Jdizzydub

Don't wanna sound dense, but why the heck do they mislead by putting "synthetic blend" vs "fully synthetic" on their bottles?? Are they just saying it is?? cus that would piss me off, i use M1 and have since I got my runner, i change it every 5-7k.

wizzells

Ive been reading BITOG for about 5 years now. This discussion takes place over there all the time and there is ALWAYS the same conclusion. That Mobil 1 is primarily group IV PAO base stock. That is the mere definition of a "synthetic" motor oil. Nothing deceiving about that. It is a well-built oil based on premium base stock. I challenge you to find me some hard facts as to Mobil being misleading.
If anyone has ever been deceiving on the matter it was Castrol with their sytec line of oils. These oils are all over the map in regards to their base stocks. Testing has shown many of theirs to be hydrocracked group III (read: severly refined petroleum base), with the rare instance when they manufacture something truely amazing, like the 0w-30, or 5w-40.

X-AWDriver

If M1 isn't a synthetic then provide a link where you saw it so we can see for ourselves since I couldn't find it on BITOG.

I've read this before about M1 and from that thread and the info provided it showed M1 was a true synthetic but I'll have to do some digging myself.

mkgarrison5

no one really knows nor does the M1 support people tell you.. thats what i got out of the chatter at BITOG.. to me it doesnt matter. the wear #'s are what i look at and M1 sucks compared to other name brand syns. BUT this also depends on the motor and the driver also. some motors are harder on oil like turbos and super charged vehicles..M1 would be my LAST choice for super charged motors and turbos.. penzoil platinum is top dog right for over the counter synthetic...

btw the defintion in AMERICA for synthetic oil is groupIII or better.. in Europe group III is not defined as synthetic... all marketing ploy! hell, penzoil yellow bottle, GTX and Maxlife dino oils have shown better wear #'s within the 5k mile mark than M1...

on top of all this i was told by someone who worked for mobil/exxon and shell and said that M1 is subpar for syn motor oil.. they arent what they used to be. most is marketing hype now..

mkgarrison5

its marketing dude! striclty marketing.. Mobil dumps an ass load of $$ in marketing and seem to be not in their labs where they need to make an improvement... its funny you have guys say "yeah well nascar uses it"..... i want to crap myself when i hear that.. its not even the same damn oil DUH!! kind of like people saying that BF AT's are top notch bc Baja uses them.. simply dumb ass statements.

mkgarrison5

yeah i ran M1 for a long time till i got educated on motor oils and marketing.. my tacoma tick was very loud when i ran M1.. the research i did on that only came back that M1 is on the thin side of a 30wt range compared to other syns. this includes 10w30. when i switched to another syn its not as loud.. granted this isnt proof whether or not M1 is good oil or not.. M1 is good oil, though imo its overpriced and overrated..

mt_goat

Ok, next trip to wally world I'm getting a couple jugs of PP.

BTW before I added an extra engine oil cooler I was seeing oil temps as high as 260 F. And that wasn't even hitting full boost.

mkgarrison5

if you are really hitting that high i would get amsoil. but thats me. PP will hold up but if you SC'd you need to limit your OCI's to 5k tops. or until you get a SERIES of UOA's to prove that whatever you are using is working like you THINK it is.. but you knew that goat!

btw it would be cheaper in the long run if you get your syns on sale and just change it at 5k or less.. again i get my syns from advance auto when they put valvoline synpower on BOGO. they sell 20w50,5w30 and 10w30... that 20w50 with 5w30 mixed would be a great blend for a hot running motor. but thats me. again UOA's will tell everything

mt_goat

It WAS that high, the extra oil cooler brought it down a lot.

mkgarrison5

gotcha

mkgarrison5

here is the latest 3.4 yota UOA. Sampled was Redline 10w30 at 3900 miles. the one before was Valvoline Synpower that was ran 5k miles.. look at the difference.. i am really starting to like my BOGO Valvoline synpower from advance auto. i stock up when they have those sales

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums...gonew=1#UNREAD

TexanTaco

Valvoline Synpower sounds like a good buy. How does M1 compare with Synpower? I still trust the product that Mobil puts out there, but this has got me thinking.

