example of too much lift
Sep 24, 2008 | 01:36 PM
#81
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From: Plainfield, IL
First, that is French Creek on the Holy Cross trail, and is one of the hardest obstacles in Colorado. There is little reason to be "more capable" than that around here ... oh, and all the harder stuff is on non-scenic trails, the ONLY reason to do them is because they are hard.
Generally, those trails come with MANDATORY body damage and LIKELY mechanical damage - even for built trucks and buggies. Could our trucks do those trails if we had SAS and more flex? Probably. WOULD either Isaac or myself do them? Doubtful - neither of us likes body damage, and as said before, there's no reason to do them other than to stroke your ego and say "I ran the hardest trail in Colorado".
Holy Cross is AWESOME - it has it all. Hard obstacles, unbelievable scenery, and a great history with the mining town at the top.
i guess some parts of the country may require more suspension articulation, but around here ain't one of 'em. Put a skilled driver like Isaac in a properly geared, locked front/rear rig and you quickly see how overrated suspension travel is ...
Generally, those trails come with MANDATORY body damage and LIKELY mechanical damage - even for built trucks and buggies. Could our trucks do those trails if we had SAS and more flex? Probably. WOULD either Isaac or myself do them? Doubtful - neither of us likes body damage, and as said before, there's no reason to do them other than to stroke your ego and say "I ran the hardest trail in Colorado".
Holy Cross is AWESOME - it has it all. Hard obstacles, unbelievable scenery, and a great history with the mining town at the top.
i guess some parts of the country may require more suspension articulation, but around here ain't one of 'em. Put a skilled driver like Isaac in a properly geared, locked front/rear rig and you quickly see how overrated suspension travel is ...
Sep 24, 2008 | 01:51 PM
#83
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,371
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From: Texas
Let another "speed bump wheeling stocker" chime in here. From watching the video the only thing I could see that I didn't like (and quite possibly don't understand) is that the 4 runner suspension seemed "mushy" and it leaned all over the place. The pickup on the other hand didn't wobble around as much and seemed to take the rocks and such a lot easier.
Now don't get all freaky on me and call me names but I couldn't see anything "really" wrong with either of them, except for the fact that the runner would have made me ill with the amount of body roll I saw. I got a little motion sick watching the video.
Oh and for those of you that are grammar/spulling/punktuasion impared.
yeah you don't know wtf your talkng about that rilg iz baller your just mad cuz you aint done nuthin but cral at the mal and zhit ill meat you anywere and sho u how to be a reel man on the roks
I think I may have vomited a little while typing that......
Now don't get all freaky on me and call me names but I couldn't see anything "really" wrong with either of them, except for the fact that the runner would have made me ill with the amount of body roll I saw. I got a little motion sick watching the video.
Oh and for those of you that are grammar/spulling/punktuasion impared.
yeah you don't know wtf your talkng about that rilg iz baller your just mad cuz you aint done nuthin but cral at the mal and zhit ill meat you anywere and sho u how to be a reel man on the roks
I think I may have vomited a little while typing that......
Sep 24, 2008 | 02:34 PM
#84
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,515
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From: Plainfield, IL
Let another "speed bump wheeling stocker" chime in here. From watching the video the only thing I could see that I didn't like (and quite possibly don't understand) is that the 4 runner suspension seemed "mushy" and it leaned all over the place. The pickup on the other hand didn't wobble around as much and seemed to take the rocks and such a lot easier.
Now don't get all freaky on me and call me names but I couldn't see anything "really" wrong with either of them, except for the fact that the runner would have made me ill with the amount of body roll I saw. I got a little motion sick watching the video.
Oh and for those of you that are grammar/spulling/punktuasion impared.
yeah you don't know wtf your talkng about that rilg iz baller your just mad cuz you aint done nuthin but cral at the mal and zhit ill meat you anywere and sho u how to be a reel man on the roks
I think I may have vomited a little while typing that......
Now don't get all freaky on me and call me names but I couldn't see anything "really" wrong with either of them, except for the fact that the runner would have made me ill with the amount of body roll I saw. I got a little motion sick watching the video.
