RTdawgs

The TrailCarnage plate combo is probably 75#. Also, i have a Warn M8000 winch, another 75# (synthetic rope). So maybe 100-115# more than you? hence the difference...

Bighead

Hell Steve, I like the FrankenSchaefer setup and I can't wait to see it perform in Moab. The Franks, or some OME version of it, is what I am going to move to for my 4Runner and the SAWs will move to my wife's D-Cab Tacoma after I rebuild them. We talked about the front-end weight differences on the phone a few weeks ago and what Frank incarnation I should use. This is a follow-up to that. I'm just trying to figure out what will work for me.

I guess I wasn't clear in my earlier post. I have the same front-end as Ryan with the exception being a different skidplate. I have the T-15/M8000/Synthetic Rope and the Arizona-made skidplate. So any weight difference is in the skidplate.

My initial intent was to go with the original Frankenstrut and see what it gets me. After talking to Steve we thought maybe I should go with a bigger Cornfed spacer on the Franks. Now it looks like the 881s may be the coil to start off with since I have a lot of excess weight in the front-end. But I keep going back to Ryan's measurements. It looks to me like 1.75" works for Ryan because he has that in addition to a 1" body lift. I am trying to find an arrangement that gives me 2" up front without using a body lift.

sschaefer3

The 881 coil can't be used in my setup, the results will be horrid.

So you either have the stock coils with the spacers or the 881 with trim packers and a Revtek.

But an 881 is way too stiff to be used with spacers.

What about a stock tundra V8 coil? There you go.

bamachem

Here's my take on things:

882's and N91's up front and 891's and N86's. No conical bumpstops. These were on Brian's runner for about 5-7k miles and he had an ARB and M8000 w/ steel cable. On my runner, the bottom of the Limited flares measured from the ground thru the center of the wheels was at 37" on all four corners w/ 16" wheels and 285/75 MT/R's w/ 1/2" of tread left. Needless to say, it was a firm ride. I rubbed on the pinch weld any time I was on my brakes in a mild turn (i.e. front dipped). This meant that I got LESS than 2" of lift up front and a overly STIFF ride to boot.

Yesterday, we got my old setup back on... ahhhhh, much better. It's Tundra V8 coils with a 2.5" Cornfed spacer and Bilstein HD struts up front (fat and RED - not skinny and yellow). In the rear I have Downey 3.5"/2.5" Coils, new OME N86's, conical bumpstops, and a 10mm OME trimpacker on the driver side. I now have a much nicer, much smoother on-street ride - but slightly less "controlled". I now have 37.5" at all 4 corners measured in the same places. I NO LONGER have any rubbing on the street in any condition. double

Now, it's time for to get the syn line on the M8000 and get it mounted w/ the BL

azrain

I doubt I'll die, but it sure seems that way sometimes. Figger it this way, you know me and how stubborn I am, think about my poor wife and kids, LOL!

Spacers, there has got to be a cleaner way, I figure there is enough talent and experience to iron this thing out once and for all... As far as giving secrets away, sometimes it's done for the better of the community, sometimes you make beer money out of it.

Mike

sschaefer3

True, you gave some great imput to the new spacer as well. I think that really what I like is the stock coil. So I and Andy have built off of those, they are well japaneese made springs.

I totally agree that a 2" stock like spring can be out there, we just need someone to learn to speak Japaneese.

Bighead

Has anyone tried a 2" Cornfed with the Franks? I know we talked about it Steve but I don't remember if you said someone has tried it.

sschaefer3

Yes, Mark Fit here in AZ has. It worked fine for him, but to truly keep all the flex that the original design has I would try a Tundra coil with the 1.5" and .5" spacers.

Your super charger and winch would equal the added wight of the V8 I bet.

Ritchie

SC4Runner,

I installed the Daystar 1" spacer kit on my Tacoma w/Bilsteins that replaced OEM. I got an 1 5/8" of overall lift.

I do believe that wheelbase length has lot to do with the amount you receive.

For instance, I have a regular cab '03 pre-runner w/shortbed, and my buddy has an '02 extended cab with the same set up. Both have the 2.7 4 banger and auto trans. My truck is a bit higher in front than his. Not much, but noticeable.

Just my 2 cents.

I hope this might have helped.

sschaefer3

Ok, Lance, I had a long conversation with Andy on the phone. We have your perfect solution.

I have a 4Cyl engine and run the V6 coil. You have a V6 engine and should run the Stock Tundra V8 coils with the EXACT spacers for the Frankenstein formula. The weight difference between the V6 and V8 will more than compensate for any weigth gain you have. Just like it has done for me with the V6 coils.

Contact your parts guy and order up a set of 4WD Tundra V8 coils. They are the same as the 4Runner coils but a slightly higher spring rate, BUT not as high as the 881. Which is a good thing.

