tatownhawk

Apologies in advance if this has been covered before but I've searched multiple times and couldn't quite find the answers I need in any previous threads....

First, some details... it is a manual tranny.

I'm having trouble separating the bell housing from the motor. In particular, how do I get to the top two bolts on the bell housing? Also, what is the easiest way to get to the motor mount bolts?

Finally, I bought a 750 lb engine stand recently. Will this support the 3vze with everything still attached? And finally, I've never put an engine on a stand so any pointers here would be appreciated. Thanks everybody!


Update- I finally got to all the bolts on the bellhousing. I went ahead and removed the clutch release cylinder and starter, then finally the exhaust (I took a tip from rune's thread and sawed off the crossover pipe- which had antifreeze in it?) and unbolted the motormounts after supporting with the hoist.

My newest problem is that as I tried to lift the engine out the bell housing tried to come with it. There is an obvious gap between the two at the top but it still seems tight between the bottom of the block and bell housing. I did notice I still had the truck in gear (even though its on four jackstands) so I took it out of gear without depressing the clutch.... no change, it's still tight. I then tried prying between the bell housing and spot where the starter connects to the bell housing and bent the small bracket out a bit. What am I missing? Do I have to drop the cross member bracket and force the tranny back? Any more suggestions would be appreciated cause I'm banging my head against the manifold here!

thook

I'm surprised...there are two threads I can think off hand that talk about how to seperate the motor and tranny. Hm...

No matter.....here's what you can do. First, I hope you have a bottle jack (works best) or something under the motor. If the input shaft is binding from the motor and tranny being kinked at an angle, you'll have a hard time no matter what. Plus, you could damage the splines. Anyway, to reach the two bolts lower the tranny assembly down (hopefully you have a tranny jack or equivalent) until it is pulling the motor down at a lower angle....within reason, of course. Don't damage anything.This means also lowering the bottle jack as much you can while it's still lending support to the motor. Use some long extensions (a wobble extension or two helps tremendously) and a cheater or breaker bar, if necessary. Others have just reached through the shifter hole in the floor. Either way will work. To pull it, you can use a come-a-long or ratchet strap tied to the transfer case (or tranny, if you have removed the t-case..?) and the rear axle. Tighten it up just until there is a fair amount of tension and pry and wiggle the assembly away from the motor. You may have to play with the positioning of the two jacks. Tapping with a shop hammer might help, but the patented wiggle method has not failed me.

Can't tell you about the engine stand, though. I've never used one.

WFO

I reached through the driver side fender well to get the top 2 bolts on mine. Small hands are nice for these.

Paitence paitence paitence

Just take your time and dont break anything.

runethechamp

You can reach both the top bolts from underneath the car with transmission and engine all in place. Just need a couple of extensions and a u-joint.
The bolts shouldn't be stuck very hard. Remember you need to take the starter out as well to do the separation. The motor mount bolts I got to from the wheel wells and from the top (but then I had taken off a lot of accessories) first.

I think the 750 lb stand should be fine. Use the big bolt holes (I think there are 6, use 4 of them) from where the transmission connects. Depending on your stand, the existing bolts might be long enough to do the job here.

Word of caution, the engine is VERY top heavy when you first mount it with heads and plenums and things attached. Make sure the pin that locks the rotation of the engine on the stand is safely secured.

tatownhawk

Thanks for some of these tips guys, I'll be trying them out this afternoon!

I have the entire thing on jacks now, but after looking at a 3.4 swap thread I just noticed that I won't have clearance for the hoist. Doh! And I'm pretty sure after seeing some pictures that my intake assembly might possibly be the nastiest yet! Pics to follow...

tatownhawk

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/5480/cimg0394xt8.jpg

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/9977/cimg0387du3.jpg

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/7762/cimg0401yc2.jpg


Here are a few of the beginning photos... I need to remember to bring my camera along with the orange cleaner this weekend!

TNRabbit

Holy Crap, that's a dirty engine!

4JOGGER

I could smell it through the computer

tatownhawk

Update- Yet again today I've been stumped...

I pulled off the stiffener plates between the block and bell housing. Using a big 7/8 open ended wrench, I tried to wedge in between the block and bellhousing and get it to back off... no luck. Can somebody read the update on my original post and give me a clue about what I'm doing wrong here? I feel like I'm so close to getting this motor out so I can go ahead and get the other one shipped

Also, do I have to unbolt the crossmember support to use the axle to bell housing ratchet-strap method? I didn't want to drop the tranny out but at this point I'll try anything

thook

You do have to unbolt the crossmember to pull on the tranny. I know it's not what you want to do, but if the tranny is on a jack and once you've got the motor out you can easily bolt the tranny assembly back up if you leave on the jack in close proximity to where it will be going back in.

