crawler#976

First off, truck specs:

SAS'd 1987, 2 stock t'cases, 5.29:1 r/p, full spool rear locked, Detroit front locker. I rotate tires every 2000 miles due to the accelerated wear caused by a spool.

I finished building the truck in August of 2001 and purchased 5 new 35" BFG M/T's- a tire I'd used for years with good results for general 4x4'n. For severe use, they didn't hold up very well. Of the 5, I had 2 sidewall failures, and one tread failure (tore two whole lugs off down to the cords). The rubber compound was very stiff and not very flexible. After 14,000 miles of daily driving and up to 4.5 rated trail use, they were totally shot. Large chunks of rubber had been torn out of all 5 tires.

In August of 2002 I bought 4 new 35" Goodyear MT/R's. The rubber compound was very soft and flexible compared w/ the BFG- I was skeptical of how long they’d last, but had heard good reports from other wheelers who run the same type of trails I do. One guy who has F/R ARB's had over 30,000 on a set!

I was immediately impressed with the traction of the MT/R's- not just in rocks, but also in all the conditions I drive in. They were better in mud, snow and sand, and MUCH better in rocky conditions than the BFG's. They flexed better at low pressure, seemed to be almost immune to sidewall damage, and I had very little tread chunking for the first 15,000 miles or so. Up until a little over half the tread was gone (at about 12,000 miles) they performed outstanding, but after that, the wear accelerated pretty quickly. I've not been driving it on a daily basis since Sept of last year, so the miles I've put on them since have been all hard miles.

I've run all the moderate trails off Table Mesa Rd. in Arizona at least 2 times on this set of tires, that includes Lower and Upper Raw Deal, Lower and Upper Terminator (probably been thru the Terminators 4 times), Judgment Day, and Predator 3 times. I've driven 1000's of miles of dirt roads/trails, been in heavy snow, deep mud, sand, I ran Claw Hammer at last years Jambo @ the Hammer's, all with out even a minor problem (other than losing a bead). Up until the 20th of March- no problems at all!

After we decided to do a marathon run on Table Mesa- we did 4 trails in 5 hours- I finally punched a hole thru a sidewall. By then, the tires only had about a 1/4" of tread left, and to get good traction, I aired down to 8 PSI. The tread blocks were short and stiff, and they were getting pretty torn up- but, I had 19,100 miles of hard use on'm.

19,100 miles vs. 14,000. Not bad at all for a much better tire. They are a bit more expensive- the BFG's are $156.00 each; I paid $174.00 apiece for the MT/R's in 2002.

I bought a fresh set yesterday- at the same price, $174.00, and now that I trailer the truck to anything more than 60 miles away, they "should" last me several years. The spool on asphalt caused probably 80% of the wear- so I really do expect them to last a lot longer. I think a rig w/ a selectable locker could get 40,000 out of a set- the spool literally eats tires.

Later

Mark

anthony1

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the write up. I got a set just like yours...

Jeff the marmot

Nice write-up. I got 45K miles, 2 seasons of ice racing, and plenty of hard trails out of my first set of 285/75R16 MT/R's. I'm on my second set now.

gt5816v

I just got a set of 35s. Glad to hear it was a good investment!!!!

doink

thats pretty informative. that definitely just aided my decision for whenever i get new tires.

MNBOY

Mark,
Good, informative write-up. The comparison between those and the BFGs is good to see also. I've been happy with the performance of my BFGs, but I agree with you on their toughness. This past fall I sliced up one sidewall on the Desoto Mine run I did with you, resulting in failure a week later in Moab, where I trashed a second tire due to sidewall failure. For a tire company that rants about their three-ply sidewall toughness I expected more.
One thing I'm wondering about is how either of these compare to Swampers. From what I've heard the performance of the Interco tires are comparable, but they have a very short lifespan when used on pavement. Anyone have any firsthand experience to confirm this?
Thanks again for the information, Mark.

Stump1883

I just got a set of 35 MT/R's myself, glad to hear I made a good investment. I have a selectable and knowing that your tread wear was from the spool makes me even more confiedent. Thanks for the time and insight you put into writting that.

Jeff the marmot

If you're talking about SSR's, my friend went through about a dozen SSR's due to flats off-road in the few thousand miles that he used them. They cracked around the lugs and chunked so severely that their total usable mileage would have been less than a couple thousand miles anyway (despite replacing them so frequently due to flats). He changed to MT/R's a year ago and hasn't had any flats or problems since. If your question is referring to TSL's, then I don't know.

Serith

we got a lot of mud/muddy trails arond here, and ive heard MT/R's suck in mud. you say they are good. how do they really compare with MUD ONLY campared to BFG's? very good info though, i need a better street tire.

WolfpackTLC

MT/R's do well in compost type, grainy mud... mud w/ a rough consistency.... dark mud.... They HATE red clay and suck in the sand... I know this from experience in both. Here in NC they're ok for wheeling, but really shine out west... (Moab comes to mind... my old 37's kicked butt) They pack FAST w/ red clay and such, but shed ok w/ some wheel spin. They DO NOT clean well @ low speeds like a Bogger or an SX or even the IROK... but then again, those tires are CRAP on the street.

joez

MTR's compared to a TSL? There is no comparison. Compared to a SSR? I would run the MTR's over an SSR. From eveyone i wheel with who has MTR's, they do OK, the clean better than the BFG's and are tougher, but they are not TSL's. For a good dual purpose tire, i wouldnt hessitate to get a set of the goodyears, but if you see more trail than road miles, there is no substitute for a bias ply swamper. At least not here in the midwest.

Nice write up, im glad to hear how well they work out west. Im at a toss up of getting a set of MTR's or the Trxus MT's for my K5. Even though it is a tow rig it still sees dirt. One question, any plans on siping the MTR's?

