
So that could be the reasoning behind the squeel and ticking, but i think the ticking it still something else. Wont mess with the valves till I get the chain problem fixed first.
05-25-2006, 07:24 PM
#13
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 333
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
take your sparkplugs out, and without the cover on, manually turn the engine over and check things out. Put the valve cover back on and manually turn it.
Although from the picture, it appears that the chain is coming in contact with the cover..
Didn't you just replace the chain? I'm not sure, but I think you have the incorrect timing kit on it. You have a 94 22RE, which is the shorter block, and hence shorter chain. But I'm willing to put some money that you have a chain for a 83-84 22R. And I bet when you turn it on, it's sloppy enough to maybe not skip teeth, but come off the cam gear and hit your valve cover.
Hell maybe the Cam gears between early and late 22Rs are slightly diffrent.
Another question did you rebuild the engine? I know the early style 22Rs with the smooth valve cover will not fit onto the later style 22Rs with the square valvecover.
**EDIT** I think the smooth valve cover will fit on either heads, early, late, & 20R, but the square valve cover I think will only fit the later 22R
P.S. your video doesn't work, but the chain should be fairly tight, typically when installing the chain onto the cam, you might hafta rock the cam or engine back and forth a little to get it on. if it slipped on easy or even had slack to go above the cam, then you have the longer chain.
Either way something is up with your chain it seems like.
The ticking I wouldn't worry about it to much, probably just the valves tickin.
Also another thing, not to offend you or anything, but your cam gear is fully seated on the cam right? Alignment dowel and everything is on correctly? Just a thought, can't really see from your pics.
Although from the picture, it appears that the chain is coming in contact with the cover..
Didn't you just replace the chain? I'm not sure, but I think you have the incorrect timing kit on it. You have a 94 22RE, which is the shorter block, and hence shorter chain. But I'm willing to put some money that you have a chain for a 83-84 22R. And I bet when you turn it on, it's sloppy enough to maybe not skip teeth, but come off the cam gear and hit your valve cover.
Hell maybe the Cam gears between early and late 22Rs are slightly diffrent.
Another question did you rebuild the engine? I know the early style 22Rs with the smooth valve cover will not fit onto the later style 22Rs with the square valvecover.
**EDIT** I think the smooth valve cover will fit on either heads, early, late, & 20R, but the square valve cover I think will only fit the later 22R
P.S. your video doesn't work, but the chain should be fairly tight, typically when installing the chain onto the cam, you might hafta rock the cam or engine back and forth a little to get it on. if it slipped on easy or even had slack to go above the cam, then you have the longer chain.
Either way something is up with your chain it seems like.
The ticking I wouldn't worry about it to much, probably just the valves tickin.
Also another thing, not to offend you or anything, but your cam gear is fully seated on the cam right? Alignment dowel and everything is on correctly? Just a thought, can't really see from your pics.
Last edited by Chuki; 05-25-2006 at 07:29 PM.
05-26-2006, 11:33 AM
#14
Contributing Member
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by Chuki
take your sparkplugs out, and without the cover on, manually turn the engine over and check things out. Put the valve cover back on and manually turn it.
Although from the picture, it appears that the chain is coming in contact with the cover..
Didn't you just replace the chain? I'm not sure, but I think you have the incorrect timing kit on it. You have a 94 22RE, which is the shorter block, and hence shorter chain. But I'm willing to put some money that you have a chain for a 83-84 22R. And I bet when you turn it on, it's sloppy enough to maybe not skip teeth, but come off the cam gear and hit your valve cover.
Hell maybe the Cam gears between early and late 22Rs are slightly diffrent.
Another question did you rebuild the engine? I know the early style 22Rs with the smooth valve cover will not fit onto the later style 22Rs with the square valvecover.
**EDIT** I think the smooth valve cover will fit on either heads, early, late, & 20R, but the square valve cover I think will only fit the later 22R
P.S. your video doesn't work, but the chain should be fairly tight, typically when installing the chain onto the cam, you might hafta rock the cam or engine back and forth a little to get it on. if it slipped on easy or even had slack to go above the cam, then you have the longer chain.
