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So - I dropped my 1994 22re 4x4 pickup at the local mechanic shop (small town - one option).
He will (hopefully) look into the gas flooded charcoal canister; the (occasional) hard cold start; the rich running condition (bad gas mileage) (14mpg) and he just found (during the oil change) that the oil has a strong gas smell.
Thoughts from the pros here?
I left the manual in the seat of the truck when I dropped it off... so fingers crossed.
The previous owner pulled off the EGR and blocked it with a plate but left the vacuum mess and the rest of the emissions cr@p.
CEL is lit but I don't know what the code is.
It's sluggish on take off too.
Any and all info/help/suggestions is appreciated !
It is likely that your local mechanic will tell you they have to undo whatever the PO did before they can tell what's wrong unless they are Toyota fans. Many shops will not mess with any emissions deleted vehicles due to legalities.
The engine was an Advance Auto long block installed a few thousand mikes ago around Sept 2017.
It doesn't run terribly now as far as I know.
Its no torque monster and takes forever to get to 65 mph. But that sounds pretty normal from what I read.
Just pukes gas out of the charcoal can and the mileage seems a bit low for a fourbanger on stock sized tires. (~14mpg).
The two vacuum hoses hoses connecting the valve cover and the intake were shot on the ends. Noticed a lot of internal pressure when removing the oil fill cap while running.
Wngine also bogs with the oil fill cap off after a few seconds.
The egr valve has been removed and capped with a plate but all other emissions stuff remains.
Cat also deleted and pipe welded in place. O2 still there but no clue if functioning.
Local wrench doesnt care about legalities yet. Really small town and cool guy trying to save me $.
I picked up a used charcoal can today.
Actially picked up two.
Mine and doner1 are plugged when blowing thru the fuel tank inlet.
Doner2 can wasn't plugged when blowing thru fuel tank inlet. New gas cap is on.
After about 15 min running in his shop, again we had fuel puking out of replacement cannister.
Thats when we check the blow by at the full cap and he noticed both hoses from valve cover to intake were shot.
He will check pcv valve tomorrow and replace two hoses.
Make sure the return fuel line from the fuel pressure regulator goes back to the tank and not to the charcoal canister. I don't have anything to compare it to, but I am pretty sure you could cross things up and pour gas straight there instead of tank vapors.
The engine was an Advance Auto long block installed a few thousand mikes ago around Sept 2017.
If the oil has been smelling of fuel since the rebuilt block was installed that suggests it wasn't broken in properly. I would do a compression test before buying any parts.
Check fuel pressure is in spec. Return lines are good, clear..
Borescope the cylinders, they should be seated by now you may have internal scoring. In which case it's bad news.
Did you already tell us if it is automatic transmission or manual? If it's auto you are not far off for milage per gallon, if it's manual it is really bad.
It is a manual trans.
P.O. tells me that the new motor is less than 1000 miles old.
He bought a new truck and stopped driving right after the engine was replaced in Sept.
I called the installer and asked for accurate mileage when the new motor was installed.
He said he would have to make some calls and dig up old emails.... so I doubt I'll hear back with the mileage of the truck when it was installed.
He did confirm that it was late last year - September-ish.
I have only put one tank of gas in it since I've had it.
Could the rings still not be seated in that case?
Just to add details -
The fuel doesn't pour from the canister right away. It has to warm up.
I assume it is pulling vacuum on the tank (or pressurizing the tank) and it just takes some time to do so.
There is little-to-no gas from the canister if the gas cap is left loose.
I removed the check valve form the old cap completely and that also alleviates the issue.
A new replacement cap with a working check valve and tightened appropriately causes the gas to pour from the bottom (vent?) hose on the canister.
Would this suggest that something is pressurizing the tank? If something was pulling vacuum, wouldn't the check valve in the new cap just allow more air into the tank to keep things balanced?
With two motors having been installed (same installer both times), I'm wondering if they crossed some vacuum lines or crimped a metal line somehow.
The charcoal canister is supposed to allow recycle of the vapors from the fuel tank, therefore it is supposed to be plumbed into a port at the top of the tank. It should not get liquid from the tank, so check to be sure it is connected to the correct port.
The tank is supposed to operate at a slight pressure (If memory serves me correctly) and if the canister is connected to a connection lower down in the tank you will get liquid filling it.
Your return from the fuel pressure regulator on the fuel rail goes back to the tank to a port that goes lower in the tank to avoid noise from splashing/pouring fluid entering at the top of the tank.
So, these two connections may have been crossed (likely at the top of the tank).
When your engine reaches proper operating conditions the vapors from the tank are allowed to enter the intake system (through the canister) to be burned so this could be when the fuel is allowed to enter the canister and why it takes a while before fuel starts coming out.
