itonlysmokesalittle

Just looking for ideas. Have an 89 pickup where the 22re was swapped to a 22r. Offehuaser intake, Weber 32/36. The mass airflow is still hooked up and when I unplug it the truck idles down. Makes zero sense to me. Could this be be the ecu messing with the ignition. It sounds almost like if you retarded the timing when the mas gets unplugged.

old87yota

Welcome!

It sounds like your truck has a classic case of a hack job.

As you said, it does not make sense that a part that should only work with the 22R-E EFI setup is affecting your carbureted setup.

It looks like we need to do some more investigating on what is hooked up and what was replaced to make the carbureted setup work. Take some pictures of your engine bay and maybe we can start to see what is going on.

How is the intake hooked up? A picture would help.

Do you still have the ECU in the truck (behind the passenger kick panel)?

The carbureted setup should have a vacuum diaphragms advance / internal weights in the distributor that adjust the ignition timing, with no other computer control.

Just so you know, the 22R-E does not have a mass airflow sensor, rather a simpler "Volume Air Flow Meter" (VAFM or AFM) with a flapper that measures the amount of air going into the engine. Both types of sensors do the same thing, but go about doing it in pretty different ways.

Either way, the Volume Air Flow Meter should not do anything with the Weber 32/36 installed.

itonlysmokesalittle

Ecu is still in place. It's got an vac advanced distributor.

scope103

I believe the VAF affects (among other things) the ignition timing. If you still have the original distributor, you have an igniter, and the timing is controlled by the ECU. Which will affect idle speed. If the distributor was replaced with an old-school all mechanical one (no igniter), then the signal from the VAF SHOULD be going nowhere.

itonlysmokesalittle

Right? ˟˟˟˟ makes no sense. Its got a vac advanced distributor for a 22r so that should be fine. I don't know what would cause it.

snippits

How is the ignition set up?

i see a coil, but don't see an igniter. Maybe I am overlooking it.

Fast Pro(Crane) Ignition Kit is an option.

https://www.lceperformance.com/FAST-...-p/1082021.htm

itonlysmokesalittle

Sorry for the delay internet went so I'm on my mobile. It has the ignitor from the 22re. How much control does the ignitor have?


More interesting stuff. Was digging around around and noticed the ecu does not look like it came from a 89, I believe these were celica, or early 86ish pickup ecus.

superex87

The coil and igniter look like the EFi version So my guess is that even with the vac advance distributor the ecu is still controlling the timing. Its very interesting that it seems to be working that way. I have a 2wd 89 pickup that was factory carb and the ignition coil and igniter are different. If I remember I will snap a picture of mine tomorrow.

snippits

Somebody knew how to Frankenstein it for sure.

If it were mine, I would uninstall the ECU, AFM, igniter, and the the coil and sell those parts. Take the money, and spend it on the Fast ignition kit from LCE. The igniter, ECU, and AFM should bring a good bit of money.

itonlysmokesalittle

Roger, the ignition was the only thing I could think of but I was (and still am actually) unsure if the ecu's role interaction with the igniter, but the symptoms seem just like some weird interface between the ecu and ignition. It will also randomly idle up an down along with other weird ˟˟˟˟.

Yeah this truck is a real hodge podge to say the least. Long story short it was an somewhat running efi truck when I bought it, had real drivability issues so I bought the carb setup and had a guy I know install it while i was working out of town. It ran fairly well with the vaf hooked up but has a fairly noticeable lack of power, but I drove it daily for a while like that. Then a tree fell through the windshield and dented the hood ruining the one redeeming quality of this truck which was its clean body. I disconnected the vaf last night and timed it by ear and it runs noticeably better. Probably going to rebuild the engine soon and get it in decent shape, when I do that I'll get one of those crane ignitions.

scope103

Ah! I'm going to bet the ecm is getting no distributor signal, and so the timing is never advancing. You're just running on base timing. Hence: no power.

Also known as: "blow a hole in a piston." A timing light is only $30 https://www.harborfreight.com/timing...nce-40963.html , and is one of the first tools you should buy if you want to do any work on a vehicle.

snippits

Just noticed this from the pictures. Both ports of the vacuum advance are not hooked up.

I think the port near the radiator goes to a port on the Weber carb. The other port near the valve cover will go to intake manifold vacuum.

From what I can gather, both ports advance the timing. You can pull a vacuum on the advance with the distributor cap removed to confirm. And to see which one moves it the most. You definitely need a timing light!

itonlysmokesalittle

Yeah only port running right now is from the carb to the distributor port near radiator, need a vacuum fitting to get what if I remember right being the idle advance online. (ignore the routing in that first pic its from last year and don't know why its hooked up that way.)

Thought the same, and that is exactly what it used to feel like, a truck running on its base timing 24/7

Have a light couldn't find it, may of got wrecked, thrown out or lost. However its irrelevant for the time being needed to test this theory so I got it in the ballpark understanding its not optimal. Hell piston #2 has come into contact with a valve at some point I'm not overly worried about it, but will get a light on it before long. Meanwhile its sitting

So at this point its buy guns or mess with this truck. Prob gonna be truck miss having a toyota.

Greylux

All I would do is remove all the EFI components, ECU, Igniter, MAF sensor and replace the igniter with the stock Ignition coil for the 22r engine and plug it into the plug on the distributor, set the timing and everything should be fine. the vacuum advance and the electronic timing are fighting each other creating your issue. In your picture i noticed that the distributor was cranked all the way to one side, I would set it to about the middle so it doesn't run like complete ˟˟˟˟ when it starts with the replaced components. I have an extra ignition coil if you want it. Just contact me. Happy Trails!

old87yota

This is what I would do.

snippits

Never worked on an old engine that had a distributor fired coil unless the distributor has points. Otherwise, if there are no points, then I am pretty sure an ignition module(igniter) is needed with a magnetic distributor.

itonlysmokesalittle

If i'm lucky I have a 22r igniter/coil in the barn, if not someone I know is bound to have one. Are the gm conversions any good? I have doubt that its a satisfactory solution or everyone would do them, but who knows.

Really appreciate the time guys.

snippits

I like the DUI. Not sure it would clear the hood though. LCE says for the model compatible with power steering it is longer than stock, and will stick 12 inches out of the head.

https://www.lceperformance.com/D-U-I...-p/1081043.htm

https://performancedistributors.com/...i-distributor/