Notices
86-95 Trucks & 4Runners 2nd/3rd gen pickups, and 1st/2nd gen 4Runners with IFS

Rebuilding a siezed engine.

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Nov 12, 2005 | 09:51 AM
  #21  
Nix_Toy's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 203
Likes: 0
From: Crestview, Florida
Ok, I opened her up a little today.. I doubt I went far enough, but here's some pictures with the cam cover off. I don't know if you can tell it's rebuildable or not by just this, but I thought I'd post them up anyway just in case there is something obvious that I dont' see. Also, it's not completly dry in there, there's still puddles of oil laying around in there.



Last edited by Nix_Toy; Nov 12, 2005 at 09:52 AM.
Reply
Old Nov 12, 2005 | 12:18 PM
  #22  
Toysrme's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 273
Likes: 0
Cool

Oil flow into heads is almost always low, or less than you would expect. All you'd find is puddled oil. If you take the valve cover off while it's idling & look, you would find maybe a cup of oil.
Looks normal to me keep digging.
Reply
Old Nov 12, 2005 | 04:28 PM
  #23  
44Runner's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 993
Likes: 0
From: Mount Pleasant, SC
need to see good pics of the cam and of the rockers where they contact the cam. They should be mirrorish finishs, no grooves.

Definately dig more if the cam and stuff looks good. Might be a good time to get a service manual if you don't have one. Make sure to remember the head bolt that goes into the top of the timing cover, under distributor gear.
Reply
Old Nov 13, 2005 | 08:56 AM
  #24  
kyle_22r's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,981
Likes: 4
From: Lacey, WA
more importantly, take a good look at the cam journals. if they're galled out, the head is junk. rockers and cams are cheaply replaced. however, with an '85-95 type head, you can buy a new casting for about $350 ready-to-go.
Reply
Old Nov 13, 2005 | 03:49 PM
  #25  
Nix_Toy's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 203
Likes: 0
From: Crestview, Florida
Can you describe what a cam journal is, Im really not sure of what everything's called yet. Also, is it ok to leave the cam cover off? Or should I cover it everytime I'm done working on the truck? Thanks again guys
Reply
Old Nov 13, 2005 | 03:57 PM
  #26  
tc's Avatar
tc
Contributing Member
 
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 8,875
Likes: 3
From: Longmont, CO
The journals are the bearings. They will be the smooth round places (as opposed to the smooth egg-shaped places). It's where the cam is supported in the head.
Reply
Old Nov 13, 2005 | 05:20 PM
  #27  
kyle_22r's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,981
Likes: 4
From: Lacey, WA
yep, they are what the camshaft rides on them. they have 3 caps, numbered 1-3 with arrows pointing towards the front of the head. they should be smooth on the inside.
Reply
Old Nov 16, 2005 | 11:50 AM
  #28  
Nix_Toy's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 203
Likes: 0
From: Crestview, Florida
Alright, I took the head off this morning, and this is what I see. I dotn' have a clue if this is bad, or if this is normal for a truck with 160k miles on it, but its like black flaky stuff.. but anyway, let me know if there's something that needs to be done please! Thanks again guys!





Last edited by Nix_Toy; Nov 16, 2005 at 11:51 AM.
Reply
Old Nov 16, 2005 | 01:18 PM
  #29  
Nix_Toy's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 203
Likes: 0
From: Crestview, Florida
Also, does the cylinder block have to be out of the truck before I start ripping into it? I know my FSM says to pull the engine, but I'd rather leave it in until it HAS to come out.. thanks again.
Reply
Old Nov 16, 2005 | 02:46 PM
  #30  
kyle_22r's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 3,981
Likes: 4
From: Lacey, WA
you're going to have a much more pleasant time if you pull the block. kind of hard to do without the head and lift hooks on(it's heavy) but you could probably rig a chain up to a couple head bolts. to pull the crank you're gonna have to drop the tranny anyhow, so you're better off just taking it out.

from the pics, things don't look too bad. that definitely isn't the original head gasket, it's a felpro POS.
Reply
Old Nov 16, 2005 | 03:45 PM
  #31  
44Runner's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 993
Likes: 0
From: Mount Pleasant, SC
the black flaky stuff is normal. Just your average carbon buildup.

your timing chain was intact correct?
how does your cam/rockers/head look?

if you want to leave the engine in the truck and trudge on you will need to pull the oil pan. When you pull the pan you can then pull the oil intake tube and then start pulling pistons/rods. make sure to keep the right cap with the right rod and in the same orientation. Once the pistons/rods are out of the engine you will be able to look at the crank and the cylinders. Once again both should be smooth. Crank should be a mirror finish, but the cylinder walls will likely have honing marks on them which will look like diagonal scratchs going in both directions. It really doesn't matter the condition of the cylinders because they will be bored and if they happen to be REALLY bad they can be sleeved, but I doubt they will need that. Main thing will be the crank. If it looks decent under the caps (go ahead and pull the main bearing caps one at a time, replacing afterward so you can look under them too).