EGR is Exhaust Gas Recirculation, and I don't know how that may tie into the Evaporative Emissions, my opinion is to return it to stock or study up on EGR delete for the 22RE. I am not familiar with doing that mod or with the benefits of it, So good luck!
The charcoal canister is supposed to allow recycle of the vapors from the fuel tank, therefore it is supposed to be plumbed into a port at the top of the tank. It should not get liquid from the tank, so check to be sure it is connected to the correct port.
The tank is supposed to operate at a slight pressure (If memory serves me correctly) and if the canister is connected to a connection lower down in the tank you will get liquid filling it.
Your return from the fuel pressure regulator on the fuel rail goes back to the tank to a port that goes lower in the tank to avoid noise from splashing/pouring fluid entering at the top of the tank.
So, these two connections may have been crossed (likely at the top of the tank).
When your engine reaches proper operating conditions the vapors from the tank are allowed to enter the intake system (through the canister) to be burned so this could be when the fuel is allowed to enter the canister and why it takes a while before fuel starts coming out.
But EGR is Exhaust Gas Recirculation, and I don't know how that may tie into the Evaporative Emissions, my opinion is to return it to stock or study up on EGR delete for the 22RE. I am not familiar with doing that mod or with the benefits of it, So good luck!
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Thanks, all.
I'll try to get by the shop where my truck has lived for a week soon.
I'm headed to a local junk yard to pull a tow hitch from another Toyota pickup in a few minutes.
I'll see if there is a tank plumbed as it should be and take some picts. I can then compare to mine.
After some internet digging - I'm not sure what they removed was the EGR.
The plat to which I'm referring is on the exhaust manifold.
It is a diamond shaped plate with two bolts.
It is very near the flange that connects to the tailpipe.
What the heck did the previous owner remove?
Upstream O2 sensor maybe?
There is one in the exuahst pipe (after where the cat converter would have been - had they not welded a pipe in it's place).
Should there be two O2 sensors?
EGR is Exhaust Gas Recirculation, so that plate was likely where the exhaust gas was plumbed to the EGR valve. I haven't looked at a 22RE in a long time to tell you if there was an O2 sensor there.
Sounds like the exhaust manifold was replaced with an older style one, old ones has a bung in them for an oxygen sensor.
My 94 only has one oxygen sensor located roughly under the driver's seat..
What does your exhaust manifold look like?
Is yours OEM?
Isn't the EGR on the back of the engine nearer the firewall?
Is there a tube or something that runs around to the exhaust manifold?
If not, where does it source the exhaust gasses?
What does your exhaust manifold look like?
Is yours OEM?
Isn't the EGR on the back of the engine nearer the firewall?
Is there a tube or something that runs around to the exhaust manifold?
If not, where does it source the exhaust gasses?
thanks !!
jw
Don't forget there could be a difference between federal and California emissions.
I looked for a Toyota with the 22re because I wanted something easy to work on.
Still waiting for that to happen.
:-)
the best formula for that is to buy one that is all stock and running right to begin with then do any modifications yourself so you know what has been done and make sure you do it right! One change at a time so if something doesn't work you know what caused it.
That is why it took me a really long time to pick my 4runner, I didn't see anything that fit my wish list. Until I saw her... there she was... Bride of Chucky!!! Almost completely rust free V-6 and automatic (which I wanted for hunting) and running like a top. just had crappy steering/suspension parts and brakes (which were all going to be replaced when I did the SAS). The point is, you have to pick the right one and like true love, you'll know.
The EGR valve is on the rear passenger side of the head. Most of the EGR system is internal to the head. The pipes coming off of the exhaust manifold are for the Secondary Air Injection system.
22RE Performance has an FAQ section explaining EGR passages vs Secondary Air Injection passages, shown below.
The EGR valve is on the rear passenger side of the head. Most of the EGR system is internal to the head. The pipes coming off of the exhaust manifold are for the Secondary Air Injection system.
22RE Performance has an FAQ section explaining EGR passages vs Secondary Air Injection passages, shown below.
Just got the news that compression testing on all four cylinders was good.
When I picked up the junk yard charcoal canister, the guy there said that the issue would likely be a plugged up vacuum line. Thoughts?
the best formula for that is to buy one that is all stock and running right to begin with then do any modifications yourself so you know what has been done and make sure you do it right! One change at a time so if something doesn't work you know what caused it.
That is why it took me a really long time to pick my 4runner, I didn't see anything that fit my wish list. Until I saw her... there she was... Bride of Chucky!!! Almost completely rust free V-6 and automatic (which I wanted for hunting) and running like a top. just had crappy steering/suspension parts and brakes (which were all going to be replaced when I did the SAS). The point is, you have to pick the right one and like true love, you'll know.
I was aware of the charcoal canister issue before I bought it, but the new motor and all of the raplaced parts was too tempting.
She's all mine now - so we have to move forward to get her purring like a kitten again.
03-06-2018, 07:55 AM