If you can't get the motor seperated any other way, pulling the tranny away is how I'd do it. To me, the biggest bitch of pulling a tranny is mating it back to the motor. But, you'll have to be doing that anyway, so there's nothing to lose, eh?

justinking060310

it would behoove you to remove that crossmember and drop the tail of the transmission down so you get a better angle to get the motor seperated -

you need to envision a straight line from the centerline of the crank to the centerline of the transmission output - if they are not dead straight you will not be able to pull them apart - I assume you have that motor about an inch above the motor mounts, right? and your trying to pull and not getting anywhere? you don't want to pry **TOO** hard, it needs to come apart on its own - it doesnt matter what gear your in or where the clutch pedal is at -

it sounds like you have the tranny strapped to your jack? so unbolt the crossmember(i hope you have an impact gun ) and then drop the tail down and it should help your angle - you are binding on the input shaft of the tranny right now and you need to be very careful not to put too much stress on it.

heres a picture so you can visualize the line from tranny tailshaft to crank

kat

tatownhawk

So I've got a few pics I took while pulling the 3vze and I thought somebody might like to look at some 4mp pictures if they didn't have any before. I also wanted to get some opinions on just how bad this thing looks, cause I've gone through 4 cans of degreaser and 2 cans of GOJO so far

my new friend
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my first shot and why I wound up buying a tranny jack
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Do I have this set up right?
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So where and how do I hook up the motor to the stand? I tried loosening the bolts on the back plate but they were frozen so I sprayed them down. Do I have to get longer bolts? With all the oil above the tranny should I get it rebuilt while I'm doing the motor? Any advice appreciated. Thanks!

evilrho

I'm really glad I came across this thread because I suspect I'll have to do this soon myself. By the way, since a lot of you on this seem to be pretty knowledgeable about this stuff, I'd love it if someone could comment on the thread I started yesterday. It hasn't generated much traffic, and for some reason, it doesn't seem to show up in the searches I do on related keywords. So I hope you all don't mind me jumping in on this thread. Here's the link:

https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f116.../#post50627818

Thanks!

tatownhawk

Any suggestions on how to break those bolts on the back plate over without turning the crank?

Do you guys think my rear leaves are salvageable?

What do I do about the missing bearings on the back plate?

Should I replace the cv joints and install ball spacers while I have the motor and tranny out?

Should I wait till November for NWOR headers?

isaac338

an impact is your friend for the flywheel bolts, mine came right off.

what is the red fluid all over your flywheel? are you running atf in your manual tranny?

foot0069

1. That plate is your flywheel. Looks like it's going to need turning. An impact wrench should break em loose really easy. If you don't have access to one use the longest wrench that fits them you have. Seat the wrench really well on the head of the bolt and while holding the wrench in place with the palm of your hand smack the end with a big hammer. You should break them loose in a back and forth pattern like the book shows ya.

2. Spings look pretty crusty. Hard to tell from phots recomend you have someone check em in person.

3.Those bearings are part of whats called the pilot bearing. It's actually inserted into a recess in the end of the crankshaft, will have to be pulled and replaced.

4.If you were planning on doing that work anyhow go ahead and do it now. Might be easier and for sure with the motor all new it'll drive nicer.

5. Never worked with the V6 but others here make it sound a real bear to do a header with the motor in the truck, I think you put the header on the motor then install the combo.

Good luck Jim

tatownhawk

It might be some residue left over from the degreaser, but I think it's rust... I'll have to check.



Does anyone know if all the gunk in the bellhousing is normal or not?

tatownhawk

So I've gotten a little bit further...

I've got to thank you guys for the hammer and open ended wrench idea to knock those flywheel bolts loose! So I've managed to get the injectors out and pulled the valve covers to take a look. I tried the same hammer routine with the power steering pulley with no success... I can grind off the retaining bolt but I'd still be left with a stuck bearing

RobD

Are you rebuilding or tossing a 3.4 into it?

tatownhawk

I'm ready to replace it with a reman 3.0 right now, but I think I want to tear into it to see if it can be salvaged. Swapping in a 3.4 would be great if I had unlimited resources (see broke college student in wikipedia), but I was thinking about just putting on headers for a little more hp. I plan on keeping this runner for a long time, and I'll be thrilled if I can get another 212k out of this motor.