MNBOY

Sorry, I wasn't very specific, I was thinking of the TSLs. When I bought my current BFGs I wanted the 33x9.5x15 size, but it had been discontinued when they redesigned the tires, so I was thinking of going with the 34x9.5x15 TSLs instead, but wasn't sure how they compared.

sschaefer3

My 285/75/16 Goodyear MT/Rs were very noisey on the road, not at first but durring the 2nd half of the tread wear, were extremely hard to balance and fell out of balance quickly, were expensive in comparison to other tires. They worked very well off-road.

My current Yokohama Geolander AT's have been down the same trials, Martinez, Upper Woodpecker, Log Corral ( 3 BTG buggys but the dust on this but not the Yokos). Mark from Vegas ran MTR's on Log and My Yokos and his MTR's did the same even thought the wet rocks and water.

I would not buy another set. So far the Yokos have done just as well and cost a fraction of the price. I will be in Moab over Memoral Day and I would take the street slicks any day on all that traction.

sschaefer3

Before anyone starts wineing, the only place I wheel is the dry rain less desert.

No swamps, no mud, no bogs, no trees & no snow.

Just fine for the Desert.

bobzemuda

I'm extremely jealous of those of you that do not have to contend with mud.

In Missouri, it is completely unavoidable. If you go out, you are going to spin through some mud at some point. Sounds like the NC description above. Sometimes it's just wet mud, but a lot of times, it's high in clay and packs the hell out of your tires where it doesn't matter if you've got mud tires or the Revo's like me.

I still want mud tires.

Flygtenstein

Interesting to hear some real world info.

I stayed away from BFG MT's because I heard the sidewall was really weak and generally people thought they could find a better tire. My web wheeling pointed me towards MT/R's which were pretty close to the BFG's.

With about 25k on mine, I have mixed feelings.
Wheeling around the southwest, they have done well. Good dry rock traction, good muddy rock traction and pretty awesome slickrock traction. These were on trails in Arizona, Moab, New Mexico and Colorado.

In the land of Cheese, they did not do well in pure mud. Part of that may have been not having enough power to spin them clean.

On the road, I have had nothing but issues with balancing. They have not gotten or stayed balanced for more than a week at a time. Thankfully I have free lifetime balance on them. They hum, but I would not call it bad by my standards. I also listen to ghetto bass and have pretty high tolerance for noise.

My next set will be at least 35's, so it will probably be on beadlocks in which case the issues I have with the MT/R's will be the least of my worries.

crawler#976

Joez

I currently have no plans to sipe them. The spool does a pretty good job of tearing up tires anyway, and I'd suspect the siping would just lead to more wear. BajaTaco has siped his MT/R's, but he is running selectable lockers front and rear.

________________________


I had decided to get some 36x12.5-15 TSL's- until the pice of gas went outta site. My plan was to retire the Toy from commuting, but driving a GMC 7.4L 3/4T back and forth to work is costing me about $45.00 a week. I won't be taking the Toy everyday, but at least 2 days a week will help some. The TSL's or TSL/SX, especially the SX's, are by far and away the best off-highway tires made. But, they wear increadibly fast on pavement- my wheelin buddy has about 3500 miles on a set of 33x13.5-15 LTB/TSL's and has worn off about 3/16 of tread already!

later

joez

I hear you on the TSL's. Had i bought the BBC truck i was looking at i would not have bought the tires i did for the toyota. But the diesel gets me arround 22-25 mpg depending on how hard i drive it. It gets better than the toy. Since toyota is pretty much just going to see trails, i went ahead and just bought the TSL's. Unfortunatly I grooved them before i even mounted them, i wish i had waited to see how well they worked before, but hindsight is always 20/20. When they start chunking and wearing out ill sipe them to see if tire siping lives up to the hype.

I think ill just end up with the MTR's for my tow rig, what do your 35's actually measure? Do they run a little small, or pretty close to marked size?

crawler#976

joez,

They are about 34-1/4 mounted on 15 x 8" rims w/ air pressure at 18 PSI. I don't have much pressure in'm to keep'm wearing flat. Discount Tire had'm at 32 PSI, so I was running on about 6" of tread in the center.......

Joe

Well, looks like someone needs to provide aide & comfort to BFG, so I'll volunteer. I ran BFG 33" M/Ts for 40K and they still had life left in them and they saw a couple of off-road trips each to Arizona and Moab, as well as, a lot of damn tough logging trails. I had the two middle rows siped. The siping caused minor "chunking" but seemed to help some in the snow & ice. The tires did extremely well in "bog" conditions that only you duck hunters could appreciate. I think the BFG will outshine the MTR in mud conditions and I know they don't take a back seat to the MTR in the rocks relative to performance. The single bitch I have with the BFG's is their soft sidewalls. They are very resistant to punctures but scuff and cut very easily. After a couple of runs in those damn sharp Arizona rock trails, they'll look like they went through the Civil War without a gun. The cuts are normally superficial and don't present any type of a problem. I always ran low pressure in the rocks and picked my way through slowly. I imagine if one ran pressures above 18#s and used a little "momentum", you might be able to trash one, but then again, the same probably could be said for the MTRs. The MTRs are good off-road tires, no doubt about it, but I'll be right there with you in my BFGs, and the only difference at the end of the day will be that your sidewalls probably won't possess as many "cosmetic" dings as mine, but if you look at the "blemishes" as battle scars, then all is well. Some drivers might have a dealer friend that can be talked into "probing" around in the cut a little and then come up with the conclusion that it should be replaced, but most of us just keep on trucking. By the way, I'm running the BFG Krawlers now and they are the cat's ass - so if you "stall" out on aftershock Steve S., just duck, 'cause I'll just have to roll on over the top of ya.