Either way something is up with your chain it seems like.
The ticking I wouldn't worry about it to much, probably just the valves tickin.
Also another thing, not to offend you or anything, but your cam gear is fully seated on the cam right? Alignment dowel and everything is on correctly? Just a thought, can't really see from your pics.
Although from the picture, it appears that the chain is coming in contact with the cover..
Didn't you just replace the chain? I'm not sure, but I think you have the incorrect timing kit on it. You have a 94 22RE, which is the shorter block, and hence shorter chain. But I'm willing to put some money that you have a chain for a 83-84 22R. And I bet when you turn it on, it's sloppy enough to maybe not skip teeth, but come off the cam gear and hit your valve cover.
Hell maybe the Cam gears between early and late 22Rs are slightly diffrent.
Another question did you rebuild the engine? I know the early style 22Rs with the smooth valve cover will not fit onto the later style 22Rs with the square valvecover.
**EDIT** I think the smooth valve cover will fit on either heads, early, late, & 20R, but the square valve cover I think will only fit the later 22R
P.S. your video doesn't work, but the chain should be fairly tight, typically when installing the chain onto the cam, you might hafta rock the cam or engine back and forth a little to get it on. if it slipped on easy or even had slack to go above the cam, then you have the longer chain.
Either way something is up with your chain it seems like.
The ticking I wouldn't worry about it to much, probably just the valves tickin.
Also another thing, not to offend you or anything, but your cam gear is fully seated on the cam right? Alignment dowel and everything is on correctly? Just a thought, can't really see from your pics.
I didn't replace the TC since it's relatively new, so I'm sure its the correct chain. It does appear to be looser than it should be though, i'll take another video showing more of the play I get in it.
The valve cover is the same one I had to start with too, so its not a issue of having the wrong cover either.
With the valve cover on, and me turning the engine by hand, you can't hear anything. Since it squeek's on start up and shut down, I'm guessing that since theres play in the chain, its jumping on both accounts and rubbing the cover.
I'm not sure though why its sitting that close to the chain guides. Looking at them in person, you can see that the chain has been rubbing against.
I dont know if I just put the chain on wrong. When i had the chain around the crank on the bottom and ran it up past the tensioner and to the top sproket without the cover on, I could pull up on the chain and the tensioner would slid allowing the chain to move up.
Once I put the timing cover on, and then tried it again, the tensioner wouldn't slid in, and the chain wouldn't move, so i put the chain on with the timing cover off and pushed the tensioner in by hand and put the chain on the top sproket and bolted it on.
I guess I wont know till I pull the timing cover back off and take a look at it.
05-26-2006, 12:14 PM
#15
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 333
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So you only get the contact with the valve cover on startup or shutdown? I dunno I'm stumped by this one.
I even did some searching around and cannot find anything about a tchain hitting the valve cover.
I guess your just going to have to dissasmble everything and find out whats going on.
Have you driven the vehicle? Or pretty much just started it, heard that and shut it down?
I even did some searching around and cannot find anything about a tchain hitting the valve cover.
I guess your just going to have to dissasmble everything and find out whats going on.
Have you driven the vehicle? Or pretty much just started it, heard that and shut it down?
05-26-2006, 01:30 PM
#16
Contributing Member
Thread Starter
only squeeks during start up, and then it goes away......then when you shut it off, it does it as well.
it might not be hitting it, but something was rubbing the valve cover, so i'm stumped on that.
I'm going to pull the oil pan, and t.c. off tomorrow and look around and see.
I drove the vehicle just from the side of the house to the back of the house, where it made all the lovely sounds i'm diagnosing. Since then, its just been a start up, let it run and see what all I can, shut it off, do some tightning here and there, and readjusting this and that, start it again and repeat, lol.
it might not be hitting it, but something was rubbing the valve cover, so i'm stumped on that.
I'm going to pull the oil pan, and t.c. off tomorrow and look around and see.