mkgarrison5

[QUOTE=TexanTaco;50834335]Valvoline Synpower sounds like a good buy. How does M1 compare with Synpower? I still trust the product that Mobil puts out there, but this has got me thinking.[/QUOTE

put it this way, i emailed a guy i know that is an expert on this and he used to work for mobil/exxon. he told me that mobil has gone down hill since exxon purchased mobil and that the valvoline durablend (that i enquired about) would show better wear #'s overall in the 5k mile range than M1. his main concern was actually our air filtration. we have really poor air filtration issues with our tacos and runners. as you can tell with the elementary drop in air filters. he told me the only way he would run long oci's (longer than 5k) would be with a squeaky clean air filter.. he went on to say that he wouldnt use M1 when there are so many better choices out there.. he raved about Schaeffers' oil, penzoil, penzoil platinum and nodded amsoil too. i will take his word over anyone else i know on oil hands down.. he was my final decision to drip M1 motor oil and gear oils.. hence the reason why i said in another post that i am switching EVERYTHING over to amsoil except the motor.

--now i am not saying M1 is total garbage bc it isnt. its just not what its cracked up to be.. trust me i was throughly disapointed too, bc i used M1 for everything for over 45k miles

cackalak han

"The mere definition of a synthetic motor oil" has changed since Mobil lost their case with Castol. Since then, the term "synthetic" has been thrown around and whored out.

Pre-99 analysis show good results from M1, but post-00, it shows a dramatic decrease in their performance in both analysis and wear tests. And, no, I do not have absolute concrete evidence that they went from group IV to group III. However, rumors all over the net (not just one, but many many threads about this) PLUS all of these UOA's coming back with sub-par results should clue you in on something (I will get mine back in a couple of weeks). Personally, I will choose an oil that has been proven both in test labs and UOA's to be a true group IV synthetic.

And you are right about Castrol. Even though their german made 0w-30 has been reported to be great oils, I will never use it, because I do not want to support a company that cheapened a product only to fatten their wallets.

Also, another side note. I don't know if any of you have experienced this, but using Mobil1 5w-30, I noticed that the oil consumption has increased quite a bit. Granted, it was in a high-revving engine, but other synthetics I had (RP, RL) hardly had any loss at 3000 miles. With M1, I was a little less than a quart low. In the Tacoma, it was about 1/2 quart @ 4,000 miles.

cackalak han

Stories like this is just further proof that M1 is not what it once used to be.

TexanTaco

I have to agree that does not sound like a very good endorsement for M1, and it would be a shame if they let their product quality slip. I didn't know about the whole Castrol thing either. We have to use a certain type of Castrol Syntec in our Audi A3, it might be the German made stuff. The 2.0T engine in that car is very tough on oil, I need to add at least one quart in between oil changes.

Ok so the big question, if M1 isn't that great anymore and you still want to buy a widely available synthetic oil, would you go with Pennzoil Platinum or Valvoline Synpower?

cackalak han

Yeah, I've heard that 1.8T/2.0T's are very prone to sludge and need quality oil. I believe my friend's M3 gets the german Castrol from the dealership. Don't know about Audi, though. Should say right on the bottle.

I've heard good things about Penn Plat. Haven't heard anything about Valvoline, so I don't know. I bet there is an Amsoil dealer right by you, though. Most of them give you a 10% discount, at least (and if a friend, more). I'd give Amsoil a try, even if you have to mail order. I'm happy with it so far. I changed out the engine oil, filter, both diff's and the transfer case fluid for ~$125.

TexanTaco

Yes the early 1.8T motors for sure had some sludge problems, and so far the 2.0T has proven to be a reliable engine, and it can really hustle. It's a small turbocharged engine so the oil usage isn't a big concern, but it does get expensive.

I will look into Amsoil, I've heard good things from other people as well.

Ohio4R

My toyotashop uses penzoil

95yoda

Off topic kind of...but.

How would you guys who actuallyknow about oil, feel using mobile 1 0w-40 in the 3.4?

It has a very nice range for cold start to high temp.

I have 12 qts and was thinkin of just using it for the 3.4?