Oh and for those of you that are grammar/spulling/punktuasion impared.
yeah you don't know wtf your talkng about that rilg iz baller your just mad cuz you aint done nuthin but cral at the mal and zhit ill meat you anywere and sho u how to be a reel man on the roks
I think I may have vomited a little while typing that......
Sep 24, 2008 | 03:14 PM
#86
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Definitions of "discussion":
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an exchange of views on some topic; "we had a good discussion"; "we had a word or two about it"
Definitions of "disusing":
to discontinue the use or practice of
Last edited by Matt16; Sep 24, 2008 at 03:16 PM.
Sep 24, 2008 | 06:12 PM
#87
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Joined: Mar 2008
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From: Texas
The suspension charecteristics you described is due to the weight of the 4runner. The body pulls the suspension as much as the terrain. When I was taller I had excellent pictures of huge flex but now that im lower the suspension never really works as hard to keep all 4's down. Pickups are lighter and more importantly the pickups have a lower COG
So is spring rate (not sure about the term) that important? I thought that all springs were pretty much the same and you determined "rebound" with the shocks. That rig looked to have Bilstien remotes installed and it was still sort of unstable, as far as I could tell.
When I go SAS is there some "magic" spring that I should look for? Or some "walk through the closet door into Narnia" shock/spring/flex thing that I should be searching? I don't ask this in jest I really need to know. I don't want to build a rig that, although flexes like a deamon, puts my life or the life of my family in harms way due to incorrect ability.
Thank you.
Sep 24, 2008 | 06:14 PM
#88
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Joined: Mar 2008
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From: Texas
Refrain from posting until you a)can spell b) are willing to read the previous posts, glean at least some of the relevant information in order to add at least something productive to the discussion.
Definitions of "discussion":
an extended communication (often interactive) dealing with some particular topic; "the book contains an excellent discussion of modal logic"; "his ...
an exchange of views on some topic; "we had a good discussion"; "we had a word or two about it"
Definitions of "disusing":
to discontinue the use or practice of
Definitions of "discussion":
an extended communication (often interactive) dealing with some particular topic; "the book contains an excellent discussion of modal logic"; "his ...
an exchange of views on some topic; "we had a good discussion"; "we had a word or two about it"
Definitions of "disusing":
to discontinue the use or practice of
Nail on the head.
By the way, how is that York working for you? Have you put all 4 tires on the rim (flat) and timed the inflation rate? I went to find my York last week and recalled that I sold it with the Scout. I'll source another when I get some other "issues" worked out. Let me know and don't be surprised when I ask for pictures and schematics.
Last edited by Junkers88; Sep 24, 2008 at 06:18 PM.
Sep 24, 2008 | 06:17 PM
#89
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 8,875
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From: Longmont, CO
Springs are what support the weight of the vehicle - spring rate is indeed CRITICAL. Of course, you have to consider the suspension as a system, and there is a huge interaction between spring rates and shock rates.
You're definitely asking the right questions, doing the proper research before just throwing a SFA under your rig as the web-wheelers advise.
You're definitely asking the right questions, doing the proper research before just throwing a SFA under your rig as the web-wheelers advise.
Sep 24, 2008 | 06:23 PM
#91
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,371
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From: Texas
Springs are what support the weight of the vehicle - spring rate is indeed CRITICAL. Of course, you have to consider the suspension as a system, and there is a huge interaction between spring rates and shock rates.
You're definitely asking the right questions, doing the proper research before just throwing a SFA under your rig as the web-wheelers advise.
You're definitely asking the right questions, doing the proper research before just throwing a SFA under your rig as the web-wheelers advise.
Sep 24, 2008 | 07:19 PM
#93
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,415
Likes: 9
From: Phx, AZ
So... everyone understands that wheeling and building rigs is a constant state of progression, right?
Who really knows what stage this 4Runner is in? First trail day or forgotten how many runs. Perhaps the owner is working on his setup or simply learning how to better drive the vehicle with it's current mods.