I drove the vehicle just from the side of the house to the back of the house, where it made all the lovely sounds i'm diagnosing. Since then, its just been a start up, let it run and see what all I can, shut it off, do some tightning here and there, and readjusting this and that, start it again and repeat, lol.
05-30-2006, 08:17 AM
#17
Contributing Member
Thread Starter
Took the timing cover off to take a look at the chain. Looked ok except for the fact that it was so close to the chain guides as pictured above. Can anyone tell me if the chain is suppose to sit right in the middle of the guides with equal spacing on each side or is it going to be closer to one side than the other? Any pictures of what its suppose to look like?
Chain felt tight all the way down too, so I'm not sure that it was hitting the valve cover, but I don't know what else would be hitting it
Chain felt tight all the way down too, so I'm not sure that it was hitting the valve cover, but I don't know what else would be hitting it
05-30-2006, 01:41 PM
#18
Contributing Member
Thread Starter
Ok, I THINK I found the reasoning behind the chain rubbing against the guides, but I'm not 100% sure.
This shows a spacer between the cam and cam sprocket (fuel pump drive cam is for 22R's, not important)
Both my Chiltons nor my FSM show that spacer being there, nor do I ever recall that being something I took off.
Does anyone with a 94 or somewhere abouts RE have that spacer? I think having that would push the chain off the guides, but not sure if thats the problem or if its even suppose to be there on mine.
Anyone know?
This shows a spacer between the cam and cam sprocket (fuel pump drive cam is for 22R's, not important)
Both my Chiltons nor my FSM show that spacer being there, nor do I ever recall that being something I took off.
Does anyone with a 94 or somewhere abouts RE have that spacer? I think having that would push the chain off the guides, but not sure if thats the problem or if its even suppose to be there on mine.
Anyone know?
05-30-2006, 03:09 PM
#19
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Youfalla, Al
Posts: 399
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mine had no spacer in between the cam and the cam sprocket like your see in the diagram. I did have slight sqaull at startup and ticking like you have. It was the chain tensioner wasn't taking up the slack in the chain and caused my new guides to break. I had the top and bottom oil pump bolts mixed up, one is longer than the other one. The longer one goes in the bottom and the shorter in the top, if you get them mixed up the bolt sticks out past the cover and binds of the tensioner so it won't engage properly against the chain, that will cause a loose chain, broken guides, ticking, and squealing! Just something to check! Also the ticking could just be the valve adjuster.
They will wear a groove in them over time and you can't get them properly adjusted either remove them and file them down smooth or just buy new ones from www.engnbldr.com
They will wear a groove in them over time and you can't get them properly adjusted either remove them and file them down smooth or just buy new ones from www.engnbldr.com
Last edited by trx125; 05-30-2006 at 03:11 PM.
05-30-2006, 03:18 PM
#20
Contributing Member
Thread Starter
your talking about the long bolts correct? I'm sure I had those right, but I'll double check.
Still, I don't know why the chain is leaning right up against the guides like that.
The ticking, I'm pretty sure is valve related, not 100%, but it def. sounds like its on the top and in the back of the valve cover, not in the front but the sound could be echoing thru the metal and making it sound likes in the back.
right now i'm just debating on whether or not to order eb's timing chain kit w/ metal guides before I button everything back up. Wish I knew exactly why its rubbing the guides before I spend the money on something thats not gonna fix the problem. Maybe its just the guides are shot already, who knows.
Thanks for the info.
Still, I don't know why the chain is leaning right up against the guides like that.
The ticking, I'm pretty sure is valve related, not 100%, but it def. sounds like its on the top and in the back of the valve cover, not in the front but the sound could be echoing thru the metal and making it sound likes in the back.
right now i'm just debating on whether or not to order eb's timing chain kit w/ metal guides before I button everything back up. Wish I knew exactly why its rubbing the guides before I spend the money on something thats not gonna fix the problem. Maybe its just the guides are shot already, who knows.
Thanks for the info.
