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I'm slowly working myself up to a full engine rebuild. I'm looking to y'all to either talk me in or out of it! This would be my first automotive engine rebuild on my own. I've done a few Honda 4 motorcycle engines and I helped my dad do a Chevy LS1 when I was in high school. I've already decided to pull the motor to do the head and timing; it seems a lot easier, especially given all the finagling needed just to remove the oil pan. It sounds like the hardest part about removing the motor is the bolts on top of the bell housing but this doesn't worry me. I did a transmission in my 4x4 ranger a couple years back and it was a similar situation, I just pulled the shift boot and used a long extension.
I know the piston rings don't hold up well to mixed oil/coolant but what if I don't see any obvious mixing yet? How much of a risk am I taking by assuming the bottom end is fine? The better question is, if I've got it stripped down to the block, is there any good reason not to pull the pistons and have a look? Will it be easy to recognize damage or wear on the rings? When inspecting the bearings and seals, what am I looking for? Will damage and wear be easy to spot? Lastly, if I get this far, I'd likely consider boring the motor over .030 or perhaps even .040. New pistons are cheap and it would compliment the added performance of the new streetrv head and performance cam. What pro's and con's are there to boring the 22re block?
As always y'all, thanks for all the info. I'm really excited to start this job, I'll probably crack into it as soon as my mother-in-law is out of my hair in a couple of weeks.
Your story is like mine, though I was only a bicycle mechanic so had zero engine skills. What everyone says is true, the 22re is easy to work on.
Hard to know if you'll be ok with just a top end rebuild until you dig in a bit further.
Have you pulled the timing cover? If you see wear marks anywhere in it, you've got metal in the bottom end that won't fully clean out even with a flush.
Damage inside the engine will be obvious with your prior wrenching experience. Bad bearings will be scratched and worn through in spots. They're made of multiple layers of different metals. The rings might've snapped. If they haven't, you can measure the ring gap with digital calipers and see how much they've worn.
Just post photos of the process along the way if you're not sure of something.
Your story is like mine, though I was only a bicycle mechanic so had zero engine skills. What everyone says is true, the 22re is easy to work on.
Hard to know if you'll be ok with just a top end rebuild until you dig in a bit further.
Have you pulled the timing cover? If you see wear marks anywhere in it, you've got metal in the bottom end that won't fully clean out even with a flush.
Damage inside the engine will be obvious with your prior wrenching experience. Bad bearings will be scratched and worn through in spots. They're made of multiple layers of different metals. The rings might've snapped. If they haven't, you can measure the ring gap with digital calipers and see how much they've worn.
Just post photos of the process along the way if you're not sure of something.
As soon as I can, I'm going to pull this motor and get it on a stand. I'm actually really looking forward to the job. It's not what I had planned for my summer but I reckon it will be a rewarding process. Many pics to come. Thanks for you for your input!
Mine started as a timing guide job but turned into a full rebuild. I decided to pull it last minute ands found my main bearings were shot and it was time anyway. This was with 200k. If i were you, peace of mind is in the full rebuild. Its not that much more.
Not sure why you blew your gasket but sounds like it's just on the exhaust side from what I've read in your posts. You may not have any oil to water transfer at this point. You mentioned a stop leak product just to get you by. That is a 100% no on that idea. I know better than most what your plans are with this rig and that will cause permanent damage to some degree.
Back to why it blew. Most common cause is overheat. With that said, since you are going to pull your engine. Go ahead and remove the grille and radiator. It will be easier to get out with those parts off of there and you can take it to a radiator shop and have it checked/cleaned out while you do your other work.
On the oversized pistons. Nothing wrong with it but I would advise against taking it all the way to the max. Leave yourself some room in the event that the machine shop were to scar the bore or anything else I can't think of. If I were going to do it, I'd take it no farther than .30. You should go ahead and do a compression and leak down test at this point. That will give you an idea as to the condition of the rings and at the same time help you lock down where your HG leak is. Most of the time they are easy to spot with the head off but not always. Knowing where your leak is will be useful info in the future. No way to go back and get this info after it's off.
Remember, you were low on oil when you drove up here a couple months ago but you had enough sense to fill it up and keep a check on it. The PO may have let it run low more than a few times. Engine rebuild may not be a bad idea. I know I would if I pulled mine.