If all these things look fine, I would go ahead and try to rebuild, but that is me...

Last edited by 44Runner; Nov 16, 2005 at 03:46 PM.
Reply
Old Nov 20, 2005 | 07:54 AM
  #32  
Nix_Toy's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 203
Likes: 0
From: Crestview, Florida
Originally Posted by 44Runner
your timing chain was intact correct?
how does your cam/rockers/head look?
Yes, the timing chain was intact, and the whole head unit looks good. Anway, I was taking off the oil pan, got all 15 bolts off, but the pan just doesn't want to come off. I guess the gasket's keeping it up there. Does anyone know of a way to get it off? Thanks again guys.
Also, before I started removing the oil pan bolts, I decided to drain the oil, just in case there was some left. There was about a quart and a half that drained out. Would that little amount of oil still cause the engine to seize?
Reply
Old Nov 20, 2005 | 09:08 AM
  #33  
44Runner's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 993
Likes: 0
From: Mount Pleasant, SC
Originally Posted by Nix_Toy
Yes, the timing chain was intact, and the whole head unit looks good. Anway, I was taking off the oil pan, got all 15 bolts off, but the pan just doesn't want to come off. I guess the gasket's keeping it up there. Does anyone know of a way to get it off? Thanks again guys.
Also, before I started removing the oil pan bolts, I decided to drain the oil, just in case there was some left. There was about a quart and a half that drained out. Would that little amount of oil still cause the engine to seize?
You will need to pry the pan off with a screwdriver or something after you make sure you got every bolt.

Obviously 1.5 quarts isn't enough, but I'm not sure how much oil you can expect to be "in" the engine while it is running and how much you need to be in the stump to still reach the oil pickup...
Reply
Old Nov 20, 2005 | 09:09 AM
  #34  
Nix_Toy's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 203
Likes: 0
From: Crestview, Florida
Ok, I got the oil pan off.. I'm uploading photos as we speak.
Reply
Old Nov 20, 2005 | 09:10 AM
  #35  
wimpywade94's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,320
Likes: 0
From: benton city wa
With a quart and a 1/2 in the engine its hard to tell, but i see people come in to my work everyday for an oil change and they have less that 2 quarts in there vehicle,

if its seized might as well press onward and rebuild.

and if your sure all the bolts are off of the oil pan mabey a little gently prying would lossen it.

wade
Reply
Old Nov 20, 2005 | 09:13 AM
  #36  
Nix_Toy's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 203
Likes: 0
From: Crestview, Florida
Ok, here we go. I noticed some metal shavings in the oil pan, as you can see in the pics.. they were copper color. I didn't see anything obvious on the crank, but that might be just because I'm no expert. And these pictures didn't come out too well, but you'll get the jist of it. I'm stopping for the day because I have go watch my Broncos on TV! But I'll be ripping the crank out sometime soon...





Reply
Old Nov 20, 2005 | 09:48 AM
  #37  
DudeBud's Avatar
Contributing Member
 
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,871
Likes: 0
From: WA ,monroe
your going to have to pull the motor no way is that crank in good shape, i can tell that just by the color.
Reply
Old Nov 20, 2005 | 09:50 AM
  #38  
Nix_Toy's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 203
Likes: 0
From: Crestview, Florida
Oh, so theres no possible way to do any engine work under there without the block removed from the truck? I was hoping it was possilbe, although I know it would be a pain to do, because I dont' have access to a cherry picker.
Reply
Old Nov 20, 2005 | 09:51 AM
  #39  
44Runner's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 993
Likes: 0
From: Mount Pleasant, SC
Originally Posted by DudeBud
your going to have to pull the motor no way is that crank in good shape, i can tell that just by the color.
well pulling the motor is not in debate

eventually he is gonna HAVE to pull the motor...
Reply
Old Nov 20, 2005 | 09:52 AM
  #40  
44Runner's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 993
Likes: 0
From: Mount Pleasant, SC
Originally Posted by Nix_Toy
Oh, so theres no possible way to do any engine work under there without the block removed from the truck? I was hoping it was possilbe, although I know it would be a pain to do, because I dont' have access to a cherry picker.
if you are gonna rebuild this engine you will need to take at least the block to a machine shop at some point.
Reply



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:46 PM.