This would also be a good cure for Nevitt's sore buns. Or a set of custom Japaneese made coils.

I'll look into this more but basically this IS THE WINNER !

bamachem

Here's some pics of the front that I dug up. The Tundra coils are the same diameter as the 4Runner coils, but are about 75# per inch heavier in spring rate. From what I could tell, they are about the same hieght, so just slightly stiffer. I have Tundra Bilstein Heavy Duty Struts. I added the Cornfed spacer on top so that it would bolt up on my runner and get the 2.5" of lift. I'll probally eventually go to a 1.75 or 2" spacer up front w/ a revtek topout spacer, but that's for another day. These are PRE-Diff-Drop install. Also notice how NICE AND FAT the HD Bilsteins are compared to the regular Yellow SKINNY ones. Slightly skinnier than the OME N91s and the top boot will still work w/ the cornfed spacer too.





And for size comparison, here's the 882's and the OME N91s on my rig:

bamachem

I've been running this setup since Jan of this year.

https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f2/got-my-lift-installed-24389/

No sag. No problems. Love the ride. I had OME 882's on for about 2 miles when I started second guessing the decision to swap over. By the time I drove the 50 miles home from Brian's, I was regretting it. Within 48 hours, I was offering to BUY my old setup back. He was nice enough to just swap it back for the OME stuff. He ended up making more money off the OME stuff anyway. I got my junk back on and now I'm happy again.

I had been exposed to all the hype about OME this and OME that over the years and I just fell victim to it. It works for some people. It didn't work for me.

waskillywabbit

iTrader: (-1)

You dirt poser street queen!

bamachem

you like using that name alot, don't you junior?

have any of you ever compared a pic of Brian and one of Schaefer? Lol... long lost brothers!!!

i don't see how you stuffed anything on the trails as stiff as it was. I know you rubbed at tellico, it amazes me that w/ 2" of BL you got it to rub w/ the heavy spring rate. i'd hate to know what the saws feel like w/ 675# per inch. uff. the suspension is there for a reason - to flex, not to beat the ever-living chit outta ya on the road and give you a sore back after only 50 miles. it felt like i had the diffs welded straight to the frame compared to the other setup.

now that it's SOLD i can post how i REALLY feel.

RTdawgs

i agree with this, however...

[noted, keep reading...]

And now to the fun part.

Stock 4Runner 99/00 16" 4WD coils: 420#
Stock Tundra V8 coils: 420 + 75 = 495#
OME 880/881/882 coils: 500#

So steve, OMEs are too stiff but V8 tundra coils are "perfect"?

Do you know the lengths of the 4Runner and Tundra coils? i would like to compare the lengths to the OMEs.

RTdawgs

i said the same thing after i met Brian at Tellico.

The OMEs are built for Toyotas that carry lots of auxillary weight. Higher spring rates are better for heavier vehicles. You missed how well Marc Zabboths's 882s and Paul Lifshiz'z 882s flex. they both carry ARBs and Warns.

The SAWs are on 2" shocks rather than 2.5" Toy & OME shocks.

bamachem

I'm seat-of-the-pants estimating the 75# rate difference and from what I've read on the tundra forums, it's in the 475# range. I thought the OEM runner rates were in the 400# range. I think what steve is getting at is the OEM Tundra/4Runner springs don't SAG while the OME spring do, along w/ being a touch softer.

sschaefer3

Very true and this is all speculation. I'm guess in that they are alot less than 495.

Andy said the difference between the Tundra and the Old Man Emu was night and day, 5 pounds is not even noticeable.

Some one needs to do it and I need to see it in real life. Maybe I'll pickup a set of Tundra coils and try them out. Not any time soon though.

bamachem

The difference b/w the OEM 4Runner coils w/ OEM black struts and the 882's w/ N91s is like comparing marshmellows to bricks. The tundra v8 coils w/ the bilstein HD's and the 2.5" cornfed on top is right in between. Stiffer than stock, but still flexes and soaks up bumps on the road. Only difference in my rig and a stock runner as far as weight goes is negligible when you compare the arb sahara to the OEM bumper and crush bar. Remember, this bumper doesn't have the thick STEEL tubing around the grill and headlights. It has the bolt-on chrome hoop that weighs maybe 20-25# and the IPF lights. The steel is the same gauge as the ARB Bullbar, but it just doesn't have the welded-on hoops.

Does toyota have the coil rate info on their springs or would that have to be measured?

sschaefer3

The only way we know what the stock coil is rated at is that the Downey coil over install sheet lables it as 420.

Now the 4cyl 4WD and the V6 4WD are really really close. I'm willing to be 405 and 420. So I'm also willing to be the Tundra coils are around 440. Hence the difference between the 500 Old Man Emu, I'm not also sure where that number came from.

I say Lance (Bighead) builds it and I will check it out in Moab.

OK?