Research, design, build, wheel... repeat. I for one will probably never feel my rig is "perfect" and I am sure most hold this mindset as well. Otherwise, why would we all spend so much time talking about mods here on YT in the first place.
Who really knows what stage this 4Runner is in? First trail day or forgotten how many runs. Perhaps the owner is working on his setup or simply learning how to better drive the vehicle with it's current mods.
Research, design, build, wheel... repeat. I for one will probably never feel my rig is "perfect" and I am sure most hold this mindset as well. Otherwise, why would we all spend so much time talking about mods here on YT in the first place.
Sep 24, 2008 | 07:26 PM
#94
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Joined: Oct 2007
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Springs are what support the weight of the vehicle - spring rate is indeed CRITICAL. Of course, you have to consider the suspension as a system, and there is a huge interaction between spring rates and shock rates.
You're definitely asking the right questions, doing the proper research before just throwing a SFA under your rig as the web-wheelers advise.
You're definitely asking the right questions, doing the proper research before just throwing a SFA under your rig as the web-wheelers advise.
I chose the OMEs due to a neck/ spinal injury I suffered from high-speed rockcrawling**, but this means I have to go slower on technical sections and obstacles. This means dual cases have jumped up the priority list.
**Collided with a rockslide on the highway, then was rear ended by a dumptruck with forced my over/ through/ into boulders. All in a Volkwagen.
Last edited by Matt16; Sep 24, 2008 at 07:30 PM.
Sep 24, 2008 | 07:31 PM
#95
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Joined: Sep 2004
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From: Plainfield, IL
I didn't realize a runner was that much heavier than a truck. I mean I have a camper shell on mine and a 200lb camping box in the back and it still seems "light". Of course I'm only on 31's with stock springs.
So is spring rate (not sure about the term) that important? I thought that all springs were pretty much the same and you determined "rebound" with the shocks. That rig looked to have Bilstien remotes installed and it was still sort of unstable, as far as I could tell.
When I go SAS is there some "magic" spring that I should look for? Or some "walk through the closet door into Narnia" shock/spring/flex thing that I should be searching? I don't ask this in jest I really need to know. I don't want to build a rig that, although flexes like a deamon, puts my life or the life of my family in harms way due to incorrect ability.
Thank you.
So is spring rate (not sure about the term) that important? I thought that all springs were pretty much the same and you determined "rebound" with the shocks. That rig looked to have Bilstien remotes installed and it was still sort of unstable, as far as I could tell.
When I go SAS is there some "magic" spring that I should look for? Or some "walk through the closet door into Narnia" shock/spring/flex thing that I should be searching? I don't ask this in jest I really need to know. I don't want to build a rig that, although flexes like a deamon, puts my life or the life of my family in harms way due to incorrect ability.
Thank you.
That being said I cant say I would have done anything different. I would still buy a Marlin SAS kit 4"/5". I would have maybe played with the packs to get a little lower and later put the leafs back in to keep it from getting too low. But all im saying is dont over think it. make a decision wheel the crap out of it and make necessary adjustments.
Sep 24, 2008 | 09:24 PM
#97
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 2,906
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From: Woodinville, wa
Keep in mind I pulled a pack out of the rear after this pic was taken and its lower with the new motor in front too. My friends single cab SAS'd rig is more unstable than mine and the same height!
My tires also stick out about 6" which saved me here for sure. Never stuck and drove out of it 
God I love it
Sep 24, 2008 | 09:29 PM
#100
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 2,906
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From: Woodinville, wa
Just found this too
Scary on 35'x12.5 on 8" wheels Cant believe I didnt go over but can give you an idea about how much it does take to take it over! Way to tall and Yes I know
When in doubt? Gas It!
In my case just keep drivin! I hate it when people stop on the trail!
Scary on 35'x12.5 on 8" wheels Cant believe I didnt go over but can give you an idea about how much it does take to take it over! Way to tall and Yes I know
When in doubt? Gas It!
In my case just keep drivin! I hate it when people stop on the trail!
