Chip N Sawbones

1989 2wd pickup with the 22RE. It's been running on three cylinders for months, but that's not the issue.

Everything was running fine when I pulled into the Home Depot parking lot. When I left and tried to start it, the engine made a clunking noise on the first try. After that, it felt like the starter wasn't catching. I tried push starting the truck, but that didn't work either. When it was rolling and I put it in gear, it didn't seem to get any harder to push. The engine made a clicking noise, but it felt like it wasn't really turning over or wasn't compressing.

Here's what I've done so far:

Pulled the starter off. No obvious damage to the gear teeth. When I put the starter back in and turned the key with the truck in gear, the truck moves forward, so the starter must be catching.

I thought the timing chain might be broken, so I pulled the upper cylinder cover off and put a mark on the top of the chain. When I tried starting again, the mark moved, so the timing chain must still be good.

I shot a little starting fluid in the intake. It didn't do anything, and the engine didn't cough.

I pulled a spark plug and saw spark when I cranked the engine.

I thought there might be some other reason the engine wasn't getting compression, so I pulled a spark plug and stuffed a wad of plastic in the hole. When I cranked the engine the plastic blew out, so there must be some compression.

I'm out of ideas. I'm guessing there must be something seriously wrong with the guts of the engine for it to feel like the starter is just spinning even though the starter does move the truck, spin the timing chain and cause the cylinders to compress at least a little. Home is ten miles away. Anyone got any ideas?

bigred*

Could it be your clutch if you say it'll push start in gear with little resistance? When you were pushing it and popping it in gear did it sound like the engine was turning over or did it just sound the same.. I just bought my truck last week so im still learning them, I don't know if the clutch is by cable or by hydrolic yet, but that's what I would check next

Chip N Sawbones

If the clutch was broken the starter would still spin the engine, which it does. The engine would run but the truck would never move forward.

The clutch on these trucks is hydraulic.

JohnnyCanuck

You need air, fuel and spark to start. I know you tried starter fluid but check to see if you are getting adequate fuel. I'd check every plug too, especially if you have been running on 3 cylinders..GL bro!

TransAmBandit

Maybe the timing chain let go. Could explain why it wasnt any harder to push when you had it in gear, theres no compression in the engine.

Combat Vet

Hi there chip.. I've had the same thing happen to me before. In my case it was a blown Bering. Which is not good at all. Be careful because you could ruin the motor. I'm no mechanic, but to me it does sound like something internal in you engine i.e. a thrown rod or blown Bering. Guess the best thing I could say is tread lightly as to not make it any worse until you figure out the exact problem. And good luck

Chip N Sawbones

That was what I thought at first, but I pulled the cover off the engine and marked the top of the timing chain. When I put everything back together and cranked the engine, the mark moved, so the chain must be spinning. The chain had a bit of free play on the right side. I don't know if that's normal or not, but it didn't seem completely broken.

JohnnyCanuck

weird that it would just die like that, makes me think it's not a compression issue.

Chip N Sawbones

What's the best way to test if its getting fuel? It's the 22RE, so injected.

Edit: Right, I remember now. See if the spark plug is wet. Stand by, I'm checking that.

brianh699

shorting the fp to b+ terminals in the check connector under the hood will make the fuel pump run constantly, you should be able to hear it running

INFINITY

check your fuses....check your fuel pump turns on as previously mentioned.....check to see if you have pressure on the fuel rail.
if you are seeing spark then your ignitor, coil, dist, t-chain, are good (working).
crank it over again with someone and spray starter fluid in the throttle body with the air intake hose and box are off. if you are getting spark this should make it try to fire. it wont run for crap but it will tell you that you have a fuel issue......injectors, injector harness clips, wire harness, ecu, component, EFI issue.

Chip N Sawbones

All of the good cylinders have fuel, spark, and enough compression to blow a wad of plastic out the spark plug hole. I tested for fuel by wrapping a little bit of cloth around the spark plug electrode. It came away wet with gasoline. I might come back tomorrow with my compression tester to do a proper test.

Toyota~Boy

iTrader: (2)

Check to see if your cam is broken. See if a valve is stuck.

To do this remove the valve cover once again. Have someone crank engine over so you can watch the timing chain rotate the cam. This in return will move your rocker arms up and down making your valves open and shut. I'd the cam broke your not gonna run.

vital22re

iTrader: (2)

You need a proper compression test done. A wad Of plastic is not a proper compression check method. Why was the motor running on 3 cylinders?

Chip N Sawbones

Yeah, I'll run a compression test tomorrow and post the results. Since it has fuel and spark, that's probably the issue. I'm waiting on the tow truck now. It's been running on three cylinders because the #4 cylinder has zero compression. I disconnected the fuel injector to that cylinder. It's been like that for months. I know I shouldn't really be driving like that, but I haven't had enough money to get the engine replaced and it's beyond my ability to fix. If the problem is in fact bad compression in the other three cylinders I'll probably have to sell the truck as is for parts and pick up a new $500 clunker.

Chip N Sawbones

Right. I got the truck home and ran a compression test. Zero compression in all four cylinders. I pulled the valve cover off again and the valve cams are spinning and the valves are moving up and down. I'm guessing that the total lack of compression means this engine has had it, at least as far as my mechanical abilities are concerned.

I can't believe I just killed a Toyota.

RJR

It may not be as bad as you think. If there's no compression, but the cam is still turning and the valves are still moving, pretty much the only thing that can have happened is that the valves have gotten seriously out of time. This could happen if the timing chain slipped a few (more than one) teeth, or if the timing gear has slipped on the cam shaft (and then rejammed in a new rotational location) due to a broken key or alignment pin. Either of these would be relatively easy to fix, I would think. I know the 3.0vz is a non-interference engine, meaning the pistons won't have hit the valves even if the valve timing is wacked. I think the same is true for the 22re, but I'm not positive.

If the starter (which connects to the back of the engine at the flywheel) is still turning the timing chain and camshaft at the front of the engine, the crankshaft is obviously still in one piece. That being the case, it's inconceivable that all 4 pistons and cylinders would have developed major compression leaks simultaneously while it was sitting in the Home Depot parking lot.

Next step is to check your valve timing.

Good luck.

Chip N Sawbones

I'll look again, but I didn't see anything broken in the upper part of the engine. Can the timing chain just slip like you're saying? It didn't seem like there was anywhere near enough free play for that to happen.

I went out and bought a new truck today. Unfortunately there weren't any Toyotas for sale so I had to settle for a 1991 Nissan, the next best thing to a Toyota. For $600 it looks pretty good.

RJR

Well, from a financial standpoint, you probably made the right decision. I'll stand by my statement that your Toyota almost surely has a valve timing problem - there's just nothing else that could reasonably result in simultaneous loss of compression in all cylinders, short of catastrophic destruction of the bottom end of the engine, and that would have been a lot more dramatic than what you described.

That being said, unless you're capable of and willing to do all of the work yourself, getting a mechanic to fix a timing chain or camshaft problem for much less than $600 probably isn't likely. Time to put this behind you and enjoy your $600 Nissan!