Not sure why you blew your gasket but sounds like it's just on the exhaust side from what I've read in your posts. You may not have any oil to water transfer at this point. You mentioned a stop leak product just to get you by. That is a 100% no on that idea. I know better than most what your plans are with this rig and that will cause permanent damage to some degree.
Back to why it blew. Most common cause is overheat. With that said, since you are going to pull your engine. Go ahead and remove the grille and radiator. It will be easier to get out with those parts off of there and you can take it to a radiator shop and have it checked/cleaned out while you do your other work.
On the oversized pistons. Nothing wrong with it but I would advise against taking it all the way to the max. Leave yourself some room in the event that the machine shop were to scar the bore or anything else I can't think of. If I were going to do it, I'd take it no farther than .30. You should go ahead and do a compression and leak down test at this point. That will give you an idea as to the condition of the rings and at the same time help you lock down where your HG leak is. Most of the time they are easy to spot with the head off but not always. Knowing where your leak is will be useful info in the future. No way to go back and get this info after it's off.
Remember, you were low on oil when you drove up here a couple months ago but you had enough sense to fill it up and keep a check on it. The PO may have let it run low more than a few times. Engine rebuild may not be a bad idea. I know I would if I pulled mine.
I know better than a stop-leak, that stuff can gunk up all kinds of small cavities throughout the motor, I guess I was just hopeful some miracle product had hit the market that might buy me a couple of weeks (which is all I really need).
I have watched a handful of videos on pulling the motor and read a bunch of threads here and on other forums. Seems pretty straight forward. Remove hood, radiator, shroud, fan. Disconnect exhaust (hopefully no studs break), throttle cable, and harness at computer and feed through firewall. Remove bolts from bell housing and 4 motor mounts and voila! I just wish I had a 3.4L to put back in it's place like you do!
I talked with Ted at Engnbldr about oversized pistons and he said there is no effective performance gain unless I went with a high-compression setup. I will inspect the cylinder walls once it's apart and have them bored over only enough to clean them up, if necessary, and purchase new pistons and rings to suit.
As for the oil consumption you saw on my trip up to Kentucky, I've definitely got a bad main seal, if not a leak from the oil pan as well. It's hard to tell if the oil that's around the brim of the pan is just from the main seal or a combination. I'll definitely be replacing the main seal along with the oil pump when I do the front. I look forward to the piece of mind of a truck that doesn't leak or burn a drop of oil. With proper maintenance, that should be the case for most of it's life. I'm also looking forward to getting the motor out and de-gunking absolutely everything and tackling some cleaning and coating of frame components. I really wish I had a lift!
I"m thinking I'll be able to start pulling the motor in a couple of weeks, I wish I could start sooner but things are too busy right now. Thanks for your input, Charchee.
When you pull the motor, you'll be able to see your leak. Mine leaks but not enough that it ever makes it to the pavement. I first thought oil pan, then the rear main, later decided it was my oil cooler and after resealing it, was wrong again. My leak actually comes from the back of the heads where there is a cap at the end of the cam. Leaks between there and the valve cover even after a thorough valve cover replacement job. Point is, it's super difficult to lock down a leak on the back of the engine where you can't see but you will when it's out of there.
The bell housing bolts aren't difficult. That is, if you assemble the correct configuration of socket, wobble, six inch extension and twelve inch extension along with a flex handle ratchet. Sounds complicated but when you get the right rig put together, it's not that bad. I would say to pull the two upper bolts first so if, for any reason, your engine or transmission shifts a bit, you aren't fighting an alignment issue while you are working on the hardest two. The others are easy. Unbolt your motor mounts last.
Go ahead and rebuild your clutch and throw out bearing while you have access. You'll cuss yourself down the line if you don't and then have to separate the two again.
On your exhaust studs and nuts, start soaking them now. If you do drive the truck, hit them with some good penetrating oil as soon as you get home while it's hot and the oil will be sucked up into the threads. Use only a tight fitting six point socket on them. Once you round one off, you are going to be in a bind because it will be next to impossible to get a grinder in some of those tight spaces. Heat them up or even let them break if you have to. Just don't get frustrated and round them off. They will not round off with a good socket on them and aligned properly, no matter how hard you pull on them.
I've been limping along by topping off the cooling system with water before each trip but today, while on the highway, i started hearing a helluva knock.
Pulled over, truck died, got it started enough to park it and ive got an insane knock coming from the top end. Sounds like the timing chain slapping the timing cover.
Tow's on the way and I'm having it dropped at my shop. I'll start prepping the motor to be pulled as soon as my mother-in-law leaves town.
Looks like I'll be commuting on ol' Goldie Honda, our 1971 CB350, until I get the rebuild done.
The one in the foreground is a 75 CB360 I nearly died on in January. Somebody pulled out in front of me while I was traveling at 50 mph. Broke collar bone in two spots, 6 ribs and the shoulder blade. Had contusions on my lung, in hospital for a week, surgery and out of work for a month. Bike looks pretty good considering!
Pick you up a paint pen and a roll of duck tape. Go ahead and start marking all of your connections on both ends. Like I said before, I would pull that radiator out and have it looked at. You are not going to ever have a better opportunity to get that done. Don't know if you have ever pulled your grille off but it's really simple and will give you some better access to the front of the truck. Oh, and some of your coolant lines are going to be a b**** to get off. You may want to go ahead and order any that look bad or act like they may be stuck during your prep work. May not be that bad on your engine but some of the ones on the back of a 3VZE are really tough to get off. I had to pull a 200 lb radiator out of a big truck twice this week. Time is money so I just order new hoses as soon as I know I'm about to pull one and then cut them.
Pick you up a paint pen and a roll of duck tape. Go ahead and start marking all of your connections on both ends. Like I said before, I would pull that radiator out and have it looked at. You are not going to ever have a better opportunity to get that done. Don't know if you have ever pulled your grille off but it's really simple and will give you some better access to the front of the truck. Oh, and some of your coolant lines are going to be a b**** to get off. You may want to go ahead and order any that look bad or act like they may be stuck during your prep work. May not be that bad on your engine but some of the ones on the back of a 3VZE are really tough to get off. I had to pull a 200 lb radiator out of a big truck twice this week. Time is money so I just order new hoses as soon as I know I'm about to pull one and then cut them.
Paint pens are on my list and I think I'll take your advice and just cut any hoses out that are bad. I know the lower main hose into the radiator is hard as a rock. PO put a new (cheapo) radiator in this thing when he did the water pump. The single puff of white smoke upon starting it in the morning that it's always done, along with the parts he replaced tell me the truck was run hot and probably always had a breach in the HG that has just gotten worse with time.
Its possible, as well, that the out of whack timing due to the slack in the timing chain may have contributed to the truck running hotter than normal. I'm going to do everything in my power to ensure this truck never runs hot again. I'll be getting a dual valve thermostat and I may replace the radiator with a higher end unit.
I found a kickass, old school machine shop that's going to work on my block. They said they'd soak and flush the block before and after machining, so that's reassuring.
I'm chomping at the bit to start this job, just bought a hydraulic hoist and I've got a buddy lined up to help me pull the engine and get it on the stand. My shop is in the mezzanine of a big warehouse. We'll likely lad the engine and stand onto a pallet and forklift it up to my shop, where I'll do the rebuild.
Rebuilding something when you have multiple reasons for spending the money is a lot more fun than doing one just because on one known or suspected issue. I bet your right about this being a preexisting condition after seeing that there was a cheapo replacement radiator in there.
That's real cool that you found you a machine shop like that. You need a place like that where you can build a relationship with the techs. Those kind of folks will take care of you. Get to know them well enough to where you can ask them to fix something the way they would do it if it were there's, and you'll really have a partner in your projects.
Between Ted at Engnbldr, my local machine shop, support from this forum and the time and patience to do this right, I'm very much looking forward to the end result. I just wish I could get started. I'm dying to get started.
Well spotted! It says, "Don't wait." She got it on a lark, coming home drunk from a terrible shift. She's a filmmaker and we were living in Denver at the time where there was no film industry and she was working at a vegan restaurant. Not long after, we moved to New Orleans where her work has thrived.
05-16-2017, 06